Mother of God: Line of Duty thread 5 - **MNHQ edit**; "We are obliged to warn you that any spoilers will be taken down and used against you. No spoilers, even upcoming characters, please, in the name of the wee man. (aka Steve Arnott)

[IstandwithJackieWeaver]

Hope no one minds me starting a new thread as 4 was filled on one episode.

Ted has been the police so long that they won't necessarily have his DNA on file from him joining. He was arrested and interviewed last series so his DNA may be on the nominal database from then.

It's probably Jimmy Lakewell.
There's a theory out there that he's Jo's birth brother.
The OCG know this & were using this fact to blackmail Jo as in drop the Vella case & Jimmy stays safe in prison.
But he didn't stay safe hence Jo's expression when she found out Jimmy was dead.
Simple but does make sense

It could still be a police officer, if he had been nicked and dna taken for something (Dryden, Fairfield, Dot (he was arrested, so his dna might have been transferred from the police database?) vice copper Lyndsey crushed etc) or had fake crimes on the record, (like Corbett)

Are dead police officers on the normal police database? Iirc Corbett wasn't on the standard one as he was undercover.

I'm wondering if the DNA relates a someone AC12 know but we haven't yet been introduced to?

My gut instinct while I was watching it was Tommy Hunter. But then I thought you obvious?
The only other things are either
Jo isn't Jo or
DNA is someone we don't know yet but they do or
It's someone off the list
So basically I haven't got a Scooby!

@PomLikeTheBattle

Still musing the dna. Jo either related to Jimmy lakewell or Ryan’s bio mum - which could explain some of his aggression. Crap mum was foster mum (either was initially good and passed checks or ocg placed with her with the help of the Hargreaves social worker). But not sure Ryan’s dna would be nominal??

Do think Ryan’s parents connected some way.

Ryan's mum couldn't have been a foster carer. The police office got Ryan out of there and into foster care. Jo is at least 20 years older than Ryan so even if there had been some connection through fostering (jo's mum fostered Ryan?) it wouldn't have impacted on Jo. Also she's a blood relative - she won't be a blood relative of Ryan. I really can't see that.

@ceeveebee

I really don’t think it will be anything to do with Ryan as he’s not a nominal, and also as he’s only recently joined the police would his DNA have been checked against the databases as part of the vetting process?

Yes. Nobody suspects Ryan apart from ac-12 and Kate.

@PeskyRooksRGT

My gut instinct while I was watching it was Tommy Hunter. But then I thought you obvious? The only other things are either Jo isn't Jo or DNA is someone we don't know yet but they do or It's someone off the list So basically I haven't got a Scooby!

Hunter and Jo are both Scottish of course and similar ages so could be siblings. There is no way Jo doesn't know about this connection though - it must be connected to why she's working for OCH

G

I thought you wrote OCH on purpose @MazekeenSmith because of the Scottish connection!

@PeskyRooksRGT

I thought you wrote OCH on purpose *@MazekeenSmith* because of the Scottish connection!

Ha No I'm not that smart

The point Steve made just before he handed the file over to Ted is significant. He said they didn’t run new officers DNA against the database for matches when Jo joined. Implying, or outright saying, the DNA was there 20 years ago and the match would have been alarming enough to raise flags.

That blows the Lakewell theory. Because being related to a solicitor isn’t an issue. Also if they were threatening her with Lakewells safety, why kill him?

It also blows Corbett, he would have been in there as a PC at that time or not at all if he hadn’t joined. His dna was removed years later when he was undercover. Also not really a red flag 🚩

Terry Boyle would not be alarming 20 years ago. Nor would a relationship to the Lavertys, Ryan’s mum,Denton, Bigglelow, Ted, Osborne or Dryden.

Hunter, if he was on police radar at that time, would be alarming. Because she failed to disclose it. But I still think she could have spun a story of family alienation to explain it all even 20 years on. There either are or aren’t birth records to show the connection. Which would be found in a background check. This implies there are no records connecting them. Easy enough to deny the relationship was known or close.

Doesn’t leave us with much. Except Hunter and that she not only didn’t disclose it but fundamentally lied about her background and identity. That’s something she couldn’t wriggle out of and would be serious.

@TracyBeakerSoYeah

It's probably Jimmy Lakewell. There's a theory out there that he's Jo's birth brother. The OCG know this & were using this fact to blackmail Jo as in drop the Vella case & Jimmy stays safe in prison. But he didn't stay safe hence Jo's expression when she found out Jimmy was dead. Simple but does make sense

Can’t see it being Lakewell. If she cared about Lakewell’s safety enough to be blackmailed over it, then she would have reacted a bit more emotionally to the news - not just ask for cause of death but more breaking down in tears etc?

Lakewell would make no sense because of Chloe’s reaction - she was confused by it and didn’t get what it meant. If it had been Lakewell I would expect a different reaction.

Can’t be Ryan - his juvenile record was expunged, which is how he became a police officer.

I don’t believe that Steve’s comments mean it’s definitely someone who was on there when she joined, I think that was just a way to explain why it hasn’t been done previously.

Boyle would make sense for the blackmail and Ted’s reaction but not much else.

If it’s someone we’ve never heard of them Jed will piss off an awful lot of people.

Which brings me back to Andrew Laverty. It would be the smartest play and bring us back to S1 - they have kept Jackie in the plot all the way through, maybe this is why?

It’s far fetched, but avoids many of the issues with the other possible suspects.

Also can’t be Lakewell as they’d have no power over Jo if he was the collateral and they killed him off

Hmm which also means it can’t be Terry as he should have been dead by now if Ryan had done what he was supposed to...

I’’be just realised how negative, only saying who it can’t be!!
I think it is going to be the obvious, Tommy Hunter.

Agreed.

Can’t tell whether there’s been cheating/poor writing somewhere or whether they’ve managed to conceal a perfect suspect that makes sense.

Guess we will find out tomorrow! Anyone I can think of besides Laverty has some element that goes against what was said about the match, or the previous plot makes no sense with this information. He will have to pull a blinder for it not to be a big disappointment. If it’s anything like that Dot identification from S5 I will be highly annoyed.

Hunter would be the obvious but I can’t see how it would fit into them blackmailing her - surely more likely a relative of Hunter’s would be a willing participant in the OCG than what’s happening with Jo?

I even went back to check that it was definitely her typing the “I’m finished” type messages in case she was actually the one getting them, but no it definitely was her.

I’m not ruling out a Ryan connection. Foster care checks were not as vigorous 20 years ago, co could have been fostered then removed to new care or the initial arrangement was casual and not through social services but agree it doesn’t really fit with timelines.
Why was Ryan picked by ocg over others to be key?

Good point, and actually it’s probably more likely to be someone who is still alive so that they could blackmail her (and so they can bring the actor back in!)

@PomLikeTheBattle

I’m not ruling out a Ryan connection. Foster care checks were not as vigorous 20 years ago, co could have been fostered then removed to new care or the initial arrangement was casual and not through social services but agree it doesn’t really fit with timelines. Why was Ryan picked by ocg over others to be key?

He was in foster care ten years ago. Arnott said that the police officer (the one who gave him his number) got him INTO care (ie out of his neglectful home). I guarantee it's impossible for a foster carer to neglect a child like that and get away with it. She was his mum, he was removed from her care.

Tommy Hunter may or may not have been a criminal in the database back in 1999, but he was not known as senior OCG then (they were trying to identify him in S1, and knew of a 'Tommy' by the time Kate interviewed Ryan, but they hadn't fully identified him). So would it have been a problem back then then?

Establishing she was related to someone who joined same year, in a way that meant she must have given false identity information on joining, would have been a problem back at that point

Just my suggestion @MazekeenSmith

I have knowledge of the care system - checks and follow were at times pretty crap years ago (work in an associated area).
I just think there’s more to the Ryan link,

it was definitely her typing the “I’m finished” type messages in case she was actually the one getting them, but no it definitely was her

Does 'I'm finished' mean 'I quit' or 'the game's up'?