The Nights Watch: GAME OF THRONES SEASON 8 EPISODE 4. May 6th UK. SPOILERS AFTER 2 am.

[OneInAMillionYou]

Hail survivors of The Battle of Winterfell.

The 'mysterious' episode 4 premieres tonight.

Who will be with us at 2am?

I am desperate to find out if Arya's kill is openly discussed and acknowledged, or does Bran take the credit, or does it remain a mystery.

Given Emilia Clarke has said Episode 5 is the one for which we will need 'bigger television screens' what will lead up to it?

At this point I think it'll end with Dany dead, Jon fucking off back to the North (that convo with Tormund and him taking ghost surely wasn't a bit of wasted dialogue), Cersei and Jaime dead and Sansa on the throne, Gendry and Jon don't want it so who else is there? Brienne as her Queens guard maybe, and either Varys or Tyrion as hand, I can't see both of them surviving sadly.

I won’t lie, I’ve massively enjoyed this series, but a big part of me can’t wait to read the book and find out how it ‘really’ ends

If it came down to it (assuming various Targaryens/Lannister’s are out of the picture) would Gendry now have a better claim than Sansa?

Interesting.

Sansa on the throne is an interesting prospect and one I hadn't considered. She did start the series wanting to be a queen by marriage so her being queen on her own would be a twist. Still not one of my favourite characters though!

I wonder if they'll end it with noone on the throne and the seven kingdoms breaking up rather than tieing up loose ends.

Talking of loose ends. Where is Edmure? Brienne was offered Riverrun but that doesn't mean Edmure is dead or is he still locked up in the twins because when the Freys died everyone forgot to let him out (or feed him...)

I'm baffled by the Sansa hate. She's had a conversation with Danny where she asked "what about the North" and Danny didn't even dignify it with an answer.

In fact Dany has never given a shiny shit about the North, after all they've sacrificed, after all they've lost. She should have promised them the fucking world, but she couldn't be bothered. Now that the NK is defeated, the North is just another province that has to bend the knee. Or else.

I've absolutely hated Danys attitude to the North all along. And I've always been disappointed that Jon's cock has prevented him seeing that Dany had no plan beyond "conquer everyone and be worshipped".

But Sansa has always been a good observer, and she watches and learns.

She has talked about Jon being King of the North several times. She knows that it's a better option for the North to have the King of the North on the IT.

People hating on her for "betraying Jon's secret", FFS. She sees the long game, and knows Tyrion will not just blindly react, but think and think and think.

Also, she remarked to him that the reason it wouldn't work between them was "divided loyalties". Everyone said that was foreshadowing to Tyrion betraying Dany and proving himself as a true ally of the North. Clearly something is being set up to happen long term between Tyrion and Sansa and we may not even see it, but know at the end it will. This is how it starts.

I love the idea of Sansa on the throne.

She’s learnt so much from all those scheming motherfuckers who ‘mentored’ her.

She’s become an accomplished player of the GOT in her own right (exactly what her father couldn’t do).

Plus nice parallels with Elizabeth I (assuming she doesn’t marry in the mean time).

She seems wedded to the north though,

Gendry, as he's now legitimised would have a better claim, definitely. But he said to Arya that he doesn't have a clue how to be a lord of anything, so the idea of him wanting the throne is dubious IMO.

Sansa's chat with the Hound wasn't wasted either, her mention of not being little bird anymore etc. She's shown she can make good decisions and is a confident leader. When she talked about whether they'll be able to feed all Danys troops, and later when she said the armies needed resting, she showed she's capable of the kind of thinking needed from a leader.

Quite, @merrymouse!

Also, when the fleet are attacked by Eurons fleet, and they arrive at Dragonstone with their ships destroyed and soaking wet, how did they travel the 100 miles or so up to Kings Landing to parlay?

Personally I agree that Sansa is an interesting character who is in the camp of people who have changed and developed across their story arc and she does seem to have learnt about politics better than Jon. She just isn't one of my favourites, can't really explain it!

LaurieMarlow theoretically Gendry would have a better claim than Jon or Dany.

However, there’s the whole ‘power resides where men believe it resides’ bit. Who exactly is loyal to the smith from Fleab Bottom and why? What army supports him and what coin is he paying them with?

A lot of this in Westeros is sorted through political marriages, which haven’t really been touchd on this season. Sansa marrying Gendry would be a very interesting twist in the power game.

I'm baffled by the Sansa hate.

It’s all over the fan verse and has been for years. There’s a contingent of fantasy fans who can’t cope with a high social class female who works within societal norms rather than against them. They’re used to these characters being eye candy and nothing more.

@LaurieMarlow Not even remotely true in my case. I just prefer tiny badass Arya. My brother thinks it’s a throw back to my Buffy loving years

Tbf Id quite love to see Sansa and Tyrion married and on the throne. That’s my second preference to Jon.

I just prefer tiny badass Arya

Well this is very typical of the people I’ve described. Non confirming female and all that.

Anyway, I’m sure you know your reasons.

Ned Stark was an honourable fool. He kept secrets, kept his word and lost his head for it. He put his word before his family. There are so many examples in the book. Robert basically told him that Joffrey had something seriously wrong with him, but Ned carried on with the betrothal to Sansa anyway. Arya told him about the conversation she heard between Varys and Ilyrio, but he ignored her. I know it’s an unpopular opinion, but he was an idiot.

Sansa is much more of a Tully. Someone on Youtube pointed out that the Tully house words are ‘Family, Duty, Honour’. In other words, family comes before honour.

@JasperRising Good point re Edmure. I think he'll just be forgotten now but will mysteriously be reincarnated as Prince Philip in a few months time...

Yes Sansa is hated cos she doesn't kick ass. She floats around in gowns in big rooms, listening and watching and occasionally looking sour and dropping a truth bomb.

I think she's awesome. She'll outlive them all. I can see her turning into this amazing Queen of Thorns matriarch.

Brienne wasn't crying (entirely) for her, she was crying for him. She's always known he was conflicted. She would have heard the rumours about Cersei, he left her to die at Harranhal - BadJ. He risked his life to save her from Harranhal, and from the rapists - GoodJ. The J she knows sees the good winning out, but he doesn't believe it and never has. I'm not sure even J knows which one is going to win when he leaves Winterfell, but B is scared it will be the Bad.

He's like someone who has grown up being told they're fat and ugly, going through school knowing they're the fat member of their friendship circle and then, having lost a load of weight and finding someone who tells them they're beautiful just can't believe it, and finds the message too hard to hear. That's who Jaime is to me. He's running away because he can't bear to be with something who thinks so well of him.

Tyrion's comments re B was totally in keeping with his character.

Dany giving Storm's End to Gendry was clever - she both acknowledged his lineage and gained his loyalty. She's counting on the fact it won't occur to him that, if he's Robert's acknoweldged son he's also his heir.

She's become both arrogant and desperate. She thought that, with two dragons, she was invincible, hence not waiting for the men to recover before going south. I suspect this decision will backfire as the ones coming down the King's Road will take longer than expected. She's getting desperate as she sees the difference in how she is treated and how Jon is treated. She is realising that the love of the Westerosi is not hers for the taking, as she was brought up to believe.

Could Varys' be the third betrayal - for love of the kingdom?

It’s all over the fan verse and has been for years. There’s a contingent of fantasy fans who can’t cope with a high social class female who works within societal norms rather than against them. They’re used to these characters being eye candy and nothing more.

I don’t think it helps that Sansa is an introverted character whose development can be seen in the books via her internal monologue. She is smart, she is socially intellingent and observant. This doesn’t translate well to screen where she is simply seen as ‘doing nothing’ so is put into all sorts of contrived situations which show her ‘playing the game’.

In the books I believe she is going to be instrumental in feeding a starving Westeros with all the food that’s been hoarded in the Vale. So much has been made of how the harvest has been destroyed by war and how the Vale has plenty. She’s best placed to use this to her advantage to build further support.

This doesn’t translate well to the show where winter lasted all of one night.

Brienne wasn't crying (entirely) for her, she was crying for him. She's always known he was conflicted.

Totally agree with this. briennes’s always been the better angel of his nature, whereas Cersei has encouraged his worst impulses.

I loved them getting together. They’re so good for each other. I sincerely hope he returns to her.

In fact Dany has never given a shiny shit about the North, after all they've sacrificed, after all they've lost. She should have promised them the fucking world, but she couldn't be bothered. Now that the NK is defeated, the North is just another province that has to bend the knee. Or else

Exactly this. She gave the fucking iron islands independence, but she can’t do it with the North? After all they’ve been through? Fucking hell Dany.

Cersei’s plan is absolutely genius I must say.
If the ‘breaker of chains’ is so desperate for a throne, she’ll have to slaughter how many innocents? Well played.

Could Varys' be the third betrayal - for love of the kingdom?

I like this.

I also agree Brienne wasn't crying for herself when Jaime left.

I'd like Sansa and Tyrion ruling personally.

Cersei’s plan is absolutely genius I must say

Yes and now Dany is boiling mad over Missandei and guaranteed to do stupid things. She’s far beyond reason now.

If Dany was being smart, she’d send Arya the assassin in to take Cersei out. Arya knows the back passages of the red keep better than anyone (apart from Varys).

But she’s not that smart, so she won’t. However looks like Aryas taking it into her own hands.