13 year old and £2500 gaming charges

[squaresausage]

I’m in shock. It has came to light my son has racked up £2500 on fortnite and other games on both the Xbox and Nintendo switch. He has stolen my husbands bank details to do this. In addition he has set up a paypal account which he has been transferring money to spend on these games over a period of time, starting in October and ramping up through January and February. He is distraught and described it as a horrible addiction. My husband does not check his bank statements in any detail and only realised he couldn’t purchase cinema tickets today as his bank account is empty. I’m at a loss how to handle this in the most effective way. He has been undergoing CBT for OCD and is in all other ways a hard working and pleasant boy. Involving the police would involve a criminal record at his age. He has promised to pay it back, but I can’t see how he can. Has anybody had a similar experience?

I don’t check my bank account often. Isn’t blaming the parents a form of victim blaming?

Anyway, personally I wouldn’t involve the police. Not sure what the school can do.

On one hand, all his actions including the stealing sounds deliberate and knowing.

One the other hand, he’s 13, and kids don’t know the value of money at that age, and kids sometimes lie and steal at that age. It’s part of growing up.

Part of growing up is also having to deal with the consequences of your actions and you seem to be putting them in place. Not sure if the companies can do anything about it without the police getting involved though.

Hopefully this will be a big lesson for him, and there are plenty of good adults who come out on the other side. I think you physical activities will also be good for him so he gets to socialise more.

Good luck, it’s not your fault. Kids, you have take the good and the bad.

Sell the consoles and all the games. That can be that start of him paying you back.

At some point in the near future I intend to post this as a topic of its own.

Unfortunately this is a consequence of not monitoring. I am an adult gamer, I have an Xbox one as does my DH.
I have so far spoken to at least 3 kids ages 13-15 who have been targeted by a grown man who was attempting to groom them, who apparently had been convicted of an offence (a misunderstanding apparently according to this man) he didn't know them in RL, but was however, living in the same area. He would befriend one child and then use their network or friends. None of their parents had a clue.

On top of this, the language that children are exposed to and then use is really bad, and the scary thing is, in most cases it's the children who are inviting the adults to these interactions because they find it funny or that's what they see streamers/you tubers doing.

It's also incredibly irritating as well as dangerous. I have on many occasions demanded to speak to a parent or adult in the house, I've spoken to 0.

Here are a couple of reasons that anyone reading this should be present when their kids are gaming, and spread the word to other parents, unfortunately OP, you have another reason.

BTW, Microsoft on Xbox needs to have card details saved on it to buy Xbox live which is what allows online play (most games rely on online play now and won't start without it) and games will take purchases from that, so if anyone has children gaming, OP's story could be yours.

Also, all games are set up in purchasing temptation like Fortnite, it's actually normal, it's only because Fortnite is the current most popular game and the one with all the 'street cred' that you are aware. It's gamings fault not Fortnite, the game is free to play, they are a company and therefore need to make money somewhere. The purchases give no in game advantage it's purely cosmetic. But these cosmetics have become the latest thing to collect, no different to football stickers back in the day.

Apologies for long post.

There are plenty of games which don't have online purchasing.

Jesus don’t involve the police they have more urgent things to be attending too. It’s up to the other poster to show her child the seriousness of this. He can help you repay it as you will need to sell all his gaming equipment etc- which will be a start. Any paper rounds in your area? You also need to get him
Help for his addiction so perhaps some counselling. If you take everything away yes he will stop but doesn’t mean he won’t do this again the future. I’d be making life at home pretty miserable in terms of treats etc saying you can’t affird anything as he’s stolen from the family and now your all having to pay the consequences.

Yes 100 percent don't involve police. They've got better things to do than scare your kid!

I hope you manage to get some of the money back from the companies. Good luck.

I would also get your son to cook dinner once a week for the rest of the year and to plan and buy the food himself. He needs to make it up to you somehow. Or volunteering in the community.

My son had actually used my husbands card on his Nintendo switch, sometime in October and transferred the details from there, and it has escalated since.

An Under-18 account on the Nintendo Switch cannot save payment details, so your son would not have been able to transfer details from there.
Assuming you had correct security settings in place for your 13 year old child, if somehow payment details were saved in error, you may have some recourse there (against any purchases made on the Switch at least).

Fuck me some harsh responses from PPs.

I hope you are doing better today. I have been in a similar situation (but not console related). It’s a shock when you find out your child has done something you never thought them capable of I.e betray your trust.

The way I’ve dealt with it is 2 ways. 1. There needs to be a consequence for the crime. 2. There needs to be a repayment plan put in place. I would be clear on the consequence part. Consequence in this circumstance for me would be selling the console which helps towards repayment.

As counterintuitive as it sounds your son needs some extra love and understanding right now. He will need to face up to the consequences and put it right, but the compassion will help him to be remorseful and understand the gravity of what he has done. That’s what worked for me.

Like many other posters, I’d be doing the following:

• Sell consoles
• Laptop only at dining table, for homework only.
• Get rid of phone immediately, replace with a Nokia brick.
• No usual half term treats/ days out, etc

I would also ask him how he intends to repay you. Make him take some responsibility for ‘fixing’ this.

... I’d also absolutely not hide this from extended family if you’d normally share this kind of thing. You have nothing to be ashamed of. It might not be a bad thing for him to see them shocked.

Just re CBT. Are you involved in these sessions with him? I would assume not. My DH went to CBT 3 times, 6 sessions each time, over the course of 2 years. 2 weeks between each session, to give him time to reflect and work upon his actions.

He completely failed to mention his long-standing alcoholism, instead focusing on my recently diagnosed disability (and it's impacts) as the cause of his depression.

Don't assume your son will talk about this with his therapist. I'm not sure what ways you are 'entitled' to communicate with them about his progress and any current stressors. I had therapy as a child and my parents weren't involved or kept informed.

if anyone has children gaming, OP's story could be yours.

My kids have Nintendo Switches, but the store is password protected so my kids cannot make payments or change the payment method without knowing the password, which they absolutely do not know.

I don't know how the X Box works, but I imagine the payments are also password protected.

I agree with spawnchorus I think.

Yes, he has majorly fucked up but it is 'only money' (which you can possibly afford to lose more than others if you're dh has no need to check his statements for months).

He definitely needs the consequences most mentioned on this thread, but I would never tell the police about something that can be resolved within your own family. I'm sure at 13 he knows the seriousness of the situation without the police being involved.

When he's 30 you will no doubt look back on this and chuckle.

In fact, thinking about it, all these gaming devices have restrictions that prevent kids from spending huge amounts of money because it is such a common problem. The OP's son was very wrong to do this, but I think the OP has to shoulder some of the blame here for not setting up the devices properly. He's just a child. There's no way I'd give my kids any opportunity to access payments on their devices. Everyone knows these games are addictive.

Does his school have a Community Police Officer? If you speak to the school, they may be able to have an off-the-record word with your son about the seriousness of his actions.

some posters are being dismissive. Some children are very savvy. Deliberate. Theft. Cunning.

If your child is very angelic, then great, not all are.

Its easy to find out the password, change it, set up a new email account, turn off notifications for all purchases.

That's is all done. deliberately, of course, by the child. But it happens, to lots and lots of parents.

Regarding setting up accounts. I had originally set up every account in the house, Apple, Microsoft(Xbox), Nintendo with my details and set parental controls on each. He did know the password for the Nintendo account when he got the switch (Christmas 2017) and had operated that without issue until October 2018. This decision was carefully discussed at the time and had been made because of his previous responsible attitude in this area. 😐 hollow laugh

However, he then made a decision to ask my husband for his details (Sept 2018) so he could make a purchase. In doing this he would handover the cash, in this instance Birthday money. This is where he got greedy (and when he started playing fortnite) and he then changed the main payment details on Nintendo by setting up a PayPal account. He did this using my husbands details and a bogus address. He then created another Nintendo account which he also linked to PayPal. Each time he physically took my husbands card from his desk/wallet to do so. After that he began to buy through a website called G2A which very quickly allowed him to rack up a huge amount of money in a short period of time.

On Monday I noticed that the lead name on the Xbox account had been changed as, he admits, he was going to link this to the PayPal account so he could spend more. A code was generated from Microsoft and he accesssed this by picking up my iPad (he knows the code) and accessing my email for the code whilst I was making tea. We really only knew the scale of the problem until my husbands card was refused for buying cinema tickets and then he checked his online statement in more detail and noticed a trail of PayPal transfers.

So I can clearly see where the fault lies on our part in monitoring his use.

So, now I am spending the day accessing every account he has created, changing every password on every device in the family to completely secure ourselves. It’s not something I thought I would have to deal with, but it is what it is.

Every console is now packaged up, alongside games, ready or sale. He has suggested places he could sell. This will go a short way to repaying every penny.

Regarding my family, I have decided I will share this with my mum, although I know it will shock her deeply. The reaction of others, as someone mentioned previously, is part of the consequences for him.

Regarding the CBT for OCD. It was been around six weeks since he last attended, due to a small mix up at the health centre, but this course resumes on Monday. There are two professionals, one for the OCD and another who who takes a more general overview. We are allowed to sit with him and contribute. I feel this issue will maybe warrant a separate session. This behaviour also coincides with the beginning of a turbulent time at work for my husband and uncertainty hangs over his future. He is undoubtedly picking up in this and we have now discussed this more fully with him. We hadn’t discussed this with our children before.

I want to thank everyone who has commented because it really has made it easier for me to see a way forward with this. X

Even if he did become addicted he would only have become addicted from already doing the behaviour.
The first time he did it he chose to do it. Yes he may then have become addicted but the first one was a choice.

Oh OP, you poor thing - this must be such a terrible shock to you, and it sounds like you guys already have a lot going on. I wouldn't be too hard on yourself, you are addressing this quickly and seriously as soon as you found out. I think some of the posts have been quite harsh, a 13yo is not a toddler - he clearly knew what he was doing.

I have no practical experience (as mine is in fact a toddler!), but it struck me the amount concerned I imagine difficult for a kid of his age to quite understand. I'm sure you've already thought about it, but I would be keen to make it quite clear how much remains of his debt after every possession sold/job done/money earned - I think I would have been shocked at that age how very long of doing £5/£10 jobs it would take to get to £2500, when it is so easily racked up.

Its easy to find out the password

It's really not.

My kids aren't angels at all, so I have a top-secret password that none of them know, and that isn't written down, and I turn the device from them when I input it. Notifications of changes or purchases go to my email account.

Anyway I'm not trying to give the OP a hard time here. It's happened, so it needs to be dealt with and hopefully the companies will refund some of the money. I' m sure she feels sick to her stomach about the whole thing.

Just to other parents reading this, please don't trust your kids with their devices. Lock them down with safety checks.

I’m in full agreement blackcatsleepig

Also, I’m not holding out for a refund. You can clearly see, hopefully, how a lack of monitoring can lead so easily to this. I really hope this the making of him.

Well done, you sound very organised and calm. I’m sorry you are having to deal with this.

Your son is obviously very bright but needs to use his intelligence more constructively. I’m guessing he’s bored at school ? Is he S2?

Anyway, I just wanted to echo the posters who say don’t go to the police officially, as they will report to social workers and the children’s panel. The last thing you need is some bloody social worker taking your son out to MacDonalds and asking him what his parents did to make him do it.

He needs to face up to the consequences of his actions, not have some professional victim blamed fill his head with self excusing nonsense.

But if you know a police officer / lawyer / accountant etc socially who might give him a bollocking, that could help. So he knows it’s a serious crime and not a a bit of a laugh.

Colleagues husband ( police sergeant ) did this for other colleagues son. He was very straight with him, just explained what the police procedures would be , charges , sherrif court, young offenders and the type of lads he would meet there.