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Appropriate Adult

106 replies

ImperialBlether · 04/09/2011 21:17

Just started watching it - seems really good already. Fred West (actor) is very good at making me feel very uncomfortable.

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herbietea · 04/09/2011 22:18

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ImperialBlether · 04/09/2011 22:19

Lucy Partington was Martin Amis' cousin.

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ImperialBlether · 04/09/2011 22:19

How awful, herbietea.

Terrible to think of families who were affected watching this.

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festi · 04/09/2011 22:19

fortunatly or unfortunatly, imperial, it doesnt takes alot of detaching when working in a supportive role, it is possible naturally to see through alot of the bad things and recognise someones vulnerability and humanity and function on a needs basis without too much thought. sounds silly but it is not always something that is at the forefront of your mind, Unless in investigation mode but luckily for me I am not in a qualified position quite yet so not often involved in that side.

deemented · 04/09/2011 22:35

I watched it and thought it very very good.

He was so chilling and matter of fact 'I had to close her eyes before i cut off her head, well you wouldn't want your daughter staring at you while you were doing that, would you?'

I assume that most things Fred says in this came directly from transcripts of taped evidence?

Awful, just awful.

Looking forward to next Sunday though.

ImperialBlether · 04/09/2011 22:40

It's great that you can do that, festi. I'm assuming you're in social services. It must be distressing dealing with a case with its origins generations back.

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MyGoldfishIsEvil · 04/09/2011 22:48

Yes, often these dramas take dialogue direct from courtroom transcripts, and are surprisingly accurate. Was he a psycopath/sociopath? Seems chillingly detached about the murders he committed.

That is awful that she had a stroke in the courtroom - the stress she must have been under!

If it had been me being the appropriate adult, and my first case straight out of training, I would have taken them up on their offer to give the case to someone more experienced - but I'm a chicken like that.

Will def watch next week.

festi · 04/09/2011 22:53

luckily no serial killers though, imperial, not quite sure how that can be handled. Without sounding calas it is important to accept people live thier lives differently and I just have to deal with the tasks in hand. Many older cologues of mine have seen the same families passing through the system with every generation. that is sad.

festi · 04/09/2011 22:55

I would have aswell my goldfish, when I did it I was only about 19 and it was only two days training and I thought no way was I equipt to actually register with my local police.

MyGoldfishIsEvil · 04/09/2011 23:30

Festi, interesting that you didn;t remember so much about the confidentiality as part of your training.

Do you think they were using slight dramatic licence with the confidentiality thing? I mean, even the priest confidentiality thing is a bit of a myth isn't it - I remember learning in RE that if someone actually confessed to a priest that he'd buried people under his patio, they would be honour bound as a member of society to tell the police.

festi · 04/09/2011 23:40

I very much think so mygoldfish. Im surprised she would have had so much involvement in being able to have 1:1, but possibly things have changed since then it was a long time ago maybe policy has developed.

MyGoldfishIsEvil · 05/09/2011 00:22

Yes, I agree - dh commented on them being left alone together - said at least they would leave a PO outside the door?

But then, as I recall, it was only in 97 when New Labour got in, that everything went Health & Safety crazy. (Disclaimer - not affiliated to any political party - just saying...)

lachesis · 05/09/2011 00:30

Only starting watching it because I really like Emily Watson as an actress. She gives a good performance here, as always.

Having worked in criminal law before in a place with a lot of it, it's strange how some criminals think, both as a result of their upbringing or who knows what, sometimes it's clear to see it's a factor of many things, sometimes it's not. You just learn to detach yourself from it as best you can to do the job, but cases haunt you, and all those who work with them.

Some people can be very, very manipulative, either by nature or a combination of nature and experience.

HazeltheMcWitch · 05/09/2011 00:34

I thought that A. A. was very good, very well done. And the 2 leads are amazing actors.

Imperial - Fred was indeed found guilty of killing Lucy Partington.

Also, I remember reading that not only were Fred and Rose both victims themselves of incest, but that Heather (the first killing referred to tonight) was actually the product of Rose and her own father.

All truly horrifying, and chillingly bought into yet more relevance by the cases that seem to be continuingly exposed whereby a girl or girls are kept in captivity by their own father and they bear his children. Eg the Fritzel case, and the very similar one that came to light last week or week before.

lachesis · 05/09/2011 00:40

I disagree that no one should be allowed to make films about it or discuss it because of the potential for distress.

Hell, there are already loads of shows on right now about 911 and all the people murdered or permanently affected by it.

There are tons of films and programming about The Holocaust.

These are horrible events that happened. They can be discussed or the subject of discussion and film and if it puts people on their guard all the better, IMO. If it reminds them to be vigilant, grateful, etc. then so be it.

The only guilty parties are the perpetrators.

DollyTwat · 05/09/2011 00:41

It was chilling
I know Howard Ogden the solicitor and remember when some of the girls went missing

Horribly close to home

lachesis · 05/09/2011 01:09

Most serial killers are chilling.

I only worked with one and he could pass any lie detector test because according to him, he didn't do anything wrong.

Look at Peter Tobin. It's likely he's the Bible John killer.

But keeping his silence is a means to still exert control.

He's still horribly violent, even in his 60s, in prison. He's been involved in several violent affrays and survived at least two attempts on his life by other inmates.

He only stopped appealing because of the actions of the fathers of two of his known victims, Vicky Hamilton and Dinah McNichol, both their mothers drank themselves into early graves, consumed with grief over their missing daughters, whose bodies were only discovered long after their deaths. These fathers were instrumental in changing legislation for appeals for people convicted of murdering 3 or more persons.

He still has not breathed a word about their murders, of which he's been convicted, or that of Angelika Kluk, a Polish immigrant to Scotland, whose raped, mutilated body was found in a church in Glasgow. Tobin was in his 60s at the time of her murder.

Before the new legislation, he launched three appeals for which he failed to appear, from prison, each costing the taxpayer over £100,000 for which Mr McNichol had travelled from England to be present for.

lachesis · 05/09/2011 01:12

If anything, programming like this serves to remind all that serial killers cannot ever be released. That, as of now, they are beyond rehabilitation according to any known study or formula and so should be locked up, for good, till they die.

lachesis · 05/09/2011 01:19

Rosemary West is still alive. And although a near-60-year-old woman who likes to knit in prison, it's important to remember she is a violent and sadistic serial killer, whatever her upbringing, and needs be locked up forever as no matter what her age she is a threat to society.

That's why I disagree that crimes like this should never be talked about or the subject of films or books (provided those involved in the crimes or case do not profit).

Talking about it and making films about it will not bring back the victims of such atrocities.

What it might do is keep it fresh in peoples' minds, that this can happen again, continues to happen again, and perpetrators should be incarcerated forever.

IMO, there should be moves in legislation towards a penalty of life imprisonment without the possibility of parole.

LaurieFairyCake · 05/09/2011 01:23

Don't feel too sorry for the Leach woman, she was nearly done for perjury for lying about selling her story to either the Mail or the Sun for 100k before the trial

Brilliant acting by Dominic West.

MrsBradleyCooper · 05/09/2011 08:35

Laurie - I read somewhere that she only spoke to one reporter, and used him as a confidante with the understanding that he didn't publish any of what he'd told her until the trial had ended.

I get the impression that as an inexperienced app adult, she didn't really know WHAT to do, and must have been under a huge amount of stress, especially with a large family to look after and a husband with bi-polar.

It is crazy to think that she would be expected to listen to all the vile things that West would tell her, without being able to breathe a word. Apparently all the police officers and the defending solicitor were offered counselling, but she wasn't.

I also believe that she was trying to get as many confessions out of him as possible, as she knew that he trusted her and would tell her the truth. Perhaps she felt she could encourage him to confess?

Looking forward to the next episode.

AgonyBeetle · 05/09/2011 08:43

Goldfish - priestly confidentiality is pretty much absolute, certainly in the Catholic church. Not only are they not allowed to pass on information they have heard in the confessional, but they're not allowed to act on it in any way.

See here

busybee1983 · 05/09/2011 08:45

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MugglesandLuna · 05/09/2011 09:01

I thought the acting was brilliant.

Rose was just as bad as him. She murdered his first wifes daughter (Charmaine) while Fred was still in prison.

MyGoldfishIsEvil · 05/09/2011 09:39

Agonybeetle, I stand corrected :)

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