Care order for 17 year old?????

[Dadgivingup]

Dear mums... I could really use some help here, especially if any are well-versed in the law. Plus, I want a mum's perspective.

DD turned 17 back in February. A few days ago DD and I had a bit of an alchol-fueled argument over her marks and she left.

After bombarding her with calls, come to find out, she's been staying with a former friend of mine's who is a bit over a year younger than me (I'm 35). They first met when she was almost 16, and several months later I noticed they both often would talk about each other unprovoked. She's currently not dating a boy around her own age to my knowledge (15-19).

This man in the recent past has gone to Thailand multiple times and boasted to me about all the 17/18 year olds he hooked up with. I know he also does drugs like cocaine and ketamine. Despite the fact she was a 100% legal girl/woman/whatever by the time I found all this out, I immediately cut all ties with this guy and she never saw him again.

Her DM thinks I'm overreacting since she's a "grown adult woman" now, so I'm refusing to even give my ex another second.

I'm extremely concerned about her, but it feels like all legal protections like care orders only apply to under-17's, but "parental responsibility" ends at 18. What responsibilities do I really have over her if I can't even get a care order anymore???? What can I do to bring her home????

Alternatively, should I just let her go and use this as a learning experience like her DM suggests? It seems like most threads I've read on here have issues with teen ages gaps like 15/16/17 or 16/18, but 17 year olds are viewed as adults here.

I was 18 and DM was 16 when she was conceived. I just don't want her to make the same mistakes her parents did, but with a guy about twice her age and who should know better.

• A petrified dad

Absolutely NOT. I'm saying that you originally implied he was 17, then admitted he could have been 16, but now you've changed that back to thinking maybe he was 17 (wonder why...?). You were trying to insinuate that an almost adult was preying on your daughter which justified you battering him. When actually there might have been mere months between them. Either way your violence was unwarranted and unforgivable.

Where did I say you laid a hand on her mum? However, I would be very interested in speaking to her mum to see how your behaviour (verbally and physically) actually was towards her. I'd bet her version differs to yours.

STOP TRYING TO JUSTIFY YOUR ASSULT ON A MINOR.

THIS IS NOT JUSTIFIABLE.

Regardless of what you say he was under 18 therefore a minor.

FYI
In the UK, you can typically start driving lessons at 17 years old. However, you can apply for a provisional driving license at 15 years and 9 months old. If you receive the enhanced rate of the mobility component of Personal Independence Payment (PIP), you may be able to start driving lessons at 16.
So very well could have been 16!

I wasn't trying to insinuate anything, it's just that particular time was a bit of a blur for me and I get a bit fuzzy on details, but I'm pretty sure he was getting close to his driving test from what DD said back then.

In hindsight I wish I let them date. The age gap was minimal (1.5-2 years) and I didn't have any reason to think he was a bad kid. Wouldn't you agree?

The age gap was less than that. You said it was late 2023 and she was a couple of months of 16. So she was turning 16 in (about) Feb 2024. And so born in Feb 2008. He was in lower sixth and so was born at some point between 1st September 2006 and 31st August 2007. So somewhere between 6 months and 18 months older than her.

Anyway hopefully she will choose to live with her grandparents. She may not though - someone like your poor dd who has never been properly cared for and has witnessed unprovoked violence is very vulnerable to manipulation.

The "almost adult" thing I see often on here confuses me and was one of the things that made me lose it almost 2 years ago. Is 17 an adult or a similar peer to a 15/16 year old?

What if he was held back a year for some reason?

Update: she texted me back and she's going straight to her grandparents. I'll be dropping off some of her stuff tomorrow. Just like how my dad retained trauma from my grandfather dying when he was 15/16 and probably should not have had kids, his son turned out the same way.

I'm starting to think 17/33 is a better age gap based on the responses here than 15/17.

You don't get it, do you?

It doesn't matter if he was 15, 18, or 98. You assaulted him only because you perceived him to be weaker than yourself. You've already admitted you wouldn't dare assault your friend because you would be too evenly matched, and you might not win.

You are a bully. A vile, disgusting bully.

You need to get help before you ruin your daughter more than you already have.

In a similar peer group.
As a parent you start to let the apron strings go abit. A bit more freedom, staying out more and trusting them to be where they say they are. Ie not checking with parents they are there.
As a parent you should be helping to give them the tools to navigate into adulthood.
Almost an adult yes as they are close to 18, however not an adult as in the eyes af tha law they are a minor before 18.

What you see on here is parents trying to figure out going from parenting a child to parenting someone who is about to become an adult. It isn't an easy transition as all teenagers have several different levels of maturity on any given day.

Ultimately if you want her back you need to show her things are different not just say they will be

17 is a CHILD, stop trying to convince yourself that what you did was okay because the BOY may or may not have been nearly 18. You battered a CHILD there is nothing you can say that can ever justify it.

If you don't like the fact your daughter is with this MAN, why aren't you going round there battering HIM? Oh wait... you've already admitted that would be harder! A violent drunk bully and a coward.

So year 13 boys can be beaten by men in their 30s but year 12 girls can't be in contact with men in their 30s and need their dads to get a court order to keep them home?

Why not? Boxing considers 17 an adult. You can also be sent to war at 17 and fight wars for American oligarchs in the Middle East.

This is the first I'm ever hearing so much concern regarding 17 year olds. In 2006 you were expected to have more in common with a 35 year old than a 15 year old. They weren't even fully considered youths by the court system until 2014 after a rash of suicides caused Parliament to act.

Why such a massive change in less than 20 years?

Ask your parents that last question.

How is your daughter? Have you seen or spoken to her since she went to the grandparents?

It's legal for your 17 year old daughter to have sex with a man in his 30s too. Doesn't make it right though does it? Otherwise you wouldn't be here posting about it.

My parents are refusing to let me see her. The last voice message I received from my mum could be summarized as "I had to buy a pregnancy test for your daughter" and "stay away from us".

17 and 33 is fine I guess in our society. Way better than 15.75/17.

Talk to your MP's if you don't like it.

Good, it sounds like they are looking after her.

Now stop arguing about what relative age difference you think is appropriate and spend some time working out how to sort this out with her and be the sort of father that she deserves.

That's society dictating the appropriate age gap, not my meaningless opinion.

She'll be better off with my parents. Her nan was a good mum.

Of course a 15 year old can have a boyfriend. Technically they can't sleep with each other, but they can still be boyfriend and girlfriend.

He wouldn't have gone to prison for having sex with a nearly 16 year old. And none of that makes your assault on him legal.

The good news is that the poor girl is now completely away and safe from her dad. It looks like her grandparents also understand just how much damage he has done to her so are aware that they need to keep him away.

Because I didn't let her date a 17 year old when she was in yr11?

Because you dealt with it by criminal assault, and also have a history of drunken verbal aggression.

Your daughter is well rid of you. The fact that your parents told you to stay away speaks volumes. Seek professional help and leave your daughter alone. You have damaged her enough.