I do not want to share finances or buy a house with him in these circumstances

[MsJacksonIfYoureNasty]

I have been with my husband for 15 years, married for ten. He has a daughter who is almost 22. I have a son who is 19.

We (me and husband) live in a rented house and the tenancy is in my sole name. We have never had shared finances. I am now 50 and he is 56.

We are considering buying a house together.

My step-daughter has recently graduated. She lives in a rented flat on her own. I have recently found out that she has not worked in any paid employment for at least eight months. She used to work part time in a chip shop to earn money in term time and then she’d work longer hours in the holidays to bank money. I knew DH was giving her £400 per month to supplement her income. Obviously this was no problem as it does not affect me. She also got a maintenance grant that more or less covered her rent on the flat.

Because we are applying for a mortgage he has given me bank statements to send to the mortgage advisor.

He has given his daughter £7.5K last month and £8K two months ago. He is not a massively high earner but he saves a lot of money because our rent is low and bills are reasonable.

He says he wants to put down the smallest deposit possible. I now think this is because he is, and has been, paying for everything for his daughter for months. He has never mentioned this to me ever. He didn’t even mention she was no longer working.

In theory he can do what he wants with his money. But if we are buying a house together with a massive mortgage I need to know we can afford it. And I don’t think we can afford it if he’s paying for another household in its entirety.

Apparently she has been offered a job but it doesn’t start for 12 weeks. I asked him how she was going to support herself and he said he didn’t know. He said she has ‘savings’.

For further info my DS and his GF have just bought a house together (5% deposit/40 year term) and I gave him £1400 towards the deposit. The house cost £160k. We are in the East Midlands.

Sorry, that was long. Am I right to be worried about the financial situation and should I buy a house with him in these circumstances?

I would tell him the mortgage advisor has queried these massive payments and asked what they are for, and if there will be any more of them

Also why they were not saved towards a deposit?!

Not sure what deposit you both planned to put in but no chance I would be buying with him anyway based on this situation

I’ll be honest, that I’m slightly surprised this situation has arisen now. If you’ve been together 15 years, then why did you not start saving for a deposit sooner, and discuss how much you could each put towards it? If he could afford to give his daughter so much money, you could have been on that property ladder a lot sooner.

Also, wild suggestion, is there room in your home (and heart) for his dc to move in with you, as she’s got no income. May save spending out all this money.

He has always been very OTT when it comes to his daughter. He feels guilty about leaving her mum when she was a baby. As a consequence of this he has tried to overcompensate in other areas. For example, when she was little and she used to come for dinner he used to offer her about ten different meals so he could ensure that she got what she wanted.

I am all for giving children choices but this was off the scale. I also think (although I could be wrong) that he has set himself up as the 'perfect' parent, always there, always willing to help, always providing money, clothes, cars etc. Whenever she says jump he asks how high. Whereas her mother has been set up as the 'uncaring' parent who has less money and therefore cannot provide material things at the drop of a hat.

This is not a criticism of DSD. It's just the way it is. I think the dynamic is unhealthy, on his part anyway. He cannot accept she is now an adult and has to take at least some responsibility for her own life.

We haven't always earned what we are earning now. We have both started earning a lot more in the last five years or so and his salary has almost doubled in that time. Also he had an awful credit rating and there is no way he would have passed a credit check. His credit report is now clear, at long last.

She could live with us but she doesn't want to. Before she lived in the flat she shared another rental property with a friend (2nd year of Uni) and before that she was in halls. Before that she lived with her mum.

This is a good idea and gives me an opener into having the conversation without him getting defensive. Thank you.

Op the bank will ask what these payments are for. I have 200 a month goes to a saving account where I pay my DDs clubs, skibtrips from. I had to declare it and because she attends a state boarding school (no fees) they actually listed it as a Bill, but, despite the activities being completely voluntary.

This could be your conversation opener and take it from there.

Unfortunately not. I could not borrow enough. I earn £40k and I don't think anyone would lend me 6x my salary. I wouldn't want to borrow that much in any event.

What I have not been told is how she is planning on paying for her life in the meantime. He says 'savings'. How many students do you know have enough savings to run a flat? Madness

He's talking about HIS savings OP. Honestly I'd divorce him now before he has none left and then becomes entitled to yours. If he still currently has savings, pension etc and so do you then you could split with things being 50/50. The more he spends his assets on his sponging DD, the more of your assets you're going to have to give up in a divorce. He's going to milk you dry, because he can, because she's his priority not you.

This is more complicated than it appears.
You are married. You do not legally have seperate finances.
He is denuding himself of savings, whilst still legally owning a share of your savings.
You need to get copies of those bank accounts!
Do not buy with this man.

THIS

I hadn't actually thought of that side of things but you are absolutely right, thank you.

I am going to broach this by saying the mortgage lender wants to know what these payments are for and see what he says. I am not really interested in his answer but the point of the exercise is that it gives me an 'out' of buying this house.

Then I need to look at divorce. Maybe he can buy on his own? He earns more than me and probably would be able to buy a house by himself, even with his 'small deposit'.

There is no way on this planet he will give me free access to his finances. Not a chance. Not voluntarily anyway. He doesn't get any paper statements from anywhere. I leave after him in the morning and I arrive home before him in the evening. Most of our post is junk mail.

AND THIS.

In your shoes, @MsJacksonIfYoureNasty, I would consult with an experienced divorce solicitor as a matter of urgency.

Also look at Wikivorce, Divorce for Dummies, websites of family solicitors in your jurisdiction.

The sooner you take control, the quicker you can get our of this potentially messy situation.

If I were you and you trust your son I would 'gift' my savings to him as your DH has done to his daughter due to 'life'. You could do this over several months BEFORE raising possible divorce. You don't need to tell him just like he didn't need to tell you.

Don't tell him you don't trust him financially but just you have done the sums and buying doesn't seem to make financial sense given low rent and security and you need more time to think it over as you have not been a house owner responsible for repairs and maintenance for so long and it's a big step. Mortgage rates are unlikely to rise in the near future and if you haven't found a 'forever' home there's nothing to lose.

Otherwise, if you do divorce, your DH will be entitled to half of your savings whilst you will be entitled to didily squat of his as he has already gifted them to his daughter.

He will have to make a full declaration of his assets as part of the divorce process. Have a look at Form E (assuming you're in England).

In the meantime, can you at least find his P60s?

Yes I am in England. I already have his P60 because the mortgage broker wanted a copy of it, as well as three months payslips etc. I also have his current account statements which, for the purposes of divorce only, make interesting reading. I can see, for example that he has accounts with certain organisations, mostly investment companies like Hargreaves Lansdown (not this company) and that he has been transferring money to them also.

As I have said previously, up until now I have given his finances no thought whatsoever. I have my money and he has his. He can invest his money however he likes. We don't even have a bank account together but this is because I did not want his crappy credit rating affecting mine.

However, if we are divorcing and if he tries to go for my savings then I will at least have some ammunition with the information I already have.

I think you definitely need to address this with him....yes it is his money and up to him how he spends it but £15k in 3 months giving to his daughter, how do you know it's for her he could of just put it in her bank so you don't know about it and makes it look like he's got a lot less than he's making out...something doesn't add him...no way someone needs £15k in 3 months that's bonkers

Yup. The fact OP can't raise it with him without him becoming defensive. Without him twisting it back on her by claiming she's criticizing his DD with MH problems, as a way of silencing her and distract from the fact she's actually criticizing him. It's controlling behaviour.

That's without all this nonsense of it's his money to do whatever he likes with and be secret about when they're married so it's actually not just "his" money at all, it's all joint assets (as is her money). If OP wanted "my money" and "his money" she should never have married him.

I'm guessing OP hasn't seen this side of him before now because he's a bit of a waster - poor credit rating, buying his DD's affections with financial gifts, whilst indulging in a bit of parental alienation of his ex (which is more controlling behaviour) using those gifts to deliberately set up his ex as being "uncaring".

He had it good living cheaply with OP, married to a good saver/credit rating who can help him secure a property in his old age. So reined in his controlling tendencies because it was in his best interests to do so.

Now he's earning more, thinks OP is under his thumb after all these years and feels he has no need to keep reining in his true nature. So convinced his unreasonable behaviour is A-OK and that OP will tolerate it, he's allowed her to see it on the bank statements.

Thank fuck OP has her head screwed on, he's only likely to become more controlling over time.

I think this is a very good summing up. I feel like a right knob.

So do some snooping then. Take a day off, see what you can log into. Otherwise he's not going to be declaring all his assets in the divorce and you're going to get shafted.

You're not a knob OP. These arseholes can be fucking sly bastards. Many women would have sleepwalked into this and be posting on here in a year's time shocked that their H has turned into a full on cocklodger having wasted all the family finances, feeling beaten down by the inevitable emotional abuse she'd be receiving if she dared to mention any of this.

And yes, I do have my head screwed on (ish). Unfortunately finding out about all of this is the nail in the coffin.

On the subject of divorce. My last one was under the old rules and it was a pantomime because he would not accept service of the papers and the Judge got very cross and decided that he had been served after all (deemed service). I had a solicitor for that one and she handled everything. I was earning a pittance in those days so I qualified for legal aid.

My understanding is that the rules have changed. I can apply online for divorce (the mechanics of this) and then instruct a solicitor to handle the legal side of things/consent order. Does that sound right? I am going to have an hour with a family solicitor and they have said the cost, for the consultation, will be £300 plus VAT.

As I have said previously, up until now I have given his finances no thought whatsoever. I have my money and he has his

But this is not correct. You need some proof that he has transferred assets away from your marriage. At the moment he is spending his money, and if you should split up, you will be made equal-ish, your money is not your money!

He's a sly fucker alright. I also wonder if he is transferring assets to her as a way of hiding his money. I mean, she isn't working and has no income. Fact. I know this as she has told me, that's how I found out she was without work. So some of the money might be going to her but maybe not all of it.

And maybe he wants to buy a house with me because I would be trapped then. I know someone who had to pay for an Order for Sale and it cost them about £10K.

Don't get me wrong here, he is not overtly abusive but he is manipulative and only wants to discuss things that suit him.

I have proof that he is giving large sums to his daughter. I have copies of the statements saved to my laptop and in the cloud too. And I have emailed to myself at work today so I have copies here too.

I have proof that he is giving large sums to his daughter. I have copies of the statements saved to my laptop and in the cloud too. And I have emailed to myself at work today so I have copies here too.

And change your password.