GoT is actually disgusting, isn't it?

[Miljah]

In what way can it be described as 'entertainment'?

I seriously, don't understand why people happily sit down to watch the carnage, the immolation, the screaming children.

What is wrong with people?

Isn’t there a bit of dissonance between “it’s based in medieval times hence the violence is historically accurate” and “all the strongest characters are women”? On and dragons?

Well I haven't argued that all the strongest characters are women. Because they arent.

However, I cant believe I would have to explain on every post I make that Got is largely based on medieval times, with the exception of the dragons.

I would imagine anyone with any sense would understand the difference between 'based on' and 'entirely accurate presentation of'. They would also understand the dragons are the fantasy bit.

Bollocks. Lots of articles online about why “becomes strong women through sexual trauma” storylines like this one are bullshit.

Hmmm no one said it was through the tape exclusively. I pointed out that until later series Sansa was passed around alot as a tool to make alliances. Everything she has gone through has developed her character. Not just the rape.

Also, as I said, Bolton was a character that everyone had to hate. That he does the worst things he could to people he had power over.

No issue with hunting women with dogs, torturing and cutting off someones cock.....but the rape was too far? Not in keeping with his character? Wouldnt have happened? Didnt happen in medieval times?

Again, if that a step too far for you, dont watch. But dont pretend it means people who do watch are lesser people.

I just wanted to see the dragons (I like dragons) and there weren't dragons in Episode 1 which was as far as I got. Guess I shall have to stick to Harry Potter for my dragon fix!

“I would imagine anyone with any sense would understand the difference between 'based on' and 'entirely accurate presentation of'”
Obviously I understand that. But the apologists always seem to use the “entirely accurate presentation of” as a justification of the gratuitous violence.

The whole sansa storyline is part of the same, tired, trope.

“No issue with hunting women with dogs, torturing and cutting off someones cock.....but the rape was too far?”

I have issues with all of that.

Better not watch Spartacus or Vikings then

Written by blokes as well, probably.

“Better not watch Spartacus or Vikings then”

It may come as
a surprise to you, but some people don’t like gratuitous violence in anything....

With the Sansa storyline I think they have show cased different ways people get to where they end up. As Bolton was a main character in the book it made sense to adapt to the show.

Ayra has had plenty of hardship, being blind and attacked by an assassin is pretty hard going, as was hearing her whole family get killed at the red wedding, she just had better people around her (The Hound, faceless man etc) to advise and guide her.

Sansa didn’t have good people around her so decisions were taken out of her control. Once she gained the power back to make her own decisions she has flourished and is by far one of the most intelligent characters.

I don’t think the sexual violence caused her to be stronger it was her breaking away from the power of the people manipulating her (Cersei, Little finger) once she figured out how to be on her own and not follow others she has got her power, just took her longer to break free.

Also remember poor Theon, why is it only violence against women that gets discussed? He entire character arc is seen as phenomenal. The torture and violence he endured was much worse!

It’s just different ways to show how people grow and learn. In a medieval themed fantasy world.

That’s the joy of Game of Thrones!

I have issues with all of that.

So remove it all then?

Also remember poor Theon, why is it only violence against women that gets discussed? He entire character arc is seen as phenomenal. The torture and violence he endured was much worse!

Theon’s story was brutal (too brutal IMHO) and brilliant. But, being kidnapped, tied to a X and castrated is a very less than an everday occurance and 99.9% of viewers of GoT won't have experienced it, thankfully. Being raped - another matter entirely. Rape and sexual assault is part of so many women's real life* stories (and some men's of course) and that's why it shouldn't be used as a lazy, tired plot device in fiction.

*Made up stat but I bet it's accurate, even if a little on the low side!

But the narrative of it’s the rape that made her strong is what I question?

It was not what made her strong, getting free from manipulation and breaking from what she was brought up to believe (women must marry and procreate) that’s whats given her strength.

I think some people on here are getting too hung up on the idea of "entertainment," as though everything you choose to watch is something you are supposed to 100% enjoy. I don't choose everything I read, watch, listen to or look at to make me feel good. Sometimes I find it unnerving, upsetting, revolting, or it plays to my greatest fears, makes me feel insecure, or educates me - it fulfils a need or desire to try to understand myself and where my thoughts, feelings, reactions and beliefs come from, or to understand others better and what might motivate them, but to do it in a safe space, unlike real life. That's part of the point of any kind of art, whether TV, film, theatre, music, painting, etc. If I felt what I was watching was entirely gratuitous and unpleasant, or merely supposed to be turning me on, or desensitising me, then I would be disgusted and switch it off. Sorry to disappoint the haters of GoT, none of whom I suspect have made the effort to watch much of it, given their reactions to it, but I do not think the revoltingness is entirely gratuitous. I think the themes of the series have lost subtlety, as have some of the characters, but at its heart, it's still just a story of good, evil and human frailty in which you are patently not supposed to root for the sadists and sickening behaviour and destruction, but are given hope that however appalling the situation and behaviour of some of the characters, and however much the hideous characters seem to be benefiting from their behaviour for a while, empathy and "humanity" still shine through and are more successful traits in the end than a lust for power and ruthless cruelty. It's kind of comforting to think that even appallingly damaged characters who have every reason to have been made cynical by the debauched, corrupted world around them, can still hold on to notions of true love, care for the vulnerable, and faith in the belief that things can get better, rather than giving in to despair....

So ner. I shall continue watching GoT for the whole of the next episode in the sincere hope that they let us all go away happy that the Iron Throne was not won by a genocidal maniac on a dragon.

I was smiling on the GOT thread as many people are lamenting that one of the "baddie" characters had a fairly gentle death. I think this would obviously have the op and her allies clutching their pearls. Personally I have cheered at certain violent moments, I don't think this makes me remotely violent. It's a very simplistic view to have tbh.

@Walkaround what you said 🙌

Great post walkaround

Good post, Walkaround! It will be ignored by the GoT disapprovers who will wait for a few more posts to come along and then they will pop back up again to sneer and pretend that no one has made any intelligent arguments in support of GoT... No one can really argue with what you’ve said so they won’t try!

100% @Walkaround!!

I would probably be one of those you think are disgusted by it so I'll respond

It's good to hear the other side of the coin, from women and the reasons why you watch and have a different POV. Im slightly jealous in a way that you can, sadly I think the over saturation of sexual violence (in most programmes not just this one) as a plot line means I'd struggle to enjoy it.

Valar Morghulis....

🐲

Yes walkaround perfect!

I’ve watched a fair bit of it, and enjoyed it - while fast forwarding the violence - but I don’t like some of the ways the writers have written about women.

I'm fine with not having my thoughts provoked or "being educated" by FANTASY remember (as everyone is arguing on this thread).

I'm not entertained by depictions of gratuitous violence or sexual violence or titilation. I'm reconciled with watching very little TV.

@bibbitybobbityyhat
Exactly that!

I'm not entertained by depictions of gratuitous violence or sexual violence or titilation. I'm reconciled with watching very little TV.

Quite a lot of fiction out for you too then.

Most of the classic myths and fairytales, Shakespeare.

Walkaround- that’s a very interesting post. I’m not saying that the series does any explore big themes, and that it is fundamentally a classic good v evil story. My problem is that the violence is so very extreme- far beyond that which is necessary to make the point. and I feel that it -particularly the sexual violence- is there simply for titilation. To pull in an audience. Like Warwick Castle (I think it’s Warwick) bringing in torture implements from another castle because it didn’t have any of it’s own, and visitors were down because of that.. .