If your child doesn’t have a phone…

[Atissue123]

How did you handle it? DD is 11 and in year 6 and we are currently planning not to get her a phone for starting secondary school. We may get her an old fashioned brick phone but definitely not a smart phone of her own.she does have other tech eg a laptop, computer games and access to an iPad. She uses all of those things responsibly.

There are many reasons for us not wanting to give her a phone yet but I’m wondering how others have navigated not giving their teen / tween one. I’ve read about having a ‘spare phone’ which They can used when they go out and need to contact home etc which seems a good idea but any other tips or suggestions on how to make this not ‘the absolute end of the world’ for a 12 year old when the time comes? I keep mentioning the fact that Apple and Microsoft bosses both don’t give their kids phones until 14 so I think she’s probably already expecting we will say no for some time yet. I will of course explain why we are choosing to do this with her.

i know it’s not the norm although interestingly I’m seeing more and more about this (ironically) in the press and social media because people are becoming more aware of the dangers of tech and social media at too young an age.

I agree that the world for teens would be better if phones weren’t the default. Loads of parents actually don’t want their kids to have them and only allow it because everyone else has one. My DD is year 7 and gets no screen time at all apart from for homework and the odd movie night. People are aghast when they find out but she actually likes that it makes her different. Although most of her friends have phones, loads aren’t allowed social media, TikTok etc. My plan is to give her one in year 8 but with very limited functionality.

@Atissue123 14 was when the eldest got one for their birthday. As I say, they genuinely dodged a bullet compared to their friends with phones and how they all acted. I told them to just tell their friends it was all my fault and that they thought I was Amish or something. It made it a lot easier for them and they got sympathy as well for their horrible parents. They just didn't tell their friends they had no desire whatsoever to be on Tik Tok and WhatsApp.

I did lend them a phone a couple of times when they needed one for something specific iirc.

Yes, he's just texting. We don't have WhatsApp enabled on the phone at the moment. He hasn't come to us and said "all my friends are using WhatsApp to talk and I want to use it too".

Christ such dramatic posts. I'm probably much younger than most women here and I did not have a phone, laptop or social media. I grew up in a village too, when most other kids were from town. I was not pushed out of friendship groups and never bullied. OP I'd give her a basic phone and just watch how it goes for now. Absolutely no need to stress.

As for 'lessons', how does this not provide lessons re peer pressure, conforming etc. Why should she care if other kids think she's weird? If she's bullied at school because she's not on silly apps, it's not the apps that are the issue.

Many years ago when DS was about 6/7, I felt so strongly about trying to prevent him access to social media/gaming etc for as long as humanly possible, that I paid to speak to a Dr who worked in adolescent technology addiction - I felt there was so much conflicting info out there, I wanted to hear from the source how to avoid the pitfalls.

One of the key takeaways was that you cannot avoid technology/social media. This is the world we - they are - in. That your main responsibility is to create a healthy model for them, keep them safe whilst they explore.

Don’t see particularly dramatic posts? And it’s not that a teen will be “bullied for not being on silly apps” it’s more subtle than that.

If everyone else communicates via their phones without one you get left out - even by nice friends. That was what was beginning to happen to dd1. Our rule was making her sad and damaging her relationships with her peers which is everything to a young teen. She even wrote us a letter about it. I don’t love it that my teens have phones but this is the world they need to navigate.

Sorry, I should have said that she uses all the things apart from TikTok and Insta since she is 11 (July birthday), so one of the youngest.

Mine had phones but didn’t take them to school until year 8. Largely due to the fact that I knew they’d get lost or broken. They could use them at home though. They weren’t the only ones and it wasn’t really a huge issue. A bit if nagging here and there.

I think people also forget sometimes that a phone doesn't need to be the devil and no phone the ultimate ideal.

When DD got her smartphone it came with restrictions, we always know the password, we can check randomly (nearly daily when she was young), it can go away when we think she missuses SM, her Insta pictures don't show her face and she had to get permission to upload, she only accepts requests of people she physically knows. All app requests have to go through us as well.
The phone and her laptop are down from dinner time unless it's the weekend, then she can have it until bedtime. No electronics at mealtimes.

She has periods where it is in use a lot and periods where she is busy with other things.

It's about teaching how to be responsible with technology. Nobody has a switch and suddenly you know how to deal with SM unless you are taught and that's my job as a parent.

We definitely saw the impact on her only having a phone to call and text and also when one of her friends at secondary didn't have a phone at all. You don't know the parents anymore, you can't reach them when they are off to do their things and meet with others. Secondary school friendship is a whole different cattle of fish. A phone enables them to learn to be independent from you.

Children in secondary school need to start to be independent - part of this is controlled phone use.

At our school

• all homework is assigned by app and is largely completed on the apps.

Detentions assigned by app Achievements are given by app

Amongst my teens peers -
All social arrangements are made by messenger or what's app

My teen coaches and trains 4 x a week. Attendance, training schedules and lifts shares are all done via an app.

Whilst you are absolutely right to be concerned about phone use and to monitor it, but the reality is your child will miss out on so much if you don't get them a phone

We had Apple the family controls were brilliant. We switched the phone off at 8 initially and later 10. We restricted social media to 2 hours a day and could restrict adult content. We all agreed to use "find your phone" that we found admins each other if required.

We did the brick it didn't work

I think it's really wrong that schools do this. They want children to spend less time on phones but schools make them spend more time on screens!

Life is conducted on screens nowadays. You really think that schools shouldn't take advantage of the convenience, immediacy and cost saving of technology, and everything should still be done on paper?

They want children to spend less time on phones but schools make them spend more time on screens!

It takes up a lot of resources to print out loads of worksheets for homework. I can see why they do it.

The workplace is now mostly internet based. Even the interaction between citizens and government (whether local or central) is mostly online now.
The fact that schools are moving to an app-based working system only reflects this, and prepares the children to navigate the real world

Yes of course. So they use apps instead, which passes the cost to parents.
Workbooks made by the LA or the Education Department would be a good cheap alternative!

Yes, I see your point. But children really don't need to use home work apps to be able to cope in the workplace when they leave school.

And as for "the workplace" being internet based, that does depend on where you work!

Workbooks made by the LA or the Education Department would be a good cheap alternative!

Who would fund those?
Schools are hugely underfunded to pay for them. Do they pass the cost on to parents? And what about parents who can't or won't pay for them?

The LA don't have the funds to provide them for free.

We’re making the same choice OP.

As I see it there are two bad options.

1. No smartphone and some mockery from friends and being left out of wattsapp chats.
2. Having a smartphone and being exposed to hardcore violent porn forwarded on wattsapp chats, and also some cyber bullying.

I don’t know any teen with a smartphone who hasn’t been sent violent porn. I even know a year six girl who’s regularly sent penis photos.

I’m not sure which is worse but I am leaning towards allowing my child to be somewhat left out socially.

It does depend a bit on the school. Most schools round here ban phones between 8am - 4om but one school doesn’t get the issue and asks pupils to use them during lesson time 🤦‍♀️

Our DD is 12 and in year 8

We found a balance that works: DD has a phone and we use "Family Link "
Took forever to set up but it works for us .
She can make calls and text
She has "always allowed " apps such as her journaling / mindfulness

All social media including what's app in not accessible

If she needs google or wants to play a game I get a request to my phone /watch to approve for 15 mins / an hour / or all day

The request will also go to other named contacts (dad)
It takes me all of a couple of seconds ... comes up on my phone amd my watch and even if I'm in the middle of a meeting no one notices me tap to approve or decline

It may come over as harsh but we made a decision, which was very hard, to not have social media inc what's app in her life for now . She's Autistic and very vulnerable. She misinterprets messages often and has when offered the opportunity spoken to strangers in an unsafe situation.
If dd didn't have these vulnerabilities my decision would remain.
Her older sisters now 26 and 30 tell me they are glad they didn't have all this to contend with growing up .
Dd was very upset to begin with but we included her in the conversations early on before high school
Nowadays she owns it and is proud. She still has a phone . She can message and text us and her friends and we allow screen time to relax after homework ect
Hope you find the way that works for you too whatever that will be.

Kids need a phone at secondary. Some schools use them in lessons. She will be bullied. A'brick' will be no better. Do you really want her to have a bad start at secondary?

You may find she needs one though for secondary.
More and more they use their phones for school apps, tassomi comes immediately to mind. And they sometimes access these during lessons

Yes I think this is brilliant tbh..the fact you held off getting phones and they watched others fall into the SM bullying trap so then when they finally got phones, they were savvy to the dangers. I am impressed!

I just discussed this with DH and he agrees too. He says there is no rush to expose them to the stuff they will likely be exposed to. There's alot of dangerous misinformation out there, and these people target young influential minds. eg, mysogeny, and radicalisation. There's often stuff like this cropping up on the news, warnings to parents of teens. All so dangerous to mental health and even physical safety.

My DH is an online teacher and they have to report all safeguarding concerns. They have been told that the latest trend on Tictoc is a video encouraging kids to mix prescription drugs with fizzy drinks to get a high. Pretty much like the catering gas canisters that are getting more and more common.. probably originating on Tictoc!

At our ds's school, they are sometimes allowed to use phones in lessons. But not everyone has a phone so they always have an alternative. From what he has said, in year 7 at least a third do not have a smart phone available to use in class. Ds does have a smart phone but he can't use it in class because we haven't enabled a browser and he can't install apps himself.

So far, ds does not seem to have experienced any adverse social effects from our stance on social media use. I wonder if that is different with girls or is just a quirk of the crowd that he hangs out with.