Son unable to get up in the mornings, so much stress

[Lucyboo976]

My son has adhd, has trouble falling asleep and is a night owl. Combine that with lack of organisational skills and it produces a very stressful situation.
He is nearly 16. He finds it very hard to fall asleep. But once he goes to sleep , doesnt matter what time, it could be 11pm or 3am, he cannot wake up the next day.

If I left him he could sleep 15 hours easily. And even then its like trying to wake someone who is unconscious.
Its always been bad but its got much worse this past 12 months. He has to catch a school bus. He regularly misses it. If he does manage to catch it that involves a hugely stressful hour before hand, whilst im also trying to get myself ready and other children. I then have to drive him to the bus stop with seconds to spare. If he misses it I then need to take my other kids to school and then drive him to school afterwards making him over an hour late.
The stress this causes me is massive. It makes me ill. I cry almost every morning and once hes actually in school it takes me a good 2 to 3 hours for my nervous system to calm down. This is every single day.
Please dont tell me to try things like open his curtains, remove his duvet etc, nothing works, he is UNCONSCIOUS.

At night hes a different person. Lively and chilled and can talk about plans for the next morning.
Its half term and weve arranged to see family today at 12. He happily told me to wake him at 8am this morning.
This morning comes, woke him at 8am, its now 10.45am and hes still in bed. Everything has become so difficult because of this.

Hes also missing out on experiences with his friends. Hes very social and he sees them evening time, but they have all been out together during the day and hes asleep!!

After school comes college next year. The college for him to attend is 2 bus journeys away. His bus leaves at 7.10am.
His current bus leaves at 8am and he cant manage that.

Then comes jobs after that and him living independently. How would he ever get himself up? How would he hold down a job? It worries me sick!! There are plenty of medications to help them sleep but nothing to help them wake up!!

Its got to bad ive had to give up my job. I worked in a school myself. He was making me late every day. The choice was between me going to work and him never going to school, or me doing everything i could to get him to school and then being 2 hours late for work!!

What do we do?

Hopefully someone else will be along soon with some good advice, I hear melatonin is good for sleep regulation? You sound at the end of your tether and I understand how stressful this is because one of my friends has a teenager who is exactly the same. The impact it has on the household is massive.

Once hes actually up hes fine and hes a great kid. Causes me no other issues. Follows all the house rules and is very helpful etc.

My dd is was a bit like this.

advice:

(none of this is likely to work on it’s own but a combination may improve things).

open his curtains when you get up. Sunlight starts to cue the body into waking up.

sunrise alarm clock will do similar we had this one.
https://www.lumie.com/?gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=24230181577&gbraid=0AAAAAD_riimrtqbcrX-0ttuY7440GwYGy&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI6ubuuoTalwMViohQBh3GFwRGEAAYASAAEgKxWPD_BwE

melatonin in the evening to help him get to sleep

is he on adhd meds?

multiple alarms - sunrise plus Alexa.

you can also get alarm clocks that wake you up via shaking the pillow.

https://www.risemobility.co.uk/product/wake-n-shake-vibrating-under-the-pillow-alarm-clock/?gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=21762809966&gbraid=0AAAAADFiCi-yhmgyK_zeigpl3x0SFEjSj&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIms2Q6ITalwMVvJlQBh24-zAXEAAYBCAAEgKCXPD_BwE

finally, if that fails get a cat and make him feed it in the morning. Cats take no prisoners in getting humans up to be fed. A few mornings being woken by a claw in the face will help.

(my dd was often woken by our cats)

Make sure everything is done night before, shower done, teeth done, bag packed with breakfast bar in, shoes/blazer/coat by exit door unlaced, even sleep in uniform. So up, wee, leave.

Dd was like this. Also adhd. Whilst it doesn’t help, this is standard for adhd and teenagers combined, it’s why school as it is doesn’t work for them. Things we were able to do, were I moved my working hours to not start till 10am so I can drive her to school. She gets treated as if she’s 4yo in the morning, I do everything for her. Like your ds, she’s not like it all the time, she’s utterly wonderful of an afternoon/evening, so it’s ok. Other thing I did was absolutely no demand in the holidays, she gets up when she likes, and if that meant she missed the family thing at noon, that’s absolutely fine. She is much better now at 18.

If he can sleep for 15 hours straight he needs to go to the GP. He may have narcolepsy or another sleep disorder.

We do get everything ready the night before.
The biggest problem is he insists on having a shower and messing around with his hair. He is quite ocd and wont do anything without showering. For you and me it could take 30 mins but for him could be a 2 hour process.
He is finally up now but it makes life stressful for him and everyone else. This is the only thing im asking of him during this break, the rest of the week he can stay in bed. His brain obviously needs it , but hes missing out on so much.

You could be writing about my son. We have found focusing on fixing the nighttime routine massively helped. For him this includes taking melatonin, evening bath to relax and a sunset/sunrise alarm clock. Now he is able to get up on time most of the time with minimal issues. Although to be honest he needed the motivation to do these things, it's only since leaving school and now attending work (where he wants to be) that he has been able to fix this.

If I left him he could sleep 15 hours easily

I think it's really unlikely that this is what's going on. I think he's "going to bed" at 11pm or whatever but then staying up on his phone.

There was a study done recently in the US where uni students were paid £3 each day if they were actually asleep by a certain hour (as measured by smartwatches etc), and their academic progress measurably improved. I shared this with my 6th formers and they found it really compelling.

Could something like this work? The actual money is a token gesture, it's more the gamifying aspect of it.

Basically like a star chart for toddlers...!

Edit - you don't necessarily need to buy a smart watch, although i've got a cheap one that does sleep. You could just use the app logs on his phone that show when he was on it.

https://www.thetimes.com/uk/science/article/paying-teenagers-sleep-boosts-grades-study-63x20m65h

I could have written your post, pretty much word for word, so you have my deepest sympathy. My son is now 18 and it hasn’t got any better. We (the royal we) are trying to get him an Apprenticeship and he has to go out and knock on doors. Only, you can’t do that if you are in bed. It is so stressful trying to get him up it’s awful. I’m worried if he does secure something it will still be in us to get him up.
I have no words of advice because I agree with you that nothing works. I just want you to know you are not alone. Massive hugs.

Does ever properly feel the negative consequences of not getting up e.g. detentions for being late, missing out of activities etc? It’s madness you gave up your job as he doesn’t get up.

I’ve always been like this. I just learnt to deal with the societal expectations in my own way. School was a struggle but work was much easier - night shift for me was a doddle to do. Absolutely ruled out early shift for more than once a week. Now if I need to be up early somewhere, I either rebook, refuse it or stay up all night. (Retired 😇)

Some of us are just night owls. I’ve always thought it may be due to caveman needing someone to be alert to keep camp fire burning and predators at bay. Evolution not helped by modern day requirements.

Would be helpful if you could say what meds he is on. eg melatonin and any ADHD meds

Have you been back to GP to explain the impact to see if there is anything like a sleep disorder clinic to be referred to?

Try a lumie clock with sunrise and sunset. It’s been a game changer here for the same issues. Also exercise in the evenings has helped falling asleep earlier.

I could have written your first post op, and BaffledAndBemusedToo post.

Ds 18, nightmate to get up, mornings are mega stressful, Adhd, is hitting a really foul period too so he telks me i need to butt out but he is at risk if I don't.

Can't offer advice but can offer solidarity

Set strict bedtime and wake up times and enforce them. Make sure he has zero access to any screens in his bedroom. He needs a sensible sleep routine.

I have a DS20 and have recently found that the vibrating wristbands (marketed for kids who can’t wake up properly) have managed to wake him up when he can sleep through hours of his phone alarm right by his head.

Not necessarily. I did take dd for tests when she was 15 to see why she would sleep for 15 hours straight and nothing was ‘wrong’. I think ND teenagers are completely and utterly exhausted from having to get up at 7, all day masking and overwhelm, then can’t sleep, then up in what is for them the middle of the night again.
lol at the poster above who thinks these kids have phones at night. As if! Dd have chosen herself to put hers down at 8pm every night as it makes such a huge difference to her. No bright lights either from then.

Yes the longer sleep required is due to mental exhaustion of trying to get through each day.
He goes through phases when he is at school. He will do a few days on 5 to 6 hours sleep and then he will come in from school and crash about 6pm . Fall asleep and sleep right through to next morning . He does this on repeat.
Then through the holidays its like hes desperately trying to catch up on sleep.

He will definitely need to try and get a job that doesnt require early starts. Just got to get him to 18 first though.

It effects his life so much as hes missing out on socialising with his friends. Once he actually gets up and going its about 3pm!

Im the complete opposite to him. Im exhausted come evening time and just want to rest and chill. Thats when he comes alive.

My ds was told last year to go to the doctors or I would drag him myself. He went eventually and has an under active thyroid. He started meds and is a bit better but they need adjusting but getting him to go for a blood test is a nightmare! He's 24 🤦🏻‍♀️

when he was at school he'd come home and nap - if he'd had a stressful time he'd nap - the absolute king of naps he is. He's does manage to get up and go to work every single day but sleeps when he gets home. He is also autistic. I'm not saying this is what's up with your son but I just thought I'd mention it as it's rarer in boys.

My husband is ADHD and exactly like this. Different generation but his mum for a full time working single mum so she resorted to the old throwing a glass of water over the head 😅. In terms of adulthood he worked in pubs back shifts until he qualified as a paramedic and now works nightshift.

Tbh I used to be this person, what helped me was the sunrise clock which lots of others have mentioned. But putting it on the other side of the room, so I had to get up to turn it off and in winter having the heating on a timer so it’s not freezing cold getting up. If he could swap up his routine in winter to getting a shower the night before would massively help too, good luck!

I haven’t read the full thread so apologies if I’m repeating suggestions. I have a 16 year old teenager with ADHD that’s just like this and these are the things that have helped: restricting screen time on the phone (limits for apps each day and a cut off time at 10pm); extended release methylphenidate- we thought this might make things worse but has actually improved matters; loads of sports/ physical exercise in the day, although I appreciate that really only helps if they’re keen to do it; keeping some semblance of wake up time every day, I might try waking at 10am for example on a weekend day to keep some sense of morning, I just sit there and continue to talk to her and eventually she responds even though it takes a long while; a vibrating wrist wake up alarm. I really felt your post so much, the absolute desperation to get them up and to school. It’s really sad that it’s caused you to lose your job :(

Bucket of water?
JLB Party Speaker playing music on max volume?