What happened to S&B?

[janlevinson]

I used to browse this topic regularly several years ago and I enjoyed the recommendations of Ash high tops, Net A Porter sale items and high end make up, amongst other things. Loved reading what LetThemEatCake had been buying.
I've been having migrating over to here again recently after a long time away and it's all Roman Originals, granny sandals and things that "wash well".
WTF happened?
~lighthearted~

@Floisme

If you're not interested in a topic then scroll on past. I'm not interested in make up or most skincare but I wouldn't dream of calling for a separation. If people are rude or sneery - and I'm not suggesting the op is - then call them out. Setting up a new section is just pandering to it.

Hmmm I suppose there is a fine line between pandering to people's snarkiness and accomodating people. I would rather people be accommodated, or else join in, start the threads they'd like to see more of or debate on threads where they disagree. But if the latter isn't possible because they find the board tiresome, I would rather those people be accommodated elsewhere rather than feel they have to start threads lamenting the state of the board.

I'm a pretty pragmatic person, so this isn't petulance at all, just an idea which I would agree with if it meant that everybody was made to feel welcome on this board, as they have been until now I think. I've always found it diverse and welcoming, with a range of views. I'm happy with that, but op and others are not. So what do they propose we do? Or was this thread just a vent, which is also fine?

I don't see a lot of people coming on threads to say they don't care about clothes at all. I see more people saying they don't care about being absolutely on-trend with whatever it is this minute. But they have an interest in clothes and style that is broader. I also like the move to a more feminist approach, with not focusing on being as thin or as young-looking as possible and fearing anything that make you look otherwise.

@LuckyMcDucky

I think it's a bit much to post in support of an op who was lamenting how sadly unstylish the board has become and then call people petulant for trying to find a solution

I would rather the board stayed as it is, but then, I'm not the one posting about how crap the board is.

Op: I hate the board now
Other posters: yeah me too
Another poster: ok let's change it then
Serpents: that's so petulant

Op never said she hated the board or that it was 'crap', just that there was now a lot more about comfort and very little about what is currently in style. That is objectively absolutely true.

I think it makes total sense to keep one board, there should be space for all styles, and plenty of us have our loungewear days as well as our higher-end days. It would be nice to be able to ask about more on-trend things without having a pile on about comfort or wearing things at any age, and I do also think that there is some very dodgy advice given out when people specifically ask for something fashionable and are directed to brands that can be wonderful in many ways but are absolute miles from fashionable (and whose buyers would be the first to agree).

You seem very personally invested in the OP being wrong and also being mean, but that's not the sense I'm getting at all. It's a reasonable call for diversity in the board when it can be hard if you're, say over 30-35 and a mum but like clothes, to actually find good style advice and inspiration, and it's frustrating if you used to find it here but now get crowded out by Hotter and the Seasalt Janelle coat. Doesn't need to be one or the other

I really hope it doesn't get split into two boards. There is plenty room here for people who are interested in higher end style/fashion who perhaps are more knowledgeable and see it as an art/lifestyle, those who simply want to ask which hotter sandals or amazon jumpsuit are the most comfy and then everyone in between who just wants to keep up with current high street trend and ask for general thoughts, opinions and ideas (I'm firmly in the latter but appreciate all three).

It would be nice to be able to ask about more on-trend things without having a pile on about comfort or wearing things at any age, and I do also think that there is some very dodgy advice given out when people specifically ask for something fashionable and are directed to brands that can be wonderful in many ways but are absolute miles from fashionable (and whose buyers would be the first to agree).

Great, so if there was a separate board for clothing which was not to do with fashion, as the pp has suggested, would that not be better? Then you wouldn't have to deal with this.

Re me being personally invested and misinterpreting the op's meaning... I think the nail in the coffin was "you need to calm down love". Usually a tell tale sign that someone isn't particularly benevolent in their intentions.

I'm not someone who often gets heavily involved in confrontation on this site, but I do find the premise of this thread pretty unpleasant for the reasons I covered yesterday. If you don't happen to agree, that is obviously fine. But we will have to agree to disagree I think

I for one am absolutely loving fashion at the moment. Where I live it's long t shirts, bright jumpers, jogger jeans, comfortable shoes. I had a baby not long ago so hiding my stomach and not having sore feet are great

I would be very sad to see this board split in two. Would we get posters trying to police the two boards to decide what was “High end fashion” and belonged on the “exclusive” board and what was not? Can’t see how it would work.

@Floisme

I'm going to hazard a guess that the majority of those saying their skinny jeans will be prised from their cold dead hands are younger posters who have never worn anything else and for whom the change feels genuinely threatening.

Meanwhile older posters have seen it all before, several times. We know that a) once it starts, it's inevitable but b) it takes years and c) that everything else - shoes, tops - will change too and d) that your eyes will adjust, the new look will become the norm and the old look will start to look odd.

In short, it will be fine. But there is nothing we can say that will convince younger posters. They just have to live through it.

I was thinking that myself. Trying to work out why I am happy for skinny jeans to exit. My eyes got used to them to the extent that they didn't stand out any more but never thought them a good thing. I was trying to work out why there were some people so reluctant to say goodbye and came to the same conclusion. I just bought some lovely traffic light green flares and I am delighted. I hated skinny jeans so much that I just stopped wearing jeans and embraced the dress instead

I think it is silly to split the board. I don't give a toot about handbags so ignore the handbag threads - that doesn't mean I think there should be a separate handbag board within S&B. Surely we are adult enough to engage with what interests us and scroll past what we have no view on without comment?

Personally, what annoys me most is the 'wear what you want, people care about what they wear are shallow' type responders and those posters should be chased from S&B with flaming pitchforks. Any other poster who actually has an opinion on style, beauty or fashion and doesn't deem it beneath them as a concept is equally free to post. It is fun to read a range of views and different tastes.

@AprilLady

I would be very sad to see this board split in two. Would we get posters trying to police the two boards to decide what was “High end fashion” and belonged on the “exclusive” board and what was not? Can’t see how it would work.

Yes, I imagine that could be an issue.

I'd be happy for the board to stay the same, but then, will we be forever getting threads like this where an op is frustrated by the board and the range of advice, being directed to unfashionable shops etc? It's a tricky one, but worth discussing, if it's a problem. And there are enough posters on here who don't like the way the board seems to have gone lately that maybe it is a problem?

@Readyorknot

Some people are really missing the point. It's not about some of us wanting an exclusive/ luxury /designer whatever division, it's about how SO many posters come on S&B these days saying they don't care about fashion or what people think, wear what you want ad nauseum. It's completely pointless and it's killing S & B.

Absolutely this

@LuckyMcDucky

You are absolutely right! That would be encouraging exclusivity. But that isn't at all what I have said. I said that if it pains the op to see the board becoming more inclusive, (to allow for discussion of all sorts of clothing and fashion), rather than her preference, which was the golden days when people ONLY discussed a certain sort of fashion, then she would be welcome to request a special board for special people in the know. I'd be happy enough with that if it happened, but I'd probably prefer it didn't. I like that this board is pretty inclusive. But if you can't stand it then you are welcome to go elsewhere.

I don't think that's too hard to understand and it isn't encouraging people to leave at all, but simply saying that rather than hang around lamenting the loss of the good old days when we could merrily sneer at and exclude people, you have a better option.

So stay and enjoy and join in or go. Don't strut up to the board and say "you're doing this ALL WRONG"

I totally didn't see the OP doing anything like that. It was a light hearted question. I love style and beauty because it is generally a lighthearted and happy board unlike any of the dog section (I have 2 dogs but wouldn't go near there). I join in anything I can help with and otherwise just appreciate.

I am fairly designer so just avoid the Seasalt stuff.

Threads I find funny are the what makes someone glamorous questions where everyone says being tall and wearing really boring stuff.

Absolutely this

So, your issue isn't that some people like shopping in shops you don't find fashionable, and start threads on "granny sandals and Roman Originals", it's actually that you don't like people saying they don't care about style on the style and beauty board?

That's SO different from what you wrote yesterday and I agree with you. That has never made sense to me either.

@Peanutbuttercupisyum

My most annoying is the need for “natural fibres”... who cares?!! I want cool, on trend stuff that makes me look thin, I don’t care about natural!!

I want anything that makes me look thin! Or even just not fat!

I don't care if it's made from recycled chewing gum

@AprilLady

I would be very sad to see this board split in two. Would we get posters trying to police the two boards to decide what was “High end fashion” and belonged on the “exclusive” board and what was not? Can’t see how it would work.

This is what I think would happen, and it would not be a good thing at all. I think it would discourage people from posting on either section.

it's about how SO many posters come on S&B these days saying they don't care about fashion or what people think, wear what you want ad nauseum.
I completely agree that's annoying. I was on a thread at the weekend that was wrecked by this very thing. I've no idea why they do it. Well actually I do but that's probably best kept for another thread. I bet though that they don't go barging into football threads to tell everyone they don't care who wins and it's only a game.

But that's life - sometimes people are annoying - I'm sure I'm annoying sometimes - but I don't see how splitting the site up into sections would solve it. If there was a 'high end' sub thread you can bet it would be overrun people saying 'How can you spend all that money on a bag?'

But we aren't allowed to police the boards, so how are we supposed to steer it back to constructive, interesting discussions rather than threads filled with dismissive posts about how people shouldn't care what they wear? Can hardly tell them to fuck off back to AIBU.

(I must admit I am thinking of the leggings under dresses thread)

@JaneJeffer

Why not start a thread called 'let's discuss high end fashion' instead of one called 'what happened to s&b' as if you are the only stylish person on here then?

This is what's in style now. Fine for young women but if I wore this being in my fifties I'd look awful.

(I just replied to this post but it appears to have vanished, so apologies if there ends up being two, very similar posts!!).

Is this really currently fashionable. Like seriously

If so I'll definitely leave it to the 'young & trendy'. I've had my day of looking like a twat in the name of fashion. (But although it's a dated look now, even the things I wore them don't look anywhere near as awful as that does).

I think that happens when the thread appears in active, so people come on who really don't care about style, so they pop up and tell everyone that, which isn't especially helpful on a thread about style.

I think Mumsnet can stop threads appearing in active, but that also wouldn't be something everyone would want.

Here's an idea; if you want to join in threads on the S&B board, do that and argue the toss if someone says something you disagree with. If you miss certain sorts of threads from the good old days, you could start similar threads yourself. That's more or less how it goes.

It isn't the usual thing, to appear on a board after years away, and saying (now I'm going to quote, as don't want to be accused of misinterpreting op's meaning);

I've been having migrating over to here again recently after a long time away and it's all Roman Originals, granny sandals and things that "wash well".
WTF happened?

The things I've seen on here over the past few years are just absolutely hideous.

But I'd say in the past it was about 80% style, 20% dross and now it's more the other way round.

Was there any need for an entire thread on this really? Especially since the concensus seems to be that there is room for everyone (even people who like Roman Originals). Nobody is going to curate the threads so that it is more fashion focussed.

Out of interest I did an advanced search on "Roman Originals" in Style and Beauty, and about half the references to it are from this thread

@AprilLady

I would be very sad to see this board split in two. Would we get posters trying to police the two boards to decide what was “High end fashion” and belonged on the “exclusive” board and what was not? Can’t see how it would work.

I completely agree. What would be really nice is a little less judgement. If we could discourage the word “frumpy”, that would be lovely.

I find the term 'frumpy' quite helpful and apply it to myself. I often look at my reflection and try and judge whether the length of a hem, or a particular neckline, looks a bit frumpy i.e old fashioned and unflattering. I'm happy to apply the term to men's outfits also, if people are against it because it's perceived to be sexist.

@Floisme

If you're not interested in a topic then scroll on past. I'm not interested in make up or most skincare but I wouldn't dream of calling for a separation. If people are rude or sneery - and I'm not suggesting the op is - then call them out. Setting up a new section is just pandering to it.

Totally agree with this as an MN thing, not a S&B thing. I think splitting topics up into more & more topics:sub topics is ridiculous. People just need to read an OP properly & reply accordingly & stop being so monotone & bitchy.

I find the term 'frumpy' a useful shorthand too. As a woman in my 50s, it epitomises exactly the look I am trying to avoid I don't find it ageist - but us older women are certainly more at risk of wandering into frumpville and I'd feel a bit patronised if other poster sdecided they needed to spare my middle-aged feelings by banning a helpful term.

I don’t object to it because it’s sexist. I object to it because it’s used as a catch all for “something I don’t like”. I never apply it to myself. I think things don’t work for me or make me look a bit matronly (depressingly often these days!). The thing is that current fashion is considered “frumpy” by some people while it looks amazing on people who can carry it off. Often it’s not the clothes, it’s the wearer!