Anne Boleyn as a black woman

[Frustratedbeyondbelief]

Am anyone explain why ? I know this question raises the issue of race which is highly controversial. It is not meant to be goady.. just perplexed by what they are trying to achieve. To me like playing GHandi and Martin Luther King as while men..

For context I hope my non racial credentials as a mother of mixed race children assist in not seeing this as an 'anti black' thread ... I genuinely would like to be educated as to why this is thought to be a 'good thing' when simply factually incorrect . ? Her home at Hever is less than a mile away, I have never had any idea she was black or mixed race. Just seems a bit 'trendy' ...

What is this evidence that she was mixed race? Genuinely interested as I’ve read a lot about the period but haven’t come across that. Can someone point me to it please? Extremely interesting. I agree that there were a lot of people whose race was not properly acknowledged historically.

Yes, it is just acting but say a film came out about MLK with him being a white man and his oppressors being black. It would not happen.

Anne Boleyn was a real person. A white woman. Therefore, she should be portrayed as such.

@GrumpyHoonMain I just had a thought! So if Anne Boleyn was mixed race, then so was Queen Elizabeth the 1st and therefore the rest of the royal family?

I'm not bothered by it. To me its not as if this is the first time she has been portrayed on screen, its been done dozens of times if not more so why not have a black woman playing her. Her story is so well know, there's been faithful adaptions of her life and ones that have embellished the truth for extra storytelling. None of them will be anywhere near what she was really like or how she really looked so why not have a black actor and do something different. If she's a good actress I think that's all that matters.

@Unreasonabubble - as Queen Elizabeth I was an only child and died childless I doubt anyone else in the royal family was mixed race...

It’s not actually the real Anne Boleyn.

It’s an actress pretending to be a fictionalised version of her.

Whether her skin tone, hair colour, height, weight or shoe size is the same as the actual Anne Boleyn is irrelevant to the story.

Mmmm... I guess colour-blind casting works for me. It's fine. Race wasn't part of AB's story. It's not denying reality.

And sometimes when race is part of the story, it still doesn't undermine the truths in the story (eg., Hamilton )

@LondonJax OMG never thought of that! Mind you, maybe that's the reason why Elizabeth the 1st was always covered in white powder? The powder that finally killed her.

I agree. I would rather have more films and shows about minorities, than try to shoehorn them into historical films.

Perhaps @GrumpyHoonMain can provide this evidence of AB’s racial origins? Having considered it, I don’t think it’s a problem if it’s colour blind casting. Go with the best actor for the job. I get that. But if it’s making an assertion about the nature of AB’s identity then I think we should be given the evidence for that up front.

AB story isn't about race because she wasn't black. If she had been her story absolutely would have been about race. Are we going to say sex doesn't matter next? I mean can anyone play anyone? Shall we have white women playing black men? It seems to try and convey the message that race doesn't matter when we all know race absolutely does shape a persons experience.

She is widely believed to be mixed race. Her skin, as described by her physician, was ‘mulatto’ and ‘sallow’ was used a lot too - both of those words were used for mixed race people in those days

Absolute rubbish. 'Widely believed' by who?

I have read her skin was described as "sallow" but bit of a leap from there to say she was mixed race. Also, she needs to be goggle eyed:)

If you look at contemporary portraits of Anne Boleyn, she was plainly white.

Bridgerton and David Copperfield are fiction. Cast who you like. But when there's a fuss about the actress cast as Nina Simone not being black enough, it seems pretty strange that casting Anne Boleyn as the wrong race entirely is something we're expected to be really happy with.

How could AB possibly have been mixed race? She was from a noble English family. We know her family tree. She is described as having a fairly dark completion and dark eyes. I’m not bothered by the race of the actor. I think ‘colour blind’ casting is good if it opens up more roles to actors. I don’t think it’s the same as a white person playing a famous black historical figure because of the imbalance in numbers alone. There must be thousands of white historical figures vs. Not many POC.

There are so many brilliant other black women in history whom this fabulous actor could have been cast in AND made a brilliant production because it was authentically correct.

Well the issue with this is that those films/programmes never get made! The same for many women in history, their stories are never told. Until they are, let anyone play the women the “money men” insist programmes are made about.

It's changing historical fact and making it a drama more than a documentary. If it's viewed that way then no problem, but if it's seen as fact then it is.

Thing is there was a black Tudor so I don't understand why that story hasn't been dramatised!

Well there are thousands of historical figures who aren’t white as well. That said, I stand by my point above, this isn’t actually a documentary anyway if I remember correctly it is going to be for entertainment purposes. Theatre does this all the time and it works just fine. She is such a well known figure, no one is going to be going round going ‘oh AB was black’ on the back of this. It might peak someone’s interest then they will go and do some reading. This only matters if the storyline decides to discuss her race, in which case it’s valid to say she wasn’t black but if we are going to see the same story we’ve seen before in a drama then it doesn’t matter. It may as well be treated as fiction.

(I’d also like to see the research re: her being mixed race - I’m a historian but not an early modern one and colleagues I mentioned this to before said the evidence is not really substantial enough to make the claim, but happy to read something peer reviewed that may suggest otherwise).

@Lottiethelemming

Also OP, don't ever try and explain yourself by declaring you have mixed children. It means fuck all to those that insist on pulling this shit.

This honestly really upsets me. If you are not racist, you NEVER need to make an excuse for a valid opinion.

Thank you.. I am sorry that today's climate makes me feel like I do need to justify it.. despite 18yrs of marriage to a non white dh.. 15 years in a non white country... the ONLY people I really feel comfortable discussing rave issues with are my mixed race children! ...

Black Tudors has been optioned and is in development I believe. Now, that I am looking forward to.

I assumed it was as a nod to the outrage some people had to Megan Markle. The sheer disruption caused to court life by Henry marrying someone else while C of A was still alive. A woman who was not "pure" and called a whore and who did as she pleased and put a lot of noses out of joint.
If people weren't especially bothered that Jonathan Rhys Meyers who is distinctly not gingery and didn't dye his hair or have a ginger wig and beard (which is important because that was how Elizabeth I showed she was her daughter) then why is it so different to cast a black woman?

You are right, nobody should play any part unless they are 100 % the same, race, age height, shoe size, dress size, zodiac sign or religion etc. I think the only person who could possibly play Anne Bolelyn is Anne Bolelyn herself. Well, as this is impossible why don't we just get an actress to play the role, I hear her DNA twin was unavailable.

There must be thousands of white historical figures vs. Not many POC.

Just want to clarify that I mean in terms of acting roles, not IRL!

She is such a well known figure, no one is going to be going round going ‘oh AB was black’ on the back of this

No one? It's not even out yet and someone on this thread has already tried to say that AB was mixed race.

People are stupid. I saw a Tiktok the other day where someone, in all seriousness, said that Irish Leprechauns were originally African Pygmies who were driven out of Ireland by St Patrick.

@Fruityfriday

If a white man was cast to play Muhammad Ali there would be uproar

Precisely. Double standards by the ultra woke brigade.