So I've realised that I don't know what "frumpy" looks like...

[Blackden]

and therefore there's a very good chance that I am extremely frumpy.
I read the Boden thread with interest.

Can you please describe frumpy? Does it mean baggy and shapeless clothes? At my age I can't be wearing those 'BodyCon' type dresses (not got the figure for them either )
Or can you link me to some frumpy stuff because I just can't visualise it.

And, what's a 'wrong side of 45' woman to do? How can I avoid looking like mutton but not look frumpy?

Exactly dripping my rear is not what it was!!

Bunbaker exactly - nearly £50 for plimsolls . I got dd and I a cracking pair of pretty canvas pumps each with a little criss cross at the front which are really pretty for £6.99. (She has vans as well though). I will dump mine in the South of France at the end of the holiday.

Chandon we're just proving how very frumpy and unfashionable we are.

I've got Converse and I've got plimsolls.
No comparison. The Converses have a much heavier sole and are more comfortable for walking long distances in- such as major shopping expeditions.

If your bum is not good Married you can wear a top which cover it- or do some exercises like squats to tone it up :)

Actually, I think posture has a lot to do with looking frumpy- it makes a massive difference when I stand/walk properly, takes pounds and years off. I just need to train myself to do it all the time, not just when I'm thinking about it.

My Mum is one of those people that look good in anything! She is tall and slim and always looks very glamorous. She even wore one of my cardigans that I think makes me look frumpy and she looked lovely in it! And she is 62 :)

I have done a lot of thinking about this. There was a lot of discussion earlier on about frumpy/nonfrumpy shops. BUTit seemed to me that a lot of this was/is down to taste/age.

Waterfall cardigans were discussed at length. But would a truly frumpy person know what one of these was? I doubt it. I don't think a truly frumpy person would even care.

So, I don't think it is about skinny v bootlegs, Zara v M and S. These are more taste and age thing. I think it is about lack of interest and lack of aesthtic awareness about self and adornment. So

Good posture tick
Groomed hair (including intentionally messy) tick
Belief in oneself doubletick
Well fitting clothes tick

I am so frumpy, I didn't need to read this thread to realise that. I think my problem is I need to lose weight and have really lost my way since having children. You can look stylish whilst you are losing weight but it takes effort and money and I seem to have neither.

Need to get my diet sorted because carrying this extra weight means that I have wasted these last few years. I'm just desperate to blend into the background, lost all confidence and do not accept any social invitations. Must get back on track.

Surprised to hear that at 31 people are suggesting that shops like Top Shop, Zara, Cos etc should be avoided. I wouldn't touch M&S (apart from undies), Boden, Monsoon etc, all seem far too mature and frumpy for someone of my not so tender age!

FWIW I also wear converse but then so does my super cool 23 year old cousin. It's all in how you style an item. A year on from having my daughter I'm a size 14 rather than the size 10 I was before. Now I'm bigger I am actually avoiding a boot cut style jean for fear of looking frumpy but would be quite likely to wear them (as part of the right outfit) if I was still a size 8/10.

Don't get why people give up on fashion at 30 plus or after having a baby. Or have the perception that fashion = heels.

Check out Vogue Street Chic for inspiration.

Inspired by this thread I did a quick frump check at a public event I attended today. The overwhelming result was the frumpiest women all wore badly fitting underwear. No matter how nice the clothes were on top the VPLs and saggy boobs / four boob look just weren't flattering at all.

In second place in the frump stakes was badly fitting and unflattering clothes.

The event was in a field so I didn't really notice the shoes.

Note to self. Listen to my own criticism.

Oh dear, I'm only on page 4 and am realising I've reached frumpsville ahead of time. I'm only 34 :(

I wear cheap jeans as I refuse to spend lots of money because they never fit me right anyway (and I get sick of shopping for them after trying on ten pairs that all look rubbish). Trainers as I don't drive so I walk everywhere pushing a push chair. Plain t-shirts as it's only 3 months since I've stopped bf, and my nice figure-hugging t-shirts are still a bit tight. (And to be honest they are mostly fairly short in the body and I've realised they were probably making my bum look bigger - as if it needs any help).

I suppose I don't make much effort because I have no idea what looks good on me, as someone said earlier. I have never been into fashion, some things that are fashionable just look utterly ridiculous to me. In fact, I normally define fashion as "wearing something that, six months ago, you wouldn't have been seen dead in."

I have got quite fed up with my wardrobe recently and got rid of quite a bit, but I've no idea where to start replacing it! Not much choice in shops here, and I don't have lots to spend. I'll continue reading the thread and hopefully will get some clues :)

The dictionary definition of frumpy is 'unattractive, dull, unfashionable'.

Unattractive - not sure what one can do about this - beauty in the eye of the beholder - but I suppose the grooming factor is relevant here - making the best of what you have etc

Dull - as in colourless? So wear colours (that suit you?)

Unfashionable - this would appear to be solvable by wearing Primark skinny jeans and slinky t shirt with large scarf draped around self. Plus ballet pumps.

I quite often put some jeans on and a decent t-shirt and think I look ok, quite presentable. Then it gets chilly so I grab a fleece or a hoody. An hour or two later I have to pop out, but it's only a bit cool and I have a hoody on so I grab a light windbreaker thing. It's only once I'm out and about that it occurs to me to think about how the whole ensemble actually looks. (Like my wardrobe exploded, probably.) Hmm, I think I can feel another charity shop bag coming on. The last couple of plain t-shirts are going, and probably a certain hoody. (Lets face it, if I wore it when I was 8 months pregnant, it probably doesn't flatter me too much.)

Sorry, I keep hitting "post" and then remembering the main thing that influences how I dress. As I said before, I don't know what looks good on me, I don't know what's fashionable, and I don't know what's really suitable for my age - probably not New Look and Peacocks any more, but surely not M&S yet, either? I'd hate to be wearing something "too young" or wear something fashionable but completely mis-matched.

Basically, I would rather look shit because I haven't tried, than because I've tried and got it wrong.

OBface. If Top Shop = fashion... ROFLMAO!!! I want to dress for my age. I think its unfashionable to be dressing in fashionable clothes that don't suit your age. Young does not = fashionable. You can shop at Top Shop and look frumpy.

The main problem with Top Shop is the clothes are designed for teenagers and early twenties. And whilst at 34, I can just about pass myself off as young enough for that, I don't want to as I'm not that age any more and it doesn't suit my behaviour. You do get treated according to the way you dress - I want to be treated as someone who is more mature than I was. I am fully aware that I probably have a choice that others don't have, but at some point I'm going to start looking ridiculous too. Thats as bad as frumpy imho.

Would I dream of shopping at M&S or Monsoon as an alternative? Nope, because they are awful. But I can easily see why women would - the 30 something market is a bit weird.

Early 30s represents a period in your life where you do start looking at different shops that you wouldn't have used when you were earlier. Its a weird limbo period. I've seen a number of threads from women in this age group feeling rather 'lost' and not really knowing where to shop anymore. There are other shops than M&S that cater for the age group, but I tend to find they can be rather prohibitive in pricing and can only afford them in the sales. And by all accounts there are lots of people who feel the same as me.

Having to shop in new places is especially true if your body shape has changed through having a baby. Shops like Top Shop have sizing that has narrower hip measurements that favour straighter figures than some other shops that are aimed at slightly older women which have more pear shaped sizing. In a lot of cases, women who previously did shop at places like Top Shop or Oasis couldn't even if they wanted to, as they no longer fit.

It creates something of a problem. You don't know quite how to do it, and perhaps don't have the luxury of time or money to try things and focus on yourself in the way you did when you were younger as your priorities are completely different. Putting yourself first or having the 'need' to dress to find a partner are less important.

Net result. Badly dressed frump. Or rather unsexy practical comfort.

Read from 1st page to half way up the latest and had to stop to say that I am 31 and already quite liking Hobbs, Phase 8 and Jigsaw... I used to like Zara and then their quality seemed to go downhill and shoes became menacingly ugly (different colour wedged spikey lumps with huge porn star studs and bulgy bits that remind me of spastic shoes -- sorry not v PC but not sure what else to call them )

However, I have a DD who is 11mo and pg again so will have 2 years in a row of maternity wear, which is taking it's toll on my sense of style/identity tbh. Want a blazar sooo badly to go with my skinnies, but that would be v. wrong with a bump!

Not sure why a blazer is wrong with a bump. Unless you need to wear is fastened. Zara have jersey blasezrs in bright colours and uniqlo usually do them as well in neutrals

I just thought it would look too try hard but maybe you are right and I should just indulge myself...

Er, you're worried about what a blazer with a bump looks like, but you'll happily use the term, "Spastic shoes"?

I was watching re runs of Father Ted last night.

Mrs Doyle was wearing brown nasty cardi, with checked shirt and tweedy skirt. The word frumpy sprang immediately to mind!

Was watching people yeasterday on the towpath at Richmond, sunny day, hordes of people , all shapes and sizes, ages etc and saw no frumpy poeple seems like the sunshine de-frunps {grin]

Hmmmthinkingaboutit. I didn't say I would wear EVERYTHING from Topshop, just that it shouldn't be discounted automatically by anyone over the age of 30. Nor did I say it personified fashion. Simply that I find a few pieces there each season that for me are age appropriate and on trend. But then I have always been interested in fashion, perhaps more so than other people of my age beit at 15, 21 or 31.

And although I've had a baby it doesn't mean by body has irreparably changed. A year on from giving birth (and having finished breast feeding) I now feel it's time to get back to my natural body shape of size 10. So no need to change where I shop (and why shouldn't women of any shape shop where they want?). For what it is worth, I only get the odd bit from Topshop each season and mainly buy from Reiss, Whistles, Acne etc.

Although I agree that (sadly) you get treated differently according to how you dress, I don't believe you get taken any less seriously should you follow fashion. I have a relatively high powered job and it would have a more negative impact if I started wearing clothes that you deem age appropriate.

It is ok for a 21 year old to wear whatever clothes they want just as it is for me at 31 (which I really don't think is that old!).

I am very interested in this thread as I have a lot to think about. I am 40, have baby weight to lose, will certainly not have another baby, need to think about being seen as badass at work (need to look professionally redoutable as well as kind of cool-ish, however this is best done without looking a prat) and basically have no clothes (having scrounged together a second hand capsule wardrobe to go back to work in as I have no intention of being this size for too much longer).

So in the absence of two terrifying Americans in glasses to pull my sense of "style" apart, can the stylish people on this thread please thrown random ideas at me for maybe one or two details that could lift me into the next look-echelon? (if you know what I mean). I think I have pulled myself off base level by having had a haircut, wear make up every day (at work) and I do have the right underwear to minimise sloppiness and bulging. After that, what next?

thank you!