Anne Boleyn as a black woman

[Frustratedbeyondbelief]

Am anyone explain why ? I know this question raises the issue of race which is highly controversial. It is not meant to be goady.. just perplexed by what they are trying to achieve. To me like playing GHandi and Martin Luther King as while men..

For context I hope my non racial credentials as a mother of mixed race children assist in not seeing this as an 'anti black' thread ... I genuinely would like to be educated as to why this is thought to be a 'good thing' when simply factually incorrect . ? Her home at Hever is less than a mile away, I have never had any idea she was black or mixed race. Just seems a bit 'trendy' ...

And does race really not have anything at all to do with ABs story? Like it or not, if she were black she wouldn't have married the king in the first place so it's actually not irrelevant at all that she was white. Hair colour etc... aren't comparable. During that time period, a black woman would not have married the King of England.

@IntermittentParps

Schadenfreude (and I'm sorry all; derail), I'm interested to hear why you wouldn't be OK with a female Bond? (hope that doesn't sound snarky; it's a genuine question!)

I don't know - I honestly can't justify it in these days of equality etc, but it just wouldn't sit right with me. I've tried to put my finger on it, but can't.

Maybe because the smaller female liver couldn't cope with all of those martinis; maybe because James Bond so often uses women to get close to the villains he's tracking (not to say that Jane Bond couldn't "bond" over a stitch'n'bitch session ). Or maybe I am an unwitting pawn of the patriarchy.

However, I would be happy with another "00" spy, a woman, but not called Bond or assuming the 007 mantle. I know - How ridiculous is that?

Oh - and you didn't sound snarky at all Parps

Oh - and you didn't sound snarky at all Parps
Thank God! Talk forums are tone-deaf as a medium

Thanks for explaining. I guess it's a compliment to the foregoing actors/produces/directors/crew in general that they've created a character so believable as what he is –and as a 'he' –that it just doesn't feel right to you to think of him changing gender.

I have to say I do think in some ways him being a man works better – the chance to admire the suits, the fact that he can be suave and urbane one moment but then rough someone up (Sean C, RIP, was the best at capturing this quality).
But I'd actually love to see a female Bond. I think it'd confuse the hell out of his enemies, who'd be looking out for a bloke.
She'd be able to drink all the men under the table, as many RL women can; and how intriguing is the idea of her using the villain's men to get close to the villain? And I'd love to watch Bond at a stitch'n'bitch session too. Not to mention glitzy fundraisers hosted by the villains' women. As a woman she could infiltrate all these things that a male Bond can't.

Have I convinced you?

I really just don’t see the point of it. I thought the point of historical dramas & historical novels was to, at least more or less, depict the facts in an entertaining way, sort of learning made easy.
The aim of this just seems to be to shock & give all the people interested in Tudor history high blood pressure.

Really silly and creates further division when it’s really not needed at the moment.

The cynical part of me also thinks it’s to get people talking about the programme... so trying to present itself as ‘right on’ yet it’s actually about creating a buzz around the show and getting people to watch for the wrong reasons. Pretty low using race in this way in the current climate too if so.

Indeed fidget.

And aye. Blood pressure is spiking darklane

@IntermittentParps

Oh - and you didn't sound snarky at all Parps Thank God! Talk forums are tone-deaf as a medium

Thanks for explaining. I guess it's a compliment to the foregoing actors/produces/directors/crew in general that they've created a character so believable as what he is –and as a 'he' –that it just doesn't feel right to you to think of him changing gender.

I have to say I do think in some ways him being a man works better – the chance to admire the suits, the fact that he can be suave and urbane one moment but then rough someone up (Sean C, RIP, was the best at capturing this quality).
But I'd actually love to see a female Bond. I think it'd confuse the hell out of his enemies, who'd be looking out for a bloke.
She'd be able to drink all the men under the table, as many RL women can; and how intriguing is the idea of her using the villain's men to get close to the villain? And I'd love to watch Bond at a stitch'n'bitch session too. Not to mention glitzy fundraisers hosted by the villains' women. As a woman she could infiltrate all these things that a male Bond can't.

Have I convinced you?

Nope - Sorry!

She can be 008, Jane Bund, Bond's equally, if not more, dangerous female counterpart, infiltrating everything from international arms-smuggling rings to WI embroidery circles with equal aplomb - but no, she can leave James as James, thank you very much.

I remain loyal.

I haven't watched it because I think the Anne Boleyn story has been done to death. I'm so so bored of it! I wish they'd picked another historical figure...

Watched the first part and have other two recorded on my planner.
Will be hitting delete and not wasting anymore of my time on this shit!

You have made a wise decision slub

The story of Anne Boleyn is hugely interesting to me. This was not.

Next up, Kermit the frog playing Bloody Mary.

Which, frankly, I’d like to see a programme on. As long as this shower don’t write it.

Also just whilst we're on the subject of Tudor misconceptions:
Henry wasn't always fat. He was considered very attractive in his youth.
Catherine of Aragon was a ginger with an English rose complexion, due to her royal heritage not a dark haired Spanish beauty.
Anne Boleyn didn't have an extra finger, these and other character assassination attempts were made years after her death.
Richard III didn't have a hunchback. His skeleton was found to have a slight curve in his spine that caused him little trouble.
Anne wasn't Henry's only intelligent wife, Catherine Parr was clever enough not only to publish her own book, but to talk Henry out of executing her when her enemies conspired against her.
Catherine Howard didn't have a physical affair. An impossibility for someone of her rank in those days. She had a plutonic friendship with Culpepper, who had a dubious reputation for forcing himself on ladies.
Anne didn't have an affair either. The allegations against her are accepted by most competent historians as fictional inventions to bring her down.

And Anne, definitely wasn't black, but if people's only frame of reference is this series in a few years it could become as "common knowledge" as the above.

I said to DH that doing this story through Anne's eyes would be really interesting if it was well written, well produced and well cast - the sort of thing that the BBC used to do really well.

Unfortunately this wasn't it.

@SunnydaleClassProtector99

Also just whilst we're on the subject of Tudor misconceptions: Henry wasn't always fat. He was considered very attractive in his youth. Catherine of Aragon was a ginger with an English rose complexion, due to her royal heritage not a dark haired Spanish beauty. Anne Boleyn didn't have an extra finger, these and other character assassination attempts were made years after her death. Richard III didn't have a hunchback. His skeleton was found to have a slight curve in his spine that caused him little trouble. Anne wasn't Henry's only intelligent wife, Catherine Parr was clever enough not only to publish her own book, but to talk Henry out of executing her when her enemies conspired against her. Catherine Howard didn't have a physical affair. An impossibility for someone of her rank in those days. She had a plutonic friendship with Culpepper, who had a dubious reputation for forcing himself on ladies. Anne didn't have an affair either. The allegations against her are accepted by most competent historians as fictional inventions to bring her down.

And Anne, definitely wasn't black, but if people's only frame of reference is this series in a few years it could become as "common knowledge" as the above.

Henry was indeed good-looking - "the most handsome Prince in Christendom" according to one foreign envoy (though I forget who)

Catherine was red-headed, as was Mary Tudor - but Mary was a much darker red than Elizabeth

All of the other bits are right, too.

And to them I would add that many, if not most, serious historians believe that Henry wasn't knocked unconscious/nearly killed at a joust - there were no contemporary records of it, and there would have been. The French Ambassador didn't mention it except to say that Henry and his horse had gone down, and miraculously both were unharmed.

Henry had set his sights on another (unnamed) young lady and was planning to get rid of Catherine Parr (for the 2nd time), but happily died before he could sign the documents.

I have no idea what my ancestors looked like a few hundred years ago but I have seen the very famous portrait of Anne Boleyn wearing her pearl necklace with a B on.

I’m not white and though this is a forum and not any kind of serious tome I really detest the term people of colour, I’m just a bloody person. I can see the sort of good intentions behind pushing forward actors that are not white but when it’s a historical figure that actually existed it seems daft.

Henry had set his sights on another (unnamed) young lady and was planning to get rid of Catherine Parr (for the 2nd time), but happily died before he could sign the documents.
What a prince.
I do think he was almost certainly a psychopath. He fits the mould quite well...

Yes Sunny.

Many people think that is personality changed after his "loss of consciousness" when he fell from his horse, and that thee was serious brain damage (possibly frontal lobe damage?), however, historical documents don't confirm a bad fall, and examination of the skeleton doesn't not any skull fractures etc as far as I am aware.

I think he was just a spoiled, cosseted brat who turned into a siloed cosseted adult. Nobody had ever really said "No" to him, and he didn't like it when he couldn't haves own way. He had the gift of being able to make a U-turn without ever seeing that he'd even done it , so if he changed his mind from A to B, then he had always thought B, and anyone who suggested otherwise was lying, because he, Henry, was never wrong. I think a lot of us have met people like that.

Full blown psycho, and particularly dangerous as he wielded almost all of the power.