Anyone watching Madeleine McCann ten years on?

[spottysuperted]

They're framing it slightly differently now.. 😧 interesting from the bbc...

The only reason I compared what they were doing to baby listening services earlier was to make the point that there is essentially no difference - all the comments about leaving children alone apply equally, but presumably if they'd been using an authorised baby listening service they wouldn't have come in for such criticism. My question is do such services still exist and if so would anyone use one now?

You're right of course, there isn't anything else to say. The McCanns and friends thought it was safe to leave the children, if they had any doubts they wouldn't have. Unfortunately the worst possible scenario happened and a child is missing.

It's true - a baby listening service wouldn't have prevented what happened that night. The whole concept assumes it's safe to a baby in the apartment and just 'listen in' to check if they are crying periodically. I've always been paranoid about fire as well, so wouldn't have used the service for that reason alone. But plenty did.

you seem to think you and your fellow ghoul squad are actually helping? You're not.

Again, why vilify people for sharing factual police files that dismiss a lot of the theories being banded about? All of the 'I think I read somewhere once', in an attempt to make a point that just isn't true - I think that's more dangerous than sharing fact.

Those who believe the McCann story are theorists themselves but they're ok to share their views?

There have been numerous and plentiful occasions in the past where people have contributed to cases after seeing details shared on social media/in the press/on forums. Questioning and sharing details doesn't have to come from negativity.

This is not vilifying you for sharing police files portcheese. That's a strawman. You could share them without bullshitting about the appropriate moment to mention a child's nosebleed. But you have chosen not to do so.

And your comments, your criticism that people taking a particular view aren't helping, make it sound like you think you in contrast are doing something useful. You're not. You're just entertaining yourself. Which you have every right to do with material that's been released into the public domain, but call it what it is.

Hi everyone,

Just to reiterate - there isn't a blanket ban on mentioning the McCanns on MN, it's an open case of a missing child and of course can be discussed. However, please do keep in mind that the McCanns are real parents who have lost a child; we hope we can all agree that we wouldn't wish that on anyone.

We'd like to remind all of our talk guidelines; we will delete posts that we feel are beyond the pale or parent-blaming; which just isn't the spirit of the site. We're here to make parents lives easier and are chiefly a place of support. We must ask folks to avoid speculation, too. Similarly, if we make so many deletions that the thread resembles swiss cheese, we will delete it.

If anyone spots any posts that they think we should take a look at, please do report them to us.

portcheese the similarity with my friend losing her dh is that they were experiencing a major trauma, she probably got them off to school and spent the next few hours bawling her eyes out before putting on a brave face for when the kids came home. The common factor is a massive trauma and trying to keep things calm for the remaining family

Portcheese they are "factual police files" from an inquiry led by a man who was taken off the case and demoted. The Panorama documentary - which is why this thread was started - showed the early police investigation completely ignored the forced shutters and officers denied the shutters could be opened from the outside (in spite of evidence to the contrary on several occasions, in the same apartment block in previous weeks). It didn't exactly get off to a good start so please forgive us if we don't take as gospel everything which followed.

I understand the McCanns absolutely torture themselves for leaving the children alone, but it is really hard to be a parent and not have a discussion about leaving the children alone when talking about Madeleine McCann.
TBH I think they are treated fairly sympathetically in the media. The BBC documentary makers seemed to have made a decision to exonerate the McCanns while presenting some other men as the potential culprits with very little evidence. The way that former employee was interviewed really stank. Of course as there was so much examination of the McCanns initially that the evidence clearly proves they had nothing to do with her fate. However they named these burglars and linked them to her disappearance with no real basis. Why would some common petty thieves suddenly become kidnappers? And the BBC rock up to one of the men's house and act his apparent avoidance of them is surprising and suspicious. Would they have got away with bandying these theories about if the people had been British citizens?

Quite possibly not.

I think there's elements of you useless Johnny Foreigner and you arrogant imperialistic Brits in the way this has been presented in the two countries. The smidgen of truth in both of those views has probably only exacerbated matters.

I agree MissEliza. The interviews with the Portuguese suspects IMO just made Bilton look callous.

For the record I think most of us have been pretty good about discussing this whole subject. By the nature of it there isn't much middle ground. You have to take each piece of information with its own health warning and be ready to make accommodations rather than digging yourself in and becoming entrenched.

I didn't think Panorama was presenting those men as possible culprits more as possible lines for investigation. Making the point that although the Portuguese investigation had focussed on the Mcanns there were other lines of inquiry - which might have been better investigated ten years ago. Do any of these men feature in the police files that some posters on here are so fond of?

I agree, I think the way those men were interviewed was outrageous. sadly, they would, presumably, not have the funds to sue anybody unlike the McCanns who seem very sue-happy indeed.

Yes, on the face of it it doesn't look like the Yard have done much with their 11 million. However I heard that apparently 30 countries had to cooperate to support the phone analysis that identified those men so they must really have wanted to speak to them. They have been ruled out now I'm guessing otherwise they wouldn't have turned them out for the media to play with!

Have a look at the link provided, Lillian. That will answer your question.

Also, just to add to cover your earlier point. Lots of the British police documents are there too. I'm dumbfounded why you would choose to discredit police files just because it might not fit nearly with your own opinion but never mind, each to their own!

without bullshitting about the appropriate moment to mention a child's nosebleed

Does that really justify and attack?

An*

Portcheese you really don't seem to understand how disgusting some of your amateur sleuthing posts are. If you were just posting links to the PJ stuff, or even saying that there's no evidence for any theory and statistically the parents are most often the ones responsible, that would be one thing.

But post after post of pulling apart people's reactions based on some behavioural standard you've invented yourself, snidey little comments about x being suspicious, while all the while telling other people they're not helping- that's utterly, utterly awful. This isn't some detective novel for your amusement. The moral high ground is way beyond you here.

That's your opinion MissShitty which is seemingly based on ignoring the majority of what I've posted (such as repeatedly saying there are arguments for both theories, we don't know the truth, etc.).

I have questions which have arisen from reading the police files and having an interest in the case since it happened. They shouldn't be offensive to you and the fact that they are is not something I'll apologise for. I wholly disagree with what you say but thanks for contributing.

Nah - you're just another who enjoys sticking the pitch fork in, Portcheese.

No one knows what happened to MM but those involved so there are obviously going to be theories and questions from the general public, me included. There really isn't a need to be so defensive when they're brought up.

That's your opinion MissShitty which is seemingly based on ignoring the majority of what I've posted (such as repeatedly saying there are arguments for both theories, we don't know the truth, etc.).

You seem to miss the point here: whatever else you might have said, speculating about how people haven't looked a particular way or disclosed nosebleeds at a particular point to your satisfaction is completely and utterly disgusting. There is no excuse for it, at all.

I would also refer you to my post upthread where I invited people to reflect on the possibility that, if something doesn't make sense to you, it might be due to your ignorance rather than anything else. Do you have any qualifications to decide what constitutes unusual childcare choices the day after a traumatic event, for example? What's your practical experience in this matter?

I have questions which have arisen from reading the police files and having an interest in the case since it happened. They shouldn't be offensive to you and the fact that they are is not something I'll apologise for.

You have no more right to say what should be offensive to me than you have to say how parents of a recently vanished child should be behaving. Your lane, stay in it.

There really isn't a need to be so defensive when they're brought up.

Defensive is the incorrect term to use here. There's nothing even slightly defensive about telling you that you're a bullshitting ghoul with no possible claim to any moral high ground.

You do sound like an axe-grinding obsessive PortCheese. Although you'll be getting some kind of thrill out of this I would suggest a healthier hobby.

I don't think people are being defensive.

I think they are pissed off with the implication that you and people like you are doing anything other than pulling stuff out of your arse.

The fact that you think because you can use Google that you are in possession of the full facts and therefore in a position to come up with credible theories is embarrassing and would be fucking hilarious if this whole situation wasn't so tragic.