Stirictly Kosher fans?

[Itsgottabebags]

Are you looking forward to the new series starting soon?

I can't wait!

Jack made me cry. I can't even imagine what he went through.

I have a couple of questions though. Why the segregation? Is it really about enjoying yourself without worrying about impressing the opposite sex? How does the Jewish community feel about people converting? I just wonders because someone mentioned if your son married a Jewish girl you know the Jewish line will continue. If they marry non Jews are their children not Jewish?

Ive just been talking about this in the hairdressers. I would say half the hair dressers are Jewish and 80% of the clientele. They all said that the programme was totally embarrassing for them. They hated it.

And, about marrying out. Its totally frowned upon. Even amongst those that arent religious. I know of two women who's grandparents and father refused to attend their weddings. And there was no inheritance.

That isnt strictly a Jewish thing, of course.

Fascinated by this thread as someone who grew up in Manchester. Joel and Bernette, although at opposite ends of the religious spectrum are not representative of all sectors of Manchester 'orthodox' society (you can be orthodox in classification but not religious). The community is actually much more polarised than the programme showed with a lot of charedim (ultra orthodox) moving to manchester for the lower cost of living vs London. There are lots of less observant Jews and the middle of the road in observance are being squeezed. I think it would be interesting to find out about that aspect of the community. There's also a general trend towards children becoming more religious than their parents which Bernette did cover.
I think Bernette is well meaning - I heard the programme last year would have been a lot lighter in terms of explaining Jewish ritual if she hadn't insisted on providing more detail and explanations - but I get the impression that the programme was badly edited by ITV other than the Jack bits which I think were really, really excellent. Someone I went to school with expected to be in more of the show but was in for about 3 secs. Noone knew what was going to be shown until it was on TV.

With that, to answer frillymilly's questions:-

Segregation - sometimes is to do with modesty - women don't dance infront of men, for example. In synagogue it's to ensure dedication to prayer.
Conversion - within the Orthodox community, as long as people have an honest motive, there's no problem. Conversion isn't encouraged - we are not a prosyletising (is that right spelling?) religion. I find of other religions that seeking people to actively convert is a bit arrogant to be honest. The only issue with conversion is that there's no universally accepted conversion across the Orthodox-Reform&Liberal divide. It's easier to convert reform and probably for motive more than anything else, that's why Orthodox doesn't accept it (on the basis that if someone's motive was right, surely they would want to convert to the highest level to be sure they would be considered Jewish) and because of the next point.
Judaism (orthodox) continues through the line of the mother - basically because you know that the baby is definitely the mother's. If a Jewish boy marries a non Jewish girl, the children won't be Jewish unless she converts. Having said that, a reform synagogue would consider the children Jewish through the father's line, which is one of the reasons why Orthodox don't accept reform conversions, because Orthodox don't consider some reform Jews to be Jewish at all (paternally Jewish children). I know some people who have been in this situation who have decided to convert Orthodox so that they have the choice to marry and live however they want. I also know someone who has considered it but decided against it and has married a non Jewish boy and is accepting that she isn't actually Jewish (which her mum doesn't understand). In the context of family, although they are just as much a part of the family, it must feel a little isolating, because all her brother has to do is marry a Jewish girl and the kids would be considered Jewish by all sectors of the religion.

My great-grandfather,apparently, was a Manchester Jewish boy who married "out"...an Irish girl who worked in his father's factory. Family story is that his family held a funeral type ceremony as if he had died,and turned all pictures of him to the wall. Does that sound likely,we have always been so fascinated by our mysterious great-granddad.....

Clawdy, it is possible. It's fiction, but in a Maisie Mosco book a man marries out and his family sit shiva for him.

I asked DPs parents if they wanted me to convert, they said it absolutely wasn't necessary. I would have done if I had to but it would have been hypocritical as I'm an atheist and would have done it purely to marry DP.

Saw lots of people DP knows on the second episode. They're all MO but DP went to school with them etc, DP's family are Reform but atheists. DP said at KD there was always a bit of a feeling that Reform Jews weren't Jewish enough. DPs paternal grandmother converted and so DPs cousins weren't able to go to KD because his auntie wasn't considered Jewish. That has changed now, but I doubt our kids will go there anyway

MrsFanackerPants, B&W school are more relaxed on their policies aren't they? I have a friend who's kids go there, she isn't Jewish and he is.

Well, our kids are unlikely to go there as we plan on moving to a more rural area Also we're both atheists so don't want our kids to go to a Jewish or C of E school, we'll take them to Cheder and/or Sunday school if they want to go and explain their dual heritage but neither DP nor I enjoyed the religious aspects of our schooling and we don't want our kids to endure the same. I think it would also be potentially confusing for them to only learn about "one side" from their school. This is all very hypothetical, we don't have kids yet!

A friend of ours went to Cassel Fox and her parents took her out because at age 5 she was coming home and checking all the food in the kitchen!

MrsM thanks,that is interesting,wish there was some way of tracing that lost branch of our family,my sister and I have always loved having that drop of Jewish blood!

I married out :) my parents love my dh and why shouldn't they. tbh i have never really felt comfortable around the jewish community, i always felt like the outsider and after the age of 20 always mixed with non jews although never really felt i fitted in with them either :D. i don't 'look' typically jewish and as a result, because i am rarely in jewish company, have OFTEN had anti jewish comments said (they not knowing i am a jew). makes you feel terrible, other than when i have been so totally taken by surprise, i would usually say i am a jew. my point is (for those non jews who wonder why jews tend to stick to their own, something i find frustrating tbh) it is for this reason i guess, to feel safe. i understand why they do it although i chose to 'be free' although the anti semetism i have heard over the years is bloody awful, text book stuff straight out of the mouth of the nazi propaganda machine

it is fascinating - I love the shop owner but find the rabbi supremely arrogant and vain. The old man is also wonderful and inspiring but the mother Bernette is also uber vain.

One thing I don't get is her obsession with getting her children married off and then to have babies, babies and more babies; why the need to have so many babies?