My sons behaviour is intolerable

[spk68]

Hello
I am just lost to know what to do with my 14 year old- soon to be 15. He is honestly the rudest meanest most toxic person I have ever met. He belittles all of us in the family, me his dad and brothers. Picks their weaknesses and mocks them - you’re fat , you’re thick, you’ve got a bald patch etc etc. He sneers at us, won’t talk to us unless he wants something, and has a way of making everyone feel rubbish. we have tried every thing- taking his gadgets away, sending him to bed, chores but nothing works. It’s now making my DH and me ill. DH says he wants him out but he’s 14. The atmosphere in the house is awful. I do not know what to do. DH told him last night that he has to go but he has nowhere to go. But the truth is he’s making our lives impossible. I just need some help/ advise/ suggestions how to turn this boy into a decent human being. I’m worried about how he will form relationships as he’s so mean.

Is he undiagnosed adhd? He sounds like he might be extremely insecure. If you say you’re all academics maybe he feels he doesn’t fit in (feels rejection on some level) with you all?
I would talk to the school and seek therapy immediately. If he refuses you and your husband should go. Be empathetic and love bomb. I don’t get the feeling from your post you both love him unconditionally. Teenagers need to feel this.

My now 18 year old was obnoxious from the ages of about 14 to 16. His relationship with me was particularly awful. I still don't know why but we have found out that he has dyslexia and ADHD, both of which were discovered now he is at university. I think maybe clinging on academically while getting no help for these problems was causing him huge stress. He is actually a pleasure to be around now (most of the time). Not suggesting your son has similar issues but maybe there is an issue that is stressing him out. Taking gadgets away from son never worked, it just fuelled his anger.

Sounds like you had it easy with the elder two and now you are being challenged by the youngest and going about it the totally wrong way. He's clearly unhappy about something and seeking attention and acting out with bad behaviour to get it. When kids are young they want any kind of attention even if ita bad attention so theyl be naughty and maybe he's carried this on.

I find it so wrong telling a 14 year old child they have to move out. Hes a young kid. Hes likely craving your love and attention and is then being told he can move out which will make him feel even worse.

Are you overly strict with him in comparison to his friends parents? Do you both independently and together spend time with him doing nice/fun things to try build a positive relationship?

@Abbsie

What is your reaction to DH telling him to go? Are you judging your husband or do you agree?

If you both think he should go, then there is none in the house putting the child's needs first so you need to contact social services. They won't take him away. They will offer you a suite of parenting courses to help you understand teenage behaviour and enable you to improve your parenting and rebuild your family relationship.

If you disagree with your DH, then at least one oarent is putting teens needs at the centre of your thoughts. You may still benefit from the support of social services parenting courses.

Thus isn't something you'll learn from a thread on a forum board. You probably need a complete overhaul of your parenting style and methods.

You will be able to get through this though. Ternagers can be little shits, but they do get through it.

The answer is not to threaten throwing him out. That's only going to further damage an already fractured relationship. Good luck.

This. Excellent insight and advice.

As a very general rule, people who put other people down do so because they have no self esteem and feel bad about themselves. So try to bring everyone down to their level to grab a modicum of self worth.

Parenting like yours unfortunate merely confirms to him that he is indeed unworthy. Even your 'solution' in the heart to heart chat reinforces this.

Poor kid.

[quote YukoandHiro]@UserBot9to5 With most families having at least one parent working from home, how is that even possible as a solution? [/quote]
Good point. I work at work, so I didn't think of that when I typed it. I have been tempted to get rid of the internet though, to save my son from himself. But my other child kicks off when I suggest that and I've nobody to back me up.

I have been so loving to my son. He knows he's loved but he has decided to shut me out. His choice. I can't ''bring him back in by love bombing him''. I think it would lessen his respect for me which seems to be minimal and make the situation worse. Like he'd think, I can be like this and people will still be all lovey bomby to me. No.

He's pushing you away before you can push him away as a form of emotional defense. Something else is very wrong, he wants to tell you but can't for fear of rejection. His behavior is a self fulfilling prophecy, so when and if he is asked to leave he can believe you and your DH never wanted him there as it won't hurt so much.
Do you tell him you love him and always will and nothing he chooses to do in life or who he chooses to do it with will ever change that?
There is so much crap more than ever about boys having to be tough and strong and not show any emotions ever, believing that bullshit will only set him up for a life of misery.

I am always telling him I love him. Constantly tell him that he is is own person and he's got a lot of positives ( he can be very affectionate particularly with me)
I do want him to open up to us and try to be really affectionate but then he will be so horrible
My middle son is so frustrated with him- he wants to live his brother and shows him affection but then my youngest will say something hurtful
I'm not averse to going to parenting classes. I will do anything to fix this but I cannot put up with the nastiness ( you're fat , dads fat, brother is losing hair , brother is fat blah blah blah )

You've not mentioned violence or drugs or shouting at girls friends. Just name calling - you're fat/ugly etc. is that all it is? Tbh if so I'm wondering why you all seem to take this to heart? It's the stuff of little kids - 'you're a poo' etc. Surely you don't take it seriously? You deflect it, laugh at it, or adopt a self-deprecating line of 'yeah but I'm lovely inside which is what counts!' 'Yeah I'm fat but I still love you' 'yeah dads losing his hair but I still love him' etc

we have tried every thing- taking his gadgets away, sending him to bed, chores

Well, you have tried every punishment and every threat but punishment and threats doesn't seem to be working. So you do need to find something else.

He's not badly behaved at school - nor brilliant but actually school is not the issue. It's the way he us with us.

Then have you considered family counselling with him? The problem isn't just him, if he was the only problem then he would be a problem everywhere. Part of the problem seems to be that he doesn't behave like his brothers and you don't understand why he doesn't behave like them, he probably doesn't understand why either, and you don't know how to cope with that.

It's really not that uncommon to have one child in the family whose personality and needs are different from the other children, who doesn't fit in to the family as easily as the others, and who really needs to be parented in a slightly different way for whatever reason. And when he doesn't get that, you get more rude and unkind behaviour from him and more punishment from you and it becomes a vicous circle . A parenting course is another way to get give you some insight into the way his needs might be different from the others and some alternative strategies to try.

All 3 of them are different but we do expect him to be like them in terms of values and kindness.

Exactly You expect him to be like his brothers when he relates to you, to his father and to his brothers. You don't know what to do with a boy who doesn't have the same approach to family relationships.

I cannot put up with the nastiness ( you're fat , dads fat, brother is losing hair , brother is fat blah blah blah )

One simple thing you can decide to do is to label it in a calm voice - "that's a put down" and not react further. What it (usually) really means underneath is "I'm upset about something and I want someone else to feel as upset as I do because that's the only way I have to put my feelings across". In the long run he will need to find a better way, but that may mean family counselling, or developing his emotional communcation in some other way.

Sorry - hit send too soon. One last thing -

This book's an "oldie but goodie" for well-balanced and effective parenting in this kind of situation. It's an all ages book despite the young child on the cover. I hope it helps!

@THisbackwithavengeance

People will tell you to take their phones off them, shut down wifi, punish, punish, punish.. that might work for some kids but not others.

It didn't work for mine tbh.

One thing that really helped us when DS1 was going through his turbulent period was walking.

I used to walk with him at night. I would frame it as a walk to the garage or 24 hour supermarket to buy goodies which of course he would agree to. There was no attempt to talk. In fact we both had headphones on and listened to music. DS1 and I are both fast walkers so we would end up speed walking for miles and trying to outdo each other. Gradually the headphones came off and we started chatting. This happened over a period of many months, perhaps twice a week and it really, really helped our relationship and helped him to be able to admit his fears of the future, anxiety etc which he has now largely overcome.

He was a school refuser for 2 years but now goes to college, works part time and is doing well.

There is light at the end of the tunnel I promise.

This. Walking without the expectation of having to chat is really therapeutic....and not just for teens. Good luck op it sounds very hard.

Is boarding school an option OP?

I don't know the ins and outs of schools there as I'm outside of UK.

Myself and my 3 siblings all went to boarding school. Quite a lot of kids who were there were quite impossible at home. I think living with those going through similar to you does help get your mind straight. Ours was quite strict and there were always consequences to actions.

You need to build a relationship with him of unconditional positive regard. Google it.

The more you and your dh dislike him the worse his behaviour will be.

I feel you pain my 17 year old just went into a huge strop/ tirade of verbal abuse because I asked him to put his cereal away! 15 minutes over a 5 word request.

Roll on when he's 18 and I can move house without him!

His dad is bloody useless too!

Can't wait for the day he leaves.

I’d recommend family therapy, or individual therapy for you and DH if you really can’t get him there.

So often I sit down with a family for the first session and they each have their own perspective on what is going on in the home and who is the ‘problem’ - I can almost guarantee that your DS has his own opinions on why he is behaving this way and what he’s trying to communicate to you.

I think I lot of behaviour that you’re describing is probably picked up via a friendship circle. Teenage boys, Internet, the culture of insulting each other for laughs - it’s the norm these days. He’s probably just applying this to everyone, because from what you’ve said calling people names seems to be the issue. Of course, you don’t want your child insulting his family and that’s fair. Does he seem jokey when he says it or vicious? If it’s the jokey thing then it may just be that’s his humour and personality, not everyone will appreciate this though so he does need to learn there is a time and place but that will come with time and experience.

I’d have a discussion about the reasons insulting is a hard NO in your house, and that you understand it may be part of his sense of humour but there is a time and place for it and the family home isn’t it, and if he does it then no phone/WiFi/PlayStation.

[quote YukoandHiro]@UserBot9to5 With most families having at least one parent working from home, how is that even possible as a solution? [/quote]
You can change a password so he can't log in.

Constantly tell him that he is is own person and he's got a lot of positives

Ouch! That comes with a built-in "but...". Don't give backhanded compliments - just directly praise the good (or the not-godawful!) as soon as you see it. "That was really kind/helpful/generous/whatever".

(he can be very affectionate particularly with me)

Could there be some male competition going on, competition which your youngest feels permanently placed to lose since the rest of you are more "academic" than he is? Perhaps in his eyes his older brothers have already won all the prizes that you and his father care about and he can't keep up or be appreciated for himself.

'How to really love your teenager' by Ross Campbell.
Strongly recommend this book. It all about does the child FEEL loved. Don't matter if you say it, show it in all the ways YOU think show love...if the kid doesn't feel it (they may have a different love language that you as the parent is not speaking to them in) there's a problem!

5 different love languages are....physical touch/quality time/words of affirmations/gifts/acts of service.

All behaviour is communication. He's telling you that he's desperately unhappy. I know how hard it is, I really do, but you need to love him with all you've got. And don't stop. There's clearly some major issues at play and you need to keep digging until you find out what's going on. Ask for help - from Social Services, school, anyone you think can intervene. But, most of all, love him with you've got. Good luck

I’ll be honest he sounds unpleasant but it’s all quite minor. Have you asked him why he calls you names and how it makes him feel when people call him names?

Because I think someone somewhere is… he’s not thieving, doing digs, destroying things, being physically abusive, failing school, treating others out of the house badly etc etc… I think you’re a long way from get out the house although I agree the behaviour needs checked.

Is your DH his dad? I know others have asked but I missed your answer. I can't quite believe you're only obstacle to putting a 14-yr-old out of the house is that he would have nowhere to go. He's still a child. He's different from your other DCs but needs more love and support not less. Your other DCs did not go through lockdown and a pandemic at the same stage of live that he did. You need to change your expectations. Take putting him out of his home off the table. Forget your 'academic' expectations. Your job is to mirror loving, supportive relationships. That includes your relationship to him.
Lots of good practical advice from other posters concerning walking; books to read; family counselling. It's time for you to step up not step away.