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What happened to S&B?

463 replies

janlevinson · 15/05/2021 18:59

I used to browse this topic regularly several years ago and I enjoyed the recommendations of Ash high tops, Net A Porter sale items and high end make up, amongst other things. Loved reading what LetThemEatCake had been buying.
I've been having migrating over to here again recently after a long time away and it's all Roman Originals, granny sandals and things that "wash well".
WTF happened?
~lighthearted~

OP posts:
Thread gallery
10
RampantIvy · 18/05/2021 15:00

What would be really nice is a little less judgement. If we could discourage the word “frumpy”, that would be lovely.

I agree. I prefer th term "old fashioned"

I expect that what I wear would be considered a crime against fashion, but I want to look stylish, with a nod to what is current. At 62 high fashion wouldn't suit me, but I'm so glad that skinnies are out. I never found them comfortable in the first place.

20 year old DD is my biggest critic, and she loves the Seasalt dress I bought at Christmas because the style and colour suit me. I asked her whether I should get some white trainers to wear with my ankle grazer girlfriend jeans, and she wrinkled her nose Grin
So I bought some grey converse lookalikes which met with her approval.

AuldAlliance · 18/05/2021 15:00

I've been lurking on S&B for about 15 years. I don't post much: I don't live in the UK so haven't the same shops or the same style as many posters. I still come on here quite often, though. I just skip threads that don't interest me, and keep an eye on how UK MNers' fashion focus differs to the way things are where I live. I find it really interesting to see how attitudes to trends vary between countries. There are also a few posters whose opinions I value and whose style I like, even if it wouldn't suit me.

I don't really miss some of the old threads mentioned here, as there was an unsettling focus on thigh gaps and thinness from some influential posters. But there definitely was more of a "club" feeling before, simply because there were fewer MNers, fewer threads and posts and MN's demographic was more homogenous.

S&B has changed as regulars have grown a bit older, so their bodies and attitudes are not quite the same, and as MN has grown so much bigger. Cod used to find affordable, wearable clothes and lots of people followed her suggestions, but now there are fewer such clothes out there and more diversity on MN, so less scope for "the top" or "the dress" to go viral, (and no one would dare be as scathing as Cod was).

WFH and Covid have led to a dearth of satisfying threads, like the poster who was looking for a dress for her Scottish beach wedding, and I think that's been compounded by (as lamented on S&B) the limited availability of flattering, well-made clothes in OK fabrics and at affordable prices. Some of those issues will begin to fade when travel, parties, events, etc. gradually restart, but I wonder whether the latter problem isn't here to stay.

I agree that the "who cares what people think, wear what you like" posts are a bit distracting on S&B, but they are perhaps a reflection of how more people feel free to try and move away from norms and expectations about how women have to dress/look. That in itself is kind of interesting...as is the changing attitude to grey hair, perceptible on these boards.

Splitting S&B in two isn't a workable idea, because lots of threads wander a little, which is no bad thing, and there is no clear cut-off. OPs don't always provide defined criteria for what they want/like, so you get people making suggestions that don't suit them but do suit other people, in terms of style, budget, etc., and it would be a real shame to stifle that.

I agree that the "guess my age" threads are grim. They reinforce the notion that looking your actual age is somehow a bad thing, and I wish MN would pull them as soon as they appear. No one in their right minds would wander round a park, pub or station asking complete strangers to guess their age, and it never ends well on here.

OverTheRubicon · 18/05/2021 15:03

Was there any need for an entire thread on this really? Especially since the concensus seems to be that there is room for everyone (even people who like Roman Originals). Nobody is going to curate the threads so that it is more fashion focussed.

A very significant chunk of the posts on this thread are from you, though, so presumably you do think that this thread has discussion potential? You're also the one that's called other people 'sneery' and 'mean girls' Hmm

This to me is a good example of this issue. Someone wants to talk about higher end fashion, instead of a group coming on to say 'me too' or 'no thanks', the voice of the person wanting to do this is drowned out by people (often a relatively small group) telling them again and again and again and again how it is exclusive, 'mean' etc.

There doesn't need to be curation. Just, as a pp said, people seeing if a thread is for them and if not, then making a comment if they wish and then moving on instead of piling in.

Floisme · 18/05/2021 15:04

I think 'frumpy' is fine if it's used to describe an outfit. I don't use it to describe people and I don't think it's fine when it's used as a synonym for 'middle aged'. And before anyone asks, no I'm not suggesting any kind of ban but, if you choose to use it in that way, then don't act surprised if you're challenged.

BlairWaldorfLovesShopping · 18/05/2021 15:07

Great post @AuldAlliance! I very much agree that it is harder to find well made, quality clothes these days. A lot of fashion has moved online while high street shops have died a death (or been bought out by the dreaded Boohoo). People just aren't as aware of non-physical store brands these days, maybe? Or they have less time to seek them out. And also I think people are more aware of ethical/environmental issues. Overall, buying clothes isn't the carefree experience it was 10 years ago, I find. There's so much crap out there, it's like there is almost too much choice and most of it rubbish. Plus sources of "inspiration" such as Instagram have the potential to make one feel like crap and overwhelm you with options. I miss the days when it was just Pinterest!

LuckyMcDucky · 18/05/2021 15:15

@OverTheRubicon

Was there any need for an entire thread on this really? Especially since the concensus seems to be that there is room for everyone (even people who like Roman Originals). Nobody is going to curate the threads so that it is more fashion focussed.

A very significant chunk of the posts on this thread are from you, though, so presumably you do think that this thread has discussion potential? You're also the one that's called other people 'sneery' and 'mean girls' Hmm

This to me is a good example of this issue. Someone wants to talk about higher end fashion, instead of a group coming on to say 'me too' or 'no thanks', the voice of the person wanting to do this is drowned out by people (often a relatively small group) telling them again and again and again and again how it is exclusive, 'mean' etc.

There doesn't need to be curation. Just, as a pp said, people seeing if a thread is for them and if not, then making a comment if they wish and then moving on instead of piling in.

That isn't what happened at all though.

If the op had simply said; "who wants to talk about current trends / high end fashion / net-a-porter?", I'd have said yes or no.

Instead it was "granny sandals", "hideous", "I wish I could see a picture of the person giving me fashion advice before I take their advice 🤭".

And yes, I've been on here a lot, but that in no way means I think the op's thread should be here. I'm posting because I feel exactly the opposite. That happens a lot on MN; someone posts a thread which you think is pretty cunty and you end up replying with "what a horrible thread" or whatever. Doesn't mean you like the thread just because you post on it.

TooExtraImmatureCheddar · 18/05/2021 15:26

I do want discussions on whether something is fashionable or not! I’m very interested in fashion, although my budget is definitely high street rather than designer. It’s hard to say tactfully that a suggestion isn’t hitting the mark - most folk just say politely that it isn’t their style. So it is hard to set out in a thread that you want fashionable suggestions only without upsetting people!

LuckyMcDucky · 18/05/2021 15:30

I think you can say it in your op. I'm fairly direct though, (if you haven't noticed), and I don't see how saying you're interested in looking current could really offend anyone. Some people like to look more classic or aren't interested in fashion and that's also fine, but if someone said in an op that they were interested in current trends or a specific trend, then I don't see anything offensive in that at all.

RampantIvy · 18/05/2021 15:33

Maybe people have different ideas about what is fashionable?

I guess my take on it is whether something is popular. For instance, skinny jeans are still very popular where I live. White trainers are ubiquitous, but not a fashion that I particularly like - probably influenced by the fact that they wouldn't stay white for very long as we live rurally Grin (this is where the practical element comes in).

I have to admit that when it comes to trainers one pair looks pretty much like another to me, and I am not very brand aware, except that most mumsnetters hate Sketchers Grin

LongHotSummerJustPassedMeBy · 18/05/2021 15:39

I think a lot of people who come onto this board might just want to be given 'rules' about which type of sandals/jeans to buy this year and what to wear them with, which shops to go to and which to avoid, etc. Then off they go. Nothing wrong with that.

Then there are the several long-running threads on S&B which attract people who are finding and refining their own individual style. We can learn from both types of threads!

LuckyMcDucky · 18/05/2021 15:39

Yes, absolutely, it's so subjective. But we've all been saying how much we like the range of views and that there is room for everyone, which I agree with. So if that means that sometimes suggestions won't hit the mark, meh. I can live with it. The old "not to my taste / not my style" covers it, as a pp said.

That's different to "I don't even care about fashion" though, which is a pain. But again, people will end up posting that, as the MN site is massive and S&B threads will appear in active, so you kind of have to live with it to a point.

Divebar2021 · 18/05/2021 17:09

I think it would really help if people gave you a better sense of their taste when asking fashion questions. Perhaps told you where they normally like to shop so you can get a sense of their preferences. The times I’ve seen those “ Find me a dress “ and I’m thinking Arket and someone else is suggesting Sealsalt or Joe Browns. I know it’s a small quibble.

Generally apart from a couple of exceptions ( the French thread ) there is a great deal of fast fashion promoted. Perhaps I’m very out of step but I’m 50 and I don’t want to wear clothes from Sainsbury’s or Primark ( or many shops of the high street). I like hunting in charity shops or eBay for good brands and I supplement with some higher end high street. There was a thread recently with “ What do you wear at 40” and it was quite a way in before anyone posted brands that I didn’t know that were interesting. That’s the kind of poster I’m interested in having a discussion with but they seem few and far between.

Divebar2021 · 18/05/2021 17:12

I do struggle with feedback on looks that I don’t like... I have said “ it’s not to my taste but who cares what I think” but I am interested in fashion / style and I do think some outfits are way off with proportions etc or are not very modern.

SummaLuvin · 18/05/2021 17:18

I don't think that we should avoid saying anything negative when asked for opinions. While we should be careful that 'honesty' isn't actually cruelty, I think most people who post asking for opinions want the truth. If I was shopping with a friend and they asked me what I thought I would tell them if I didn't think it looked nice and why, I take the same approach here - assuming posters want honesty rather than just compliments.

BlairWaldorfLovesShopping · 18/05/2021 17:20

I am on a couple of Facebook groups where it's become impossible to say anything that isn't completely fawning and complimentary, but that shouldn't be the case here as we are all anonymous.

Except for on the "how old do I look" threads which should be ignored!!

XingMing · 18/05/2021 17:34

As a huge fan of S&B in all its guises, I wouldn't want to see it split up. I also think it's healthy for people to disagree on what looks wonderful, and stand alongside Floisme on the whiff of ageism that's generally inherent in the use of frumpy. Especially right now, when "frumpy" is a definite look... if you are long enough to wear the styles with knowing irony, rather than like Norah Batty.

XingMing · 18/05/2021 17:35

...not long enough... young enough. Apologies for my sloppy typing.

thedevilinablackdress · 18/05/2021 18:13

It would be soooooo helpful if OPs gave more info. Sometimes a thread starts with far too like information and you end up recommending something completely inappropriate for the. It would avoid a lot of annoyance I reckon!

What is your question:
Budget:
Current/preferred style:
Event/occasion?:
Tell us about your lifestyle:
Things you don't like/want to avoid:

thedevilinablackdress · 18/05/2021 18:13

far too *little

MrsHuntGeneNotJeremyObviously · 19/05/2021 08:09

Aren't most of us a bit of both when it comes to using this board?
I bought the Next khaki duvet coat (the Emma Willis one). I do not look like Emma Willis! But omg it's warm and comfy and has pockets where I want them and keeps my knees dry. That doesn't mean that I don't also want to buy expensive and stylish bags (or at least to look at them) or beautiful clothes when I get back on my diet and I really value suggestions from posters of places to shop that I haven't heard of.
If we have two boards, then each becomes an echo chamber and we lose out on the opportunity to stumble across random things we wouldn't ordinarily have seen. I'd be sad to see a split.

Campervan69 · 19/05/2021 09:55

MrsHuntGeneNotJeremyObviously completely agree. Maybe to stop the bun fights, posters should refrain from being condescending to others. If you don't like something, criticise the dress not the women wearing it.

Elllllle · 19/05/2021 10:26

I haven't seen much condescension of the person/poster wearing the outfit tbh. But many overly sensitive posters who can't handle being told that their dresses-over-skirts combos are not the height of fashion.

Elllllle · 19/05/2021 10:27

dresses or skirts over leggings that should say ... dresses over skirts could on the other hand be quite interesting! Blush

FunnyWonder · 19/05/2021 10:50

@MrsHuntGeneNotJeremyObviously
I bought that coat too and am referred to by the crossing patrol man at DS's school as 'the walking duvet', but hey I'm the one who's toasty warm. And I agree, wearing a duvet doesn't mean I don't like more stylish items too. I could be wearing something from Paris Fashion Week under my duvet! (I'm not though ...)

FunnyWonder · 19/05/2021 11:17

As regards the leggings and dress combo, I don't think posters are expecting to be told they are 'the height of fashion'. There's a difference between wanting a bit of reassurance that something looks ok, and wondering if it looks stylish. 'Ok' or 'not awful' is enough for many people and, while many think this particular combo is awful, there are ways of giving your opinion without making someone feel crap. I mean, if they're asking, they're hardly brimming over with self-confidence as it is.

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