Allen vs Farrow

[supercee]

I've just binged the lot although episode 1 appeared to be missing? Anyone else watched this?

@RickiTarr

He has clearly fiddled the dates too, to make it sound as though she was in college before the liaison began. It was a full throttled media spin attempt and it succeeded in blurring the facts.

This is from the legal hearing over custody of Moses, Dylan & Ronan (then called Satchel) in May 94. It’s a very interesting read. Which dates do you think are fiddled? www.leagle.com/decision/1994524197ad2d3271461

Watch the documentary @GiantKitten
Or don’t. I don’t care.

I’m certainly not going to retry the case on the Telly Addicts board with weird links and endless entrenched rhetoric.

Fascinating how some people are absolutely determined to believe in the innocence of Allen, Polanski, Cosby, Jackson et al, though. That phenomenon is also covered in the programme. Very interesting.

@RickiTarr
You think the documentary is the definitive decisive proof of what really happened?
Right.

I think it’s really thorough and illuminates a lot of the confusion. Which is good film making because it’s 3-4 hours of film to untangle 30 years of spin, legal cases and conflicting information.

Fascinating how some people are absolutely determined to believe in the innocence of Allen, Polanski, Cosby, Jackson et al, though
Please don't lump these people together. It's not meaningful. Polanski and Cosby were charged, tried and sentenced (obviously Polanski continues to evade his sentence). Woody Allen was investigated twice, nothing was found and he has never even been charged.

I think you only have to look at the subject matter or nearly all of his films (young girls having sex with older men and him attempted to show it was ‘their fault’, the man can’t help it) to draw your own conclusions. Some comments on here and the fact he is still respected just shows how much we needed #metoo....and what a long way we still have to go.

I've not watched it as can't access those channels but Hadley Freeman makes the case for Woody Allen

Not convinced I would go along with Freeman's analysis either tbh. I'm still unsure

Hadley Freeman seems very convinced of Allen's innocence, not exactly a balanced article. But the documentary is also very one sided, saintly Mia and her many, many excuses for ignoring the early warning signs and not protecting Dylan. If all your friends and family are noticing inappropriate behaviour then why just send Woody to a therapist and hope for the best?

I do believe Dylan but I feel she has been overwhelmed by Mia and Ronan's big personalities. Woody's relationship with Soon-Yi was totally inappropriate and must have been a result of grooming. That is a big problem, whether you believe Dylan or not.

The documentary should have been more investigative and less emotional. Less soft focus Mia and idyllic childhood videos as it feels manipulative.

As a child, Ronan looks a lot like Woody - the same shaped face. I suspect Ronan has had a DNA test but just enjoys playing with the public.

Hadley Freeman seems very convinced of Allen's innocence, not exactly a balanced article

It's not meant to be balanced. She did another article, based on extensive research and an interview with Allen. It's on the Guardian website. She's s smart woman and a feminist and believes Allen based on what she's learned.

I have no view. He's a creepy fucker but that doesn't make him a child abuser.

I'm a smart woman, and a feminist. His relationship with Soon-Yi was wrong, despite Hadley pointing out that he was never actually her stepfather. That doesn't make it okay.

I can see why people refuse to believe he abused Dylan. I can see why some people think Mia wants revenge. Dylan as an adult seems fragile and damaged, Woody was in a position of power over Soon-Yi. The rest of us can argue it out forever but these are the facts.

The rest of us can argue it out forever but these are the facts.

The facts have been investigated twice and Allen was never charged.

I believe Dylan. 100 percent.
Also thought it was interesting about his films all having the older man and young (very) females in a relationship.
The pornographic photos in his apartment
Dylan never changed her story
Moses is on his fathers payroll for sure
The whole story will come out when woody dies

I haven't seen this documentary, and I'm not likely to, as we don't have Sky. I've read several of the articles linked, though.

If Allen is a serial abuser, given the enormous amount of publicity there's been around all of this, why haven't there been other allegations of misconduct? That's one of the things that makes me very doubtful about Mia Farrow's narrative.

Very messed up family all round.

The facts have been investigated twice and Allen was never charged.

There are many forms of abuse, some of which an investigation will not be able to find evidence of. WA also passed a lie detector test but these are now generally thought of as meaningless.

There are many forms of abuse, some of which an investigation will not be able to find evidence of.

Indeed there are. Brainwashing being one of them. I wonder how Mia Farrow reconciles supporting two child rapists with supporting her daughter who she alleges was sexually abused as a child?

Moses is on his fathers payroll for sure

Yes that was what I took from it. That seemed an inescapable conclusion, yet the film makers were quite restrained and didn’t suggest it.

If Allen is a serial abuser, given the enormous amount of publicity there's been around all of this, why haven't there been other allegations of misconduct?

There have been, of a hebephilic nature. The one featured in the documentary seemed to be the inspiration for the film “Manhattan” and she has spoken at length, several times, about how at the time she get it was a real relationship because of how the grooming was done.

The facts have been investigated twice and Allen was never charged.

The detectives at the time established they had “probable cause” which is a hurdle to charging a suspect we don’t have in the UK and is therefore harder to meet. What stopped the criminal prosecution was the fragility of Dylan if she were put on the stand as the main State’s witness.

She was 7 then.

I was convinced that Sinatra was Ronan's father until I saw this documentary. Mia's father John farrow looked very like Ronan.

I think if Frank Sinatra didn't exist, we would see only a resemblance to Mia. But, as so many photos show, Ronan looks like Frank. Not ust the eyes, but the nose and mouth too.

Also Ronan Farrow seems to have dyed his hair blonde. I think he quite enjoys the Sinatra speculation.

I think it's strange that Ronan and Mia allow the Sinatra speculation to continue. I find them both a bit odd. Mia Farrow's breathy, ethereal earth mother manner is quite strange and the whole family set up seems dysfunctional and not at all conducive to a happy childhood, even leaving aside what happened with Woody Allen.

However, anybody who watches all the episodes of the documentary would surely have to agree that Woody Allen has a truly dreadful idea of women. I find it utterly weird that he and his defenders argue that it was fine because he wasn't really Soon Yi's father and that he and Mia didn't live together. That line of argument shows a total misunderstanding of what abuse is. The formal details are not at all relevant. The fact is that he abused his position of power.

Who would want to have a relationship with their partner's daughter? Who wouldn't be ashamed and embarrassed?

Also Ronan Farrow seems to have dyed his hair blonde. I think he quite enjoys the Sinatra speculation.

I don’t think so. He ha most often been bright blond since he was a toddler. He may have that type of hair that darkens in winter and naturally bleaches out completely in the summer.

Plus he was extremely quick to ramp down the speculation when his mother first ignited it. Probably at least partly because he realised it give WA more ammunition to fire at his mother.

I would like to see a photo of Ronan before the nose job as he might look a bit more like Woody. I feel he plays up the Sinatra paternity question as he enjoys winding Woody up, and who can blame him?