Move from boys grammar to mixed comp??

[HalleyH]

Apologies in advance for what I’m sure will be a long post - I’m trying to sort things in my own mind and would appreciate knowing your thoughts too…

My son is in year 8 and is one of the older ones in the year. He is at a selective all boys grammar school - he is doing really well academically but has never really settled and hasn’t made any friends. He find the alpha male/footbally boys environment hard.

Is is very creative and quirky and doesn’t seem to fit the traditional mainstream grammar mould. He has been struggling a lot with his mental health in terms of anxiety and depression - often finding it hard/impossible to be at school. We are also currently looking at an autism diagnosis.

Outside of school it feels as though he can be his true self and has a large group of friends out of school - a mixture of both sexes, but most of them older than him.

His group of older friends are also equally quirky and creative and all go to the local mixed comprehensive.

After being on the waiting list for a year a space has finally come up at the mixed comprehensive - we are unsure what to do…

He is achieving great grades at his current grammar but is ultimately unhappy. But will it be better in Year 9 when he starts his GCSEs and is in smaller classes? Will he push himself at the mixed comprehensive? I’m worried that he’ll still not fit in as he’ll be academically ahead. And the friends he has at the school are all in older year groups. But we don’t know until we try… but if we try and move schools then we can’t move back again…

I feel so torn as to what is best… I need a crystal ball!

It sounds like the main issue is undiagnosed autism. He’s struggling with anxiety, depression and social exclusion. Poor kid.

If you think a change of school will help with all of those issues, then do it. Just be prepared for it not to work.

It’s so difficult when they’re on the brink of school refusal. I have a lot of sympathy for you and him.

Thank you - yes it feels like being stuck between a rock and hard place.
He’s creative, quirky, very mature in his outlook; sometimes to the point of being a little arrogant when others don’t match his viewpoint. He has a lot of similarly minded neurodivergent friends at the other school; so even if his grades aren’t as good I know he’ll have friends.
Its the not knowing if we’ll end up with a worse situation… but without trying we won’t know and it doesn’t feel like it can get much worse at the moment.

I think you should not move him. I don't think the change is guarenteed to fix what is making him unhappy and may ruin things in his life which are making him more happy.

If his friends are in the year above there is no guarantee they will welcome him to the school. It's not usual for people to befriend those in the junior year groups. Plus you run the risk of his friends leaving when he's in an exam year. I think you are storing up trouble.

If it were just a matter of getting a worse academic record in exchange for a better social situation that would be simpler but even then, even if he had friends in his year you have no guarantee the change of school won't make things worse.

Yes, this is big factor in not being so sure about the other school.
At the moment we make sure that he has plenty of opportunities to see his friends outside of school, but I think he still feels like an outsider then as they all have the school connection.
He does know quite a few people in his own year from primary school although they were never close friends.

Grammar schools in an area do not mean that the other schools are secondary moderns with low aspirations and low attainment. Certainly not where I live.

Have a look at the subjects the school offers at GCSE and A, and at the school's results. Do they reflect what you think your ds can achieve? Are they high enough that the school will push able children to achieve high results?

Talk to the Head of Transition/Head of Y9/Pastoral Lead at the comp and discuss the situation and your concerns. Do this asap before term ends.

Its the not knowing if we’ll end up with a worse situation… but without trying we won’t know and it doesn’t feel like it can get much worse at the moment.

All you can do is make the decision that feels best at the time. Yes it’s a gamble, but you don’t have a crystal ball.

Believe it or not there are some really clever kids that don’t go to grammar schools, u u may find he isn’t the most advanced.
Life’s too short to be miserable, let him go to the school where he has a chance of fitting in.

Thank you all for all of your thought, advice and support - it really means a lot and has been incredibly helpful to hear mixed thoughts and experiences. I’ll ring the school in the morning and see where we go from there…

Year 8 is a good time to move. Do it now before everything steps up a gear in years 9 and 10. You'll be grateful you tackled it sooner rather than later.

If he’s so miserable he’s started refusing school how much worse do you think it could get at the comp?

I'd move him. Being at a school where he has friends and can be himself is massively important, not just for his happiness right now (which is crucial) but for building his sense of self and his social skills for life. Get him in before the GCSE curriculum starts in earnest.

My main concern is the reason why he’s not happy. My kids go to grammar schools (different country but similar system) and there are way more arty/quirky kids there than at the mixed comprehensive. Also if his friends are older he won’t have much opportunity to mix with them at school. You need to find out what his year group is like.

My experience is that a lot of parents are very anti selective schools and very quick to tell you to leave them. Whereas if it was a different type of school you’d get more balanced responses. My DS didn’t really enjoy his grammar school from Y7-8 and we offered him the chance to move but we were realistic with him about what the alternative school was like, which was easier as his cousins go there. A good number of rough kids, a huge focus on discipline which his current school doesn’t need because the kids are focused and well behaved. That he could absolutely still do well but he’d be in a small group of talented kids rather than surrounded by them. His cousins have struggled being tempted by socialising rather than studying as their friends don’t have the same aspirations. Whereas our kids have been surrounded by hard workers and it is normalised. Some kids have the personality to not mind standing out and being different, others prefer to fit in with the crowd. If your DS doesn’t like feeling different to the sporty kids, how will he cope if he’s a lot more academic than his year group and stands out that way? If he’s a little arrogant with his opinions he could find himself a target of bullying.

I don’t agree with the ‘finding their tribe’ mentality. My kids have a range of friends from different areas in their lives so when one group is a bit challenging they have others to turn to.

Ultimately my DS decided to stay at his current school and now he has a really good group of friends there and is happy. He really found his confidence when he became one of the senior students rather than one of the younger ones.

Good luck with your decision.

I would definitely discuss this with your DS and listen as been through our own version of this and I'm so sorry you have this dilemma. It's a shame the grammar hasn't suited him friend-wise as our DS's grammar has a better mix of quirkier types and easy friendships compared to his school before; but even if you could say manage to change your DS' class it sounds like he might never enjoy it.

I once spoke to a counsellor for advice in similar circumstances and she said with school refusal the best thing is to listen and remove them asap if there's a school that might suit better (she also shared a helpful picture of mental health in nearby schools we were considering as some had more pupils needing counselling and other issues and she gave our choice full support saying it tended not to have many issues and we never looked back ) .
Also it is so positive your DS has those friends outside school and I really hope you manage to find an environment to rebuild him . Our DS was almost happier overnight when moved but it was so stressful knowing what to do and I know it is never easy to guess how things will pan out . I would always put their happiness first though and your DS sounds brilliant and likely to carry on doing well academically so I would probably take the risk. (also could you try and leave it open to come back to the grammar if you explain how delighted you've been with their care and teaching and try and keep them on board with the reasons you think a change might be needed )

Tough dilemma OP! I have no strong opinions on the school part but I do feel strongly that you shouldn't hide the fact that he has a place at the new school. If he ever found out (even years down the line) I think it would damage your relationship. Good luck!!

I'm a teacher in a mixed comp. I would say move him.asap. His wellbeing is paramount. Bright kids will achieve.

I work in mental health and would say 100% move him if he's unhappy where he is. Not only will he most likely ultimately perform better in exams if he's happier at the new school, but you don't get those years back. If he has no friends at his current school and feels on the periphery the long-term impact may stay with him into the next stage of his life and affect his mental health, self-esteem etc.

I work with young adults who crash when they leave school and very often the origins of depression and anxiety are their early experiences of secondary school. There is no point having perfect exam results if you are unhappy (and perfectionism at school can be a defence/reaction to not fitting in). This may not be relevant to your DS but just wanted to give a perspective from further down the line.

What swung it for us in the end was when discussing it with our son we said what if you move to the other school and you don't like it either and he said that nothing could be worse than where he was.

I think this will be our sons view too

Thank you - this is very much what I fear could happen if he stays in his current school.

Thank you - lots of food for thought.
i think a new school and fresh start in September would be good for all of us. He’s so low and miserable and every day is a struggle which is no fun for any of us. At least knowing he has the support of friends at the new school will buoy him up to be there hopefully

Does the new school offer the GCSEs he wants to do? Are there any drama/music/art clubs he could join at his current school if he’s creative, to help him settle? Would he have much contact with the older friends if he moved? How difficult for you and your boy, I hope it all works out well whatever you decide.

Move him. The MH problems are already a red flag.
The teaching won't be worse and there will be very bright, hardworking children there. Often they've just not had parents who can afford tutors etc.
He's already got a friendship group. If he's motivated, he'll do well.

I agree with you, and the sooner you act, the better.

I’d speak to him and be honest that there is a place available and see what he says and ideally organise a trial session asap.

it’s two years down three to go, three years is a lifetime at this age. On balance I’d probably move.

I think having taken the weekend to sort through my own throughts and discuss with my husband we’re ready to talk to our son later today and see what he thinks…