Eden

[AnneEyhtMeyer]

Starts tomorrow - anyone planning to watch?

It looks like a new version of Castaway without the heavy-handed interference of the TV crew and without the cosy huts provided.

Seems very odd that they managed to find the drowned ewe in time to eat her

Luck? I mean, the alternative would be someone either pushing the ewe in the bog, or spotting her struggling and deciding to wait and see what happened rather than try and get her out.

Yy about the hair spray.

If I was going into something like this, taking only what I could carry, hairspray wouldn't even be on the shortlist for my backpack.

On a similar note, the number of smokers surprised me. Given that there's no way they'd get tobacco plants to grow, I'd have thought they'd make a big effort to quit smoking before entering Eden.

Think they should have done it in one series next year. I'm going to have forgotten who everyone is by the Autumn.

Feel a bit conflicted over Tara. On one hand, people who don't pull their weight really frustrate me, on the other, the way Tom etc. Hounded her out was appalling.

Waah! I am trying to watch this on catch-up but it keeps crashing. 4OD is being as temperamental as a love-sick gamekeeper
Tom doesn't have any redeeming qualities, does he? He just moves from one bullying target to another. I feel sorry for his DP in RL (if he has one).

I assumed they were all single - a year building Eden in the Scottish wilderness with no contact with the outside world would be very hard on most relationships.

Yy that would make sense.
Gosh, the garden woman is a bit of a troublemaker: calling the vote on Tara's hut and telling Glenn that Caggy didn't like him. She's a sneaky one.

Tara was basically lazy, that is always going to rub people up he wrong way. Her passive aggressive reaction when being called out on it further eroded any good will you might have for her. I mean seriously, a fecking massage tent!

"I think Tara spent the entire 3 months she was in the camp composing her leaving speech."

She was too lazy to even do that, she nicked it from the 'Team America' film

It didn't erode any good will that I had for her. The whole point of starting from scratch is trying to build communities that value everyone - not just the strong. Tara wasn't the only one that was lazy and she did have the excuse of having a problem with her back. Tom is simply a bully. He tried it with Anton, then moved on to Tara, then it will be somebody else.

I think we both agree, Tom is a twat.

With regard to Tara she had a poor work ethic, always opting for 'soft' work assignments instead of the more grubby arduous ones and going AWOL a lot of the time. She was not the only lazy one but I can't imagine any other person in that group who's contribution would be missed less upon their departure. The whole 'making everyone feel valued' argument is not a one way street, you have to make an effort to be seen as a valued member of he community, and that means pulling your weight, especially in a survival situation where there is no room for passengers.

It's interesting. I've only ever had a massage when it's been bought as a gift for me but I actually I think Titch's idea to have the massage tent was inspired. How it was valued was dependent on people's personalities (not on the 'worth' of what she was doing) hence why just over half voted to keep it.
If I was having to choose a community, I'd rather have the one that includes Raphael, Titch and Tara than one that's based on the values of Tom and the bullies. It's like a conflict between a hyper-masculinity and a more balanced view of society's functions and contributions.
I can't help being a bit that it's ok for the men to plot to starve people out. I'm questioning how the programme makers are supporting the people involved in this process. Not only for the ones who are being 'starved' and bullied, but for the 'bully-men' who are going to have to deal with the disconnect of how they view themselves and how everyone else has viewed them.
If they can ship in chocolate, maybe the should ship in a counsellor/psychologist too (although obviously the bully-men would decide they should be starved and bullied out as providers of soft skills).

Tara didn't pull her weight and that was always going to cause problems but I agree, Tom is simply a nasty bully. He isn't coming across at all well.

Just caught up. And I was really chuckling at the fact that she's so lazy that she nicked her leaving speech from Team America.

I actually think that hounding her like that was, though obviously unpleasant, very effective. She was dead weight. Every person there increases the size that each communal shelter needs to be, increases how much wood needs to be chopped, increases the amount of food to be grown and slaughtered, increases the size of each communal meal, increases the pressure on those hunting and fishing and foraging. It's already debatable whether massaging people is really a valid contribution to the very pressing needs of that small community, but massaging half the camp occasionally (or even the full camp if they'd all softened) still isn't reciprocal. She's receiving too much high value labour and resources in return. Speaking to her hadn't worked and there were people in the camp essentially protecting her right to not make a useful contribution because they like her. They don't have the luxury that wider society has whereby there are enough workers and resources to carry through those who are less able or less willing to contribute.

Tom is still a wanker though.

Yy but the point of the programme is supposed to be building a community, not survival of the fittest. It made me uncomfortable. From a philosophical pov, where's the space/respect for people who are differently able? Why is bullying acceptable but laziness not?
It's why Castaway was better tbh. When you have family units and DCs, you can't just value people on physical strength and aggressiveness.

I don't really see the bullying as acceptable. But in this specific instance I do think it's understandable. Just as it would be understandable for someone to down tools and choose to do nothing because they were being bullied.

I do get your point about questioning where the room is for the differently abled but that isn't what these people are actually dealing with. All of them have been certified as healthy and able. Having a bad back (especially one that isn't bad enough to stop her hunching over massaging for long periods) shouldn't stop Tara making some form of useful contribution, even if it's not enormously physically demanding work she ends up doing. But what she's essentially saying is that she only wants to massage. She could forage. She could work moss into the sides of shelters to weather proof them. If she can stoop her back over to massage, she could spend shorter periods doing a bit of gardening. She could take charge of cleaning everyone's clothes and washing dishes and pans. There are small but essential jobs she could be doing. Plenty to keep her busy. She just doesn't want to.

But surely if you want a community to thrive you need the basic building blocks in place, shelter, fresh water, a supply of food, fire wood, etc. We are not talking about a mixed bunch of people that includes the elderly, young kids, the long term ill, but a bunch of able bodied youngish folk who are capable of pulling their weight. It's about expectations towards your contribution to the group, not everyone is physically capable of chopping a ton of wood a day, landing two dozen fish daily, cooking a nutritious meal using basic ingredients, having medical or vetinary skills, but you can still contribute. You can carry the logs to the wood store, you can help gut and prepare the fish, you can assist the vet in delivering the lambs, you can wash the pots and pans for the chef and keep the kitchen stocked with foraged food. If you do any or all of that that you would be a welcome member of the team, if you can't be bothered then it is no surprise that people begin to grumble that you are using more resources then you are generating.

Agree with TheGruffalo and Pan.

If Tara's fit enough to do lots of massaging, then surely she's fit enough to do other light work that would be more essential to the community than massaging.

If this was a 'real' community they wouldn't kick her out as she would be considered prime breeding stock!

The thing is, as lovely as a massage tent, sweat tent, swing and gym is, until you have built your winter shelter, planted and tended your crops and built up your stores through foraging and hunting, it is indulgent.

She could easily have given massages in the evenings after everyone (including her) had done a hard day's useful work. She would still have been contributing her special ability and skill, and would probably have been appreciated for it. However sitting waiting for a massage client all day while everyone is building the basic infrastructure is selfish and unacceptable in a team situation.

Couldn't agree more, but I just cannot feel comfortable with how Tom etc basically forced her out. In a functioning community I would have hoped she would have been supported to find something useful she was happy to contribute.

No, she was highly irritating asking/demanding someone to pour the water when she'd been asked to make tea FFS. She was lazy and useless and on top of that unbearable!

Tom aside, she was really of no use in 'the society' they had.

They could have eaten her...

As suggestions go, I'm not sure if that's better or worse than the "prime breeding stock" notion above......

Over half the people there thought she did have a use. This wasn't democracy in action. It was bullying and tbh if I was building a community from scratch I'd rather have a no bullying policy than a no laziness policy because the fact is that Eden hasn't been super-organised. The majority haven't prioritised food or building. If they had put as much effort into building as they did bullying the winter camp would be further along.

If this was real and they were literally the only pp on the planet I don't think either using her for reproduction or eating her is so outlandish. Survival of the fittest and all that! 😈