🐌 Fantastic Skincare: Hairmageddon looms...

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Thread 11

For those who are taking a peek and wondering what this all about, we mostly discuss a bit of advanced skincare here with a perspective of seeking out the right ingredients (rather than the latest new shiny product and all its empty promises) for our particular skin needs. Distinguishing the acid toners from the actives whilst avoiding the truly unimpressive and harmful ingredients with a hope to achieve a bit of anti-ageing, alleviate irritation and sensitivities with some idle chat in between. Newcomers are always welcome but please note the following:

Questions and asking for help on this thread is encouraged, however, we can’t give you a specific routine to follow and hope it works out for the best. There are no overnight miracles in skincare whether it be in the form of products or techniques. It’s about perseverance, understanding your skin, assessing its needs and responding to that in a diligent manner.

These threads were created to help those who want to learn for themselves. We’re a group of interested and invested skincare nuts happy to offer tea and sympathy and dole out advice. Everyone’s journey with skincare is different, what is universal and binds us is that through actually learning about the different active ingredients it helps us get to know our skin and help us adapt as it will change many times throughout our lives - with seasons, hormonal changes, ageing, genetics etc. It's in everyone's best interests to get to know their skin and to keep reviewing those changes with the confidence that comes from the gathered knowledge here. We really encourage you to spend the time reading through previous threads and linked info sheets that the many contributors have taken the trouble to share.

By no means are we experts, we're only a bunch of amateurs that can only respond by suggesting what we would do in your place, for any severe conditions please seek out professional help.

Ahem, and finally a little note on spending. I'm well aware these threads cause many to reach for their wallets and spend with wild abandon. There can sometimes be a bit of a frenzy surrounding the excitement around a newly discovered product or on the back of great improvements when someone reports back. This is all great, it doesn't however, mean everything that's a sudden miracle for one will be it for you. Usually, it's a light bulb moment for connecting the right skincare ingredient with an individual experiencing a specific problem. Take your time to mull over decisions and question whether it's right for you too. Skincare is highly individual, it's a slow game that should cost mostly in patience, input, education, and perseverance. Please don't make it cost you financially needlessly.

I am very slowly working on consolidating the gathered information from previous threads into easier to read formats but it’s slow going. I would suggest reading thread 1 and at the very least the following info sheets (provided they apply to you):

Where to Start

Basics of an Actives Routine

Skin Types vs. Skin Conditions Info Sheet

Anti-Ageing Info sheet

Adult Acne Info Sheet

NEWish since previous threads:

Understanding Which Sunscreen(s) to Buy

Do I Really Need to Wear Sunscreen Every Single Day of the Year?

A Damaged Skin Barrier - Now What?

FEBRUARY 2018: The month of February sucks. Period. We’re sick of winter and the state of our finances, some are embracing frugality (in different shapes and forms) but water bills and car maintenance are ruining our buzz. Hair appointments need to be made despite the palpitations of fear that the mere thought incites. Oh, and skin texture. As you were...

You have a beautiful skin colour and tone. It looks firm and smooth. Gorgeous bone structure that a lot of people would pay £££ to try and achieve but get nowhere near. I think you're smokin' hot Olli. 😍

Sorry you're feeling down on yourself I know it doesn't really matter what we think so I hope you can see all the positives yourself again soon.

Olli I agree with Enid and I think most of us are much more critical of ourselves than others are, and I very much include myself in that.

SF are the bane of my life too but from what I've read certain products/treatments can make them less visible but nothing will get rid of them completely.

Olli I feel exactly the same as you
Can't remember where but I read an article yesterday that said leave SF alone! The more u try to get rid of them the more they just fill up again and u could be damaging barrier by trying to get rid too so it's a no win situation.
My under eyes are really bothering me at the minute!

Does anyone have any opinions on facial rollers (not the scary dermarollers, more of a facial massage thing)

www.cultbeauty.co.uk/ying-yu-rollers-jade-facial-roller-medium.html

The blurb says they are good for sinus problems and I was wondering if they might help with sagging too.

Sorry, need to catch up properly first, but this article is exceptional good reading and is concisely bringing forth the arguments about skin care and how it is being discussed in wider media lately that has been bothering me more and more. It's about skin care but not really, and that's sort of the point and heavily touches on the insecurities that are preyed upon albeit in a much more disguised fashion now:

The skin care wars, explained

sallie I have one of those jade rollers. I got it free with other products. It’s actually very nice to use. It’s cold so feels good. The massage brings a bit of blood to the surface of your skin (like mild flushing I mean) so you have a nice glow afterwards. It doesn’t have a lasting effect though. Not extortionately expensive so you might want to try it, particularly if it did help with sinuses but I wouldn’t pin your hopes on it helping sagging

Oh Olli I sympathise. I know how you feel - especially the "chin has either spots or marks from spots". It's so frustrating, isn't it? I don't actually have any new spots (right now... probably just jinxed it) but two old ones which are taking FOREVER to go and look like they are going to get worse before they get better (plus marks from old spots, of course). Just resorted to benzoyl peroxide (might have got the name wrong) which I HATE using because no matter how I wash it off, it always somehow stains something

Plus Olli your combination of skin, hair and eye colour is my absolute favourite!

Thanks for the article Bo. I will have a read of that in a bit.

That is a very good essay Bo and i think it sums up every dichotomous position I have ever taken upon beauty and skin care. Essentially we’re damned if we do, damned if we don’t.

The card-carrying feminist in me rails against the demands placed upon women and washes her face with soap and Nivea; the part of me that is coming out of another period of depression wants to be the best me I can be but is aware that, in itself, this is caused by societal pressures.

I use the body shop face massager/roller Sallie Don't think it really does much but like JD said it gives you a flush so a brief temporary glow. My thinking was, as my blood pressure is very low and I'm very pale, it might help increase blood flow to my cheeks a bit. Probably nonsense. Feels nice to use though especially if you have tight jaw muscles.

I could have written that exact same post about my hair Enid. Mine is exactly as you describe, and I have very good hair. Also hang ups from being a child. When I was 10 my mum had my hair cut from shoulder length to late 70s gamine crop. I was beyond mortified. I wore a hat to school. In Summer. But of course, the boys on the bus wondered why I was wearing a hat so they ripped it off. And then they laughed their heads off. My mum also insisted on "feather cuts". I looked like a Bay City Roller. I know it was the fashion, but fashion doesn't allow for what suits you or your hair does it.

My current hairdresser is brilliant and totally gets it. For me, where they cut the hair in relation to the wave in it makes a huge difference, and also, not having my shortest layer shorter than the nape of my neck. One guy completely butchered it and it was ridiculous and I couldn't do anything with it. It took me 2 years to grow it out :-( I feel your pain and am sending you some hugs. It is so frustrating when you actually really like your hair. I feel like some hairdressers just don't listen. It's as if YOU couldn't possibly know more about your hair than THEM.

Miffy I've had my DE since November so I expect I don't have much longer left. I will RP. Annoying as I thought about asking DH to bring some back from NY but I didn't want to appear greedy! What's the tinted SPF like? I'd like to find one I get on with in. I'm in a bit of an SPF funk, with spring and summer coming (hopefully!).

Pupsie I have't got the tinted SPF yet, it is currently with the forwarding service so I reckon a couple of weeks. Reviews are mixed and TBH I have not yet had any luck with tinted SPFs (I include LRP and Image in this group of tried and tested and failed). I will take advantage of the refund policy if I don't like it though :)

I am really liking Eucerin daily protection spf30 which I have bought from iHerb (currently out of stock there) and I will probably get a tube of the regular Image spf50 in summer. For some reason right now I like these better than the Biore/Nivea that I was using in the autumn/winter, definitely need to change it up each season!

I think I'll get a jade roller, as they don't have any miraculous properties but just feel nice then I presume a cheapo one from amazon will do the job. I grind my teeth so do get a lot of jaw tension and if it helps with sinus pain at all that will be a bonus. Will not hold out any hope on a cure for sagging though

Thanks for the article Bo interesting reading. I enjoy skincare (and makeup) - looking at it, buying it, using it, talking about it - but I'm not terribly interested in clothes or fashion so as far as I'm concerned each to their own and there shouldn't be any guilt or judging but I know life doesn't work like that unfortunately.

I was just pondering the other day on how I'd never heard of clothing brands or websites that are discussed all the time here like Jules, Boden, Cos, Hush etc. I was wondering if these are very specific to Mumsnet or if I live in a little bubble of fashion ignorance as I've never heard anyone IRL mention them.

Oliv I think you look great too, love the eye brows.
I actually some SF too since I was 13 on my nose. I got so used to looking at them I eventually didn't really notice. I had though until a few years ago they were black heads and tried a lot of things that were useless.
I stopped bothering cause it left my nose raw and it was my only concern.
I got given some Eve Lom cleanser a over a year ago and used it once a day to remove cleanser. I noticed after a couple of weeks they'd disappeared.
Now I loved the Eve Lom and how good my skin felt after but didn't feel I could justify the €€€ so didn't purchase when it was gone.
Anyway how good it felt cleansing my skin with it and noticed a few SF were creeping back. I repurchased and use it regularly now. If I miss a few days those black little feckers creep back. It's funny I don't think my nose is oily but something is causing it. Maybe the extra counter I do to make it look smaller, it's big

I know the advice is there's no need to spend lots on cleansers and it's probably right but it feels like such a treat to me every day and my slings the better for it so I drop strong hints to dh around Christmas and birthdays.

I'll read your link later Bo I'm off now to a celebration meal, send me good vibes everyone I'm low carb at the moment

Went to TK. No nip fab but I did manage to find May Coop raw sauce and raw moisturiser

We could be hair soul mates Pupsie. Totally get it. It was a revelation when I realised it wasn't my hair that was 'bad'. I'll admit to being vain about it now but those hang ups are hard to shake off.
I'm ok with this being stage 2 of gettin it back to how I like it. It's actually looking quite nice today. Shiny.

Whilst I'm tooting my own horn My skin is looking good this week. Now the hormones have calmed down. Only 2 faint red marks from last week, even toned. Might even be able to skip concealer tomorrow.

Sallie Look up where your lymph nodes are in your face. Giving those a light massage with a roller feels nice. (Emphasise on the light.) It's great for jaw tension, relaxes it.
I know what you mean about clothing brands etc. Not sure why though.

Lone Have a good time at the meal. I love the smell of Eve Lom balm!

Look forward to reading that article later bo, thank you.

Hope this weekend is a good one for everyone. Especially for those who find this Sunday a bit difficult for whatever reason. Look after yourselves.

Never heard of May Coop Olli but I love the name 'raw sauce'!

The packaging is beautiful! I vaguely remembered it being popular on Reddit and decided it was a good find

Waves at olli
Thank you well-wishers...trying to manage/time the dose now...feeling marginally better
sallie I like my jade roller for sinus probs and general face massage...must make time to use it more...thanks for reminding me!
mrs d i get that dichotomy....I’ve eschewed make up, done defiant make up, done minimal skin maintenance and high maintenance. Ultimately, for me, it’s eventually more about health and well-being....I suppose my skin is healthier if I look after it in a certain way (ie cos I have excema and dermatitis and acne and rosacea!) and I am not society’s idealised view of acceptable femininity to start anyway so fine, that frees me up to do whatever I like....just my take on it and one that fluctuates but it’s an interesting conundrum....

Just dug out Chanel les beiges healthy glow foundation and makeup geek highlighter in duochrome (shade glitz)
Hello skin!

Does anyone want my trial size Paula's choice 2% bha?

Halfway through the article bo posted, I'm reading all the links and going down a rabbit hole of really fascinating stuff. Thank you for sharing it.

Hi Bo, can I please ask why you decided to try out the Medik8 R-retinoate youth activating cream over the Medik8 retinol TR serums?

Or have you already tried one of the serums (that does ring a bell) and now you've just decided to try another product? Thank you!

Wishing everyone a lovely week ahead

Enid, I remember getting lost in a French hair playlist on YouTube once, I'll see if I can find it again but basically, they did the very technical blunt cut that you now have and then they would cut into it vertically to give it that movement and natural movement.

Lone, Retinol percentages on OTC skincare is really confusing. They can pretty much put anything on there and we'd be none the wiser. 0.5% pure retinol is the maximum, which is significantly less than prescription tretinoin that usually starts at 0.25% to keep it more confusing. I don't think TO ever had 1% in Squalane, just a pure 1% Retinol in a tube which was very strong and irritating and they sensibly got rid of. Are you sure you're using 1% in Squalane?

Sallie, the jade rollers are basically like any old massager so it helps temporarily depuff in that sense. The jade has the added benefit of it being cooling (and it has to be real jade, the cheaper ones aren't) which is helpful for acne prone folk as they often tend to run a bit higher in body temps that allows the p. acnes bacteria to proliferate more easily (that's the theory anyhow).

MrsD, I get what you mean. I've resisted reading Naomi Wolf's the Beauty Myth for forever as I don't like the idea of it being rationally laid out that things I enjoy are harmful to myself and womankind. It would be nice if there was a S&B/Feminism crossover thread on how the heck to deal with that dichotomy or at work towards eroding it somehow.

Olli, watch out with the May Coop Raw sauce, it has a lot of alcohol in it. Most didn't seem to find an issue with it but if you're suddenly getting dehydrated/flaky you'll know what to blame.

Sophie, I'm sensitive and reactive so I respond quicker to actives (hence why I'm probably seeing such instant results with the R-Retinoate) but if it's too much it completely wrecks the natural balance of my skin so I always need to proceed with caution and not push my skin over the edge. I've always considered pure retinol as too high-risk territory for myself. I've contemplated encapsulated retinol with a slower release as an alternative but the products out there with that technology like Paula's Choice, Skinceuticals, and the Medik8 Retinol TR serums are still considered quite irritating as you have both the Retinol and the Retinol conversion to contend with. It's too much of a gamble for me and I'd probably be better off going straight into the prescription route as I don't have to contend with the conversion irritation and I can dilute the strength by buffering, but I don't have a genuine need for that at the moment so the esters and derivatives are just a better choice for me at the moment.

*texture and natural movement

Thanks Pupsie now which one to try first? 🤔

I skimmed through Bo's article but not sure if they mentioned my demographic of waking up one morning and realising your skin looks like utter crap so trying out products and finding out that they actually work thank you very much therefore shall carry on experimenting with products as my skin improves and changes.