Kiri, Channel4, Wed 10th Jan

[southeastdweller]

Anyone else looking forward to this? The writer also wrote the recent Robbie Coltrane drama, National Treasure, and Sarah Lancashire is always superb.

www.radiotimes.com/news/tv/2017-10-31/kiri-channel-4-trailer/

Italian - I'm sure that's true of babies and toddlers but Kiri is 9, she will have a good understanding of her cultural/ethnic heritage and being with people 'like her' will be a big pull. After 5 years her foster mum still doesn't know what to do with her hair, and is comparing her to Audrey Hepburn, someone she will never look like. Bristol is a very multicultural city and Kiri could easily be growing up with neighbours and school friends from Somalia, Jamaica, Poland, Pakistan, Nigeria, mixed race children living with white parents etc - but it looks like the foster family live in Clifton or St Andrews, almost exclusively wealthy white areas. Is Kiri the only black girl in her class? The social worker is right that she will always be other in that life.

I agree Marcine

I agree, Italiangreyhound . I can't see the foster mother strangling her in a rage either, more likely an accident.

Maybe foster mum followed dad and kiri - she was watching outside the house (I just rewatched that bit from first episode) - and they got into an argument/struggle over kiri and in the process kiri got hurt - scarf slammed in car door and someone started to drive off or similar? - then they agreed to cover it up together?
I agree the scarf may feature.
Unlikely but possible!

It's interesting that when social worker turned up to collect Kiri Foster mum said they'd had an argument over something

Oh I didn’t notice that umake I do remember the foster Mum standing on the stairs as if she didn’t want the SW to go up. However I don’t think it’s actually normal practice for a SW to automatically go up to a child’s bedroom to get them. Not unless there was a problem and child refusing to come down etc and parent asked SW for help. Normally SW will wait downstairs and DC called down.

IME

Just thinking about this. If that was the foster mum in the car following the sw, why didn't the sw tell the police about it, or at least confront her about it later. Also if it was the foster mum in the car, why didn't she ring the sw/police when she spotted kiri's dad. So either the foster mum was involved with kiri's death or it wasn't her in the car.

Omg I detest the foster mother. She's so controlling and possessive of Kiri. She was vile to the grandfather in the kitchen. I hope the grandfather exercises his prerogative as next of kin and cuts them out of the funeral plans.
This series is really coming out against mixed race adoptions and I don't understand why. Obviously it can cause harm to the child with the wrong people but it can work. However I cringed when the foster mother compared Kiri to Audrey Hepburn. Wtf?

I don't like the foster mother either, but if she is indeed innocent of Kiri's murder, I can understand her being horrible to the grandfather. If he had never allowed his son to come round that day, Kiri would still be alive.

I see where you're coming from but she was acting like the gf had nothing to do with Kiri.

@Marcine if you have experience of interracial adoptions then I'll take your word for it. I also don't know anything about that part of Bristol to know whether she would be the only black child in the class.

I wonder if the family are so unsuitable for her, why they got to foster her in the first place.

@DonnyAndVladSittingInATree yes, I think the social worker going to Kiri's room was very unusual.

@deadringer yes, I don't understand if the foster mum was in the car and saw the dad arriving, knowing contact between them was not allowed, the foster mum would not have simply phoned social worker or social work office and reported it.

I can completely see why the foster mum would be horrible to the granddad. It's a shame she was but if the child I had cared for for 5 years was dead and the person who should have been looking after her was in my house I can't guarantee what my behaviour would be. I think she was very restrained.

I think it is quite sad so many people see the foster mum as creepy or weird for loving a little girl and wanting to adopt her. The idea this should be understandably put the son;s nose out of joint is amazingly odd and kind of shows how adoption is not really viewed like being a birth parent.

Yes it is hard for a child when a walking talking child arrives at age 5 and you are 10, (my dd was 9, ds was 3 nearly 4) and it has been tough at times. But it happens with birth siblings and no one would feel an older child was somehow justified in feeling their nose is out of joint for not being the only one.

Why is the drug taking dad who abandoned her and the granddad who also abandoned being portrayed or perceived as nicer people than the woman who cared for her for 5 years. Pretty weird to me!

Why is the drug taking dad who abandoned her and the granddad who also abandoned being portrayed or perceived as nicer people than the woman who cared for her for 5 years. Pretty weird to me!

Because things aren't always black and white they are all shades of grey. DH's biological father gave him up for adoption, he is a lovely man. His adoptive dad is a an abusive arsehole. Just because people adopt doesn't automatically make them saints.

Italian - there aren't enough foster carers to match children and carers ethnically/culturally most of the time.

I think generally people are quite understanding of how hard it is for an older sibling when there is a new baby actually.

I agree it's shades of grey - it isn't that the birth family is good and the foster family is bad, it's that interracial adoption is a bit more complex than poor black child just needs a nice white family to love them and all is well.

I understand her loving her dd, adopted or not. It's the intensity of her emotion that doesn't feel right. More importantly it's the contrast between her love for her dd and the distance between her and her ds. The scene where the foster dad wanted the ds to come to London and she dismissed it was horrible.

@ineedamoreadultieradult I didn't say people who adopted were saints. But I was talking about the script of the programme we are watching. So my comments were based on that, nothing outside of that.

@Marcine So I wonder if better cultural awareness training for foster carers would be at least a help.

I am finding the programme somewhat manipulative! Yes, I know it is not real. It feels quite damaging to people's perception of what adoption or fostering is.

"I think generally people are quite understanding of how hard it is for an older sibling when there is a new baby actually." You mean understanding about the older child and being kind to them etc, yes, of course. I agree but not to the point of consulting them if they would have another child in the family or not, no.

That's not something I've heard much of.

But when one adopts one has to consult with older children, not to say that they would necessarily have the chance to say 'no' but that they are part of a consultation which doesn't occur with birth children.

I don't know if this is the same when people foster and as Kiri came via the fostering route that may not be relevant.

@Marcine "... interracial adoption is a bit more complex than poor black child just needs a nice white family to love them and all is well."

But I don't think that is the issue here, it is about suspicion, and where it falls. I have a sneaking feeling they may not tell us at the end of it.

For me it seems to be largely about race, but also about boundaries, who has the right to parent Kiri, who has the right to decide things, perhaps even who has the right to speak to the press! Yes, we can agree it is hugely complex.

@MissEliza "It's the intensity of her emotion that doesn't feel right." How so?

I feel that we did not really get to see much of her before Kiri disappeared. After Kiri disappeared I would expect nothing to be normal again. In one sense I'd expect her to be crying, but I am not sure how I would react.

I know a few people whose children have died (of health issues) and they behaved differently from each other. So I know there is not one way such awful grief takes people.

"More importantly it's the contrast between her love for her dd and the distance between her and her ds. The scene where the foster dad wanted the ds to come to London and she dismissed it was horrible."

She didn't initially dismiss it, the son did. She pointed out how it would look in the press.

I'm far too absorbed in this drama, better get on and do the dishes.

It is really hard to know the dynamics of the family relationships as we saw so little before Kiri died. I also think there's something about that actress as I was totally convinced she was guilty in the Missing and she wasn't in the least involved.

Slightly off topic, the bit where the biological dad struggled to find a black doll to give Kiri brought up a really important point. Little black girls have so few role models in their image it's disgusting. I remember looking for a birthday card for dd's friend, who is black, when she was 6 and being frustrated by the amount of cards with white Disney princesses. I can't believe this situation hasn't improved.

I’m thinking teenage son stole the car, followed SW to granddads house. Saw Dad driving off with Kiri and thought “happy days, I’m getting rid of her” but followed, witnessed Kiri run away from Dad and went after her himself. Something happened. She died. Probably accidentally. And he obviously can’t say anything. Mum suspects him of something.

I’m also curious about how Dad knew Kiri would be visiting grandad.

@MissEliza I never saw the missing.

Totally agree about the black dolls. But they do exist, not just black skinned but racially diverse. They are very expensive and often made by small companies.

Before we adopted domestically we considered China adoption route and then and later I looked for suitable dolls etc as I knew we were option to transracially adoption. We expressed interested in a mixed heritage child but that link did not go anywhere. We adopted ds the following year. We are white and ds is white.

Maybe that's why I am so absorbed in this programme!

@DonnyAndVladSittingInATree I think the step mum (played by famous comedian whose name escapes me) tipped him off.

My money is on unknown assailant or we never find out.

(Or plot twist Sarah Lancashire! Joking!!)