Meeting the mum and knowing what we do

[UniSim]

Need some friendly MN advice

Recently met DH’s kids after a long wait to ensure it was right (14 months), EXW has known about us for a year, the idea to meet children has been discussed since February and she was informed of actual plan to meet in advance (1 week).

She was unhappy about how much time she was given and is asking to be told of all meetings or plans in advance

We are only at the start and I understand she is probably worried. I haven’t met her yet but plan to. We want to keep everyone happy, especially the boys, and not have conflict or cause issues in what has been a relatively civil arrangement up to now

Any advice for keeping the peace whilst ensuring we are not beholden to his EXW?

It's for the benefit of the child.

People's judgement can be clouded in new relationships.

Not all parents put their child's best interests first.

Both parents have a duty to protect the child and for the sake of amicable co-parenting should know all people that either parent proposes to be spending time with the child where they may be unsupervised some of the time.

Basic respect and co-operation like this is required for children not to be damaged by have a separated family.

All of this "you don't have to..." stuff is childish and seems to be indicative of people thinking more about their preferences than the needs of the child.

By "need" I presume the poster meant "should", in the best interests of the child and keeping things amicable. Choosing to start a relationship with somebody with children without causing unnecessary disruption to them requires a level of maturity, pragmatism, compromise and emotional intelligence where you put the child's needs above your own and do what you can to make things better for them and ensure amicable relationships between their two homes. I don't think the poster meant "need" as in "a legal requirement" or whatever!

It sounds like OP wants this to go well so I think meeting the children's mother first and being on the same page with how to prepare the children for it is a helpful suggestion. It would be 20 mins of OP's time for a coffee. Why such resistance to the idea from so many posters?

@TooManyClouds I feel like you've failed to see the irony in your own posts. You're claiming nobody is saying it's something the SM HAS to do, then shared all the reasons you think they have to.

The new partner already knows whether they are a risk to the child, or not. So it's not really in the child's interests, it's in the parents interests, to put their mind at ease. It makes very little difference to the child. I'd have no interest in putting their mind at ease if they told me I had to do what they wanted, called me immature for exercising my right not to obey them, and attempted to pressure me into thinking I should be putting their very tenuous, loose interpretation of the child's "needs" above my own when I haven't even met them yet.

This!

No, I'm saying they don't "have to" in the legal sense, but that they absolutely should do so, as it's the right thing to do and most likely to make things go smoothly.

As a PP said some people will never be reasonable, ever. And that's a different case, but I think a bit of give and take and trying to co-operate can go a long way with most normal people. People are protective of their children, it's understandable they want to meet people they'll be spending a significant amount of time with, isn't it? Especially if this may progress to being around those children without a parent present in the room all the time. And it is in the interests of the new partner as well to have an easier time if they get on well with the children's other parent? As well as much better for the child because children sense animosity even if you try to hide it.

I suppose I don't really understand the strength of the objections when it would be 20 mins of the OP's life for a coffee somewhere neutral, and may establish a good rapport that will make things better for everyone for many years to come?

Yes a bit of give and take is good, hence, if YOU want to meet your ex's new partner, something that benefits you and not them, then be bloody polite about it, otherwise they're likely to say no, and quite right too.

I don't think it has any particular benefit for the new partner, no, unless the ex is planning on acting unreasonably towards them if they haven't had a 20 minute meeting with them. Similarly, one meeting makes little difference to the kids, unless their mum is planning to show animosity if they haven't had said meeting. This is all about the mum and what she wants and feels she needs. Nobody else.

Surely you just meet at a pick up or drop off at some stage when you are there when there is the kids handover. It's not an event , it's a hi I'm X and business as usual.

Agree your DP just needs to nip this in the bud now. He needs to tell her he wanted her to be aware of the first meeting etc. that this went well and any issues he will let he know about of course as he would with anything else.

However she does not need a schedule or when the kids will see you and what's happening. The kids will see their dad as usual and sometimes you will be there and sometimes you won't, but that's for you and their dad to sort and nothing to do with her.

@TooManyClouds
I agree with you in a situation where you are dealing with emotionally mature people then it absolutely benefits the child.
It's a 20 minute coffee, it's not a lot to ask.

Yes a bit of give and take is good, hence, if YOU want to meet your ex's new partner, something that benefits you and not them, then be bloody polite about it, otherwise they're likely to say no, and quite right too.

Errr... not me, no. My DC will never have step parents.

I don't think it has any particular benefit for the new partner, no, unless the ex is planning on acting unreasonably towards them if they haven't had a 20 minute meeting with them. Similarly, one meeting makes little difference to the kids, unless their mum is planning to show animosity if they haven't had said meeting. This is all about the mum and what she wants and feels she needs. Nobody else.

Of course it benefits the new partner. Presumably they care about their partner and want them and their children to be happy and comfortable with the new setup? This tiny amount of effort and time will help immensely with that in most cases.

Children are a lot happier and settled when living between two homes if parenting and boundaries are consistent between them and all adults involved co-operate together so if the OP sees this relationship progressing to living with her partner and being there when the children are at their home with their father then surely it's better for everyone to have happy, well adjusted children who don't feel uncomfortable or torn between parents who aren't communicating well with all of the behaviour challenges and stress that would bring, and that the children feel comfortable talking about their mum to her, and about her to their mum. It might not work in every situation but why would someone NOT want to make this tiny amount of effort to get things off to a good start and reduce the risk of things become difficult for the children and them and their partner?

Errr... not me, no. My DC will never have step parents.

I was speaking rhetorically, not towards you specifically.

Of course it benefits the new partner. Presumably they care about their partner and want them and their children to be happy and comfortable with the new setup? This tiny amount of effort and time will help immensely with that in most cases.

.... Again, what has it got to do with those people? It's not her partner or the kids who it would make feel more comfortable, it's the ex, it's for her benefit. Why would her partner be uncomfortable they hadn't met? It would be pretty tangential to say it benefits the new partner because it benefits her partner and the kids, anyway, but it doesn't even benefit them! There's no "of course" about it...

Children are a lot happier and settled when living between two homes if parenting and boundaries are consistent between them and all adults involved co-operate together so if the OP sees this relationship progressing to living with her partner and being there when the children are at their home with their father then surely it's better for everyone to have happy, well adjusted children who don't feel uncomfortable or torn between parents who aren't communicating well with all of the behaviour challenges and stress that would bring, and that the children feel comfortable talking about their mum to her, and about her to their mum.

All that may be so, but far more relevant if they are going to have ongoing communication. Not the 20 minute meeting you described. The ONLY purpose of that is to satisfy the mum, and the only reason a 20 minute meeting would help the children not feel torn between their parents is if without that meeting, the mum planned on making it clear to her DC that she has a problem with their SM. That's entirely on her to control, she does not have to do that. She can make them feel just as comfortable if they'd never met as she could if they had met for 20 minutes.

It might not work in every situation but why would someone NOT want to make this tiny amount of effort to get things off to a good start and reduce the risk of things become difficult for the children and them and their partner?

It's not a tiny bit of effort meeting up with someone that is behaving in a rude and entitled way towards you. That is my point. It might be a tiny bit of effort if they were polite and gracious. And again, the only way things would become difficult for them without this meeting, is if their mum chose to act unreasonably out of petulance due to not being granted a 20 minute meeting. That is on her.

Stop!!

You've just suggested something that is normal.

The step-parent shouldn't be parenting your child unless your ex is a shit parent.

People saying a meeting has no benefit on the step parent so why would you.. What's wrong with that. Of course meeting for a coffee is more for the ex wives benefit... so what?!? She's handing her child over to you (and her ex but she already knows him)
You don't have to go along with her wants but in my experience it makes for a much easier life if you start of on a good footing.
Also in my experience it absolutely benefits the child. Example.. I met SD when she was 4, when she was 6 she said she hated having two birthday parties and wanted one party with all of us. If she hadn't witnessed me and her mums acceptance of each other she probably wouldn't have been comfortable asking that.

How would meeting the mum when the child is not present help?

Meeting the mother when say dropping off the child where the child sees you both being civil to one another, and continuing to be civil when meeting is more helpful.

That's what my mother and first step-mother did, and other parents/step-parents I know.

I've been impressed by some of the interacts of some step-parents when one of the parents involved was a lazy/rubbish parent.

There's nothing wrong with that, but you have to act accordingly. If you want somebody - a stranger to be precise - to do something for you that is for your benefit only, you need to ask politely and not make demands/ultimatums, or they will think you rude and say no.

And what you've described there about your SD is the benefit of having an ongoing, cordial relationship, that as others have said could easily be achieved naturally over the years, rather than through a formal meeting you've demanded happen on your time schedule as a prerequisite to the mother not refusing contact with the father, that the children do not even witness. That is of no particular benefit to them. If you're not going to have an ongoing relationship between the two households then this one meeting won't benefit the kids at all.

@my82my

But she could have witnessed that acceptance without a planned meeting, instead seeing it at handovers, etc. I'm assuming she wasn't at your original planned meeting anyway?

I never had a such a meeting with my sons SM. I actually met her years ago when I was still with my ex, but that gave me no insight into her suitability as an SM anyway.

We've still managed to build such a relationship where we've spent time together at a mutual friends, thrown him a party together, etc. sat down and discussed any issues affecting him, send each other the odd photo, etc.

Meetings like the one being discussed are totally unnecessary.

Should have explained better.
We met for a coffee, for ex wife's benefit as I knew she was very nervous about me.
We did this before I met my SD.
Leading up to meeting my SD her mum would tell her.,, Daddy has a new friend, she's very nice, when I next drop you off she will be there... won't that be fun!!
When she dropped SD off the first few times she'd stick around and have a coffee. (If I wasn't there she wouldn't do this.)
She also asked me over coffee if I would mind not being overly affectionate with my now DH, and also to get up earlier in the morning so SD didn't see us in bed in the morning. She wasn't being controlling she was trying to navigate a new normal with a little who's life had completely changed.
Just to add when I met my DH his relationship with his ex was awful, she had an affair and he was still angry, a lot of people said to me that she had no right making demands. But from a mothers perspective I think you have to put your own stuff aside to benefit the child who is dealing with so much change.

The children will feel more comfortable if all of the parents are on board and have a good relationship with each other.

How would it not make the new partner's life easier if there is no animosity and everyone communicates well, shares information, the kids feel comfortable and know the parents get on and don't feel awkward discussing the new partner with their mum, the children are less likely to exhibit emotional problems because they feel more secure...?

How can they establish ongoing communication is they don't even have a short introductory meeting to get to know each other a bit?

It's just asking for a bit of maturity and forward thinking, not the moon on a stick. I really don't understand why anybody would get involved with someone with kids and not want to make this effort. Sure, some people are nuts and it will not work in every situation but OP didn't say anything about the mother being a crazy person. Just someone concerned about her children and who they are spending time with and wanting to meet them, which seems entirely reasonable really. I wouldn't hire a nanny I've never met! Surely it's better to at least try to make things smooth and easy for the benefit of everyone? If it doesn't work, only 20 mins of OP's time have been wasted.

How would meeting the mum when the child is not present help?

An attempt to establish communication, make everyone feel comfortable with the situation, and therefore the children are also more likely to be comfortable and happy.

Not implying step mothers are nannies before anybody jumps on that!! 🤣🤣🤣 Just that anybody who might be sometimes with your child without supervision, it's completely reasonable to want to meet them first!

I agree. It's not in the child's best interests. If mum can't act like an adult about it then that's on her.

That's just common sense your partner should have known though

Mum can get herself comfortable

So say you've had a fairly brief relationship with someone and are now co-parenting. Before that child spends time alone with an aunt, a grandmother, a grandfather, you expect to meet them all?

@TooManyClouds Ok, well you are very much just forcing me to say exactly the same things again because it doesn't seem like you took them on board, I already addressed those points, but here goes...

Why is the alternative to this meeting "animosity"? You're saying that like it's a given, but the ONLY reason the kids would get the impression there was animosity between the parents in this scenario, but not in one where this meeting had taken place, is if their mum chose to demonstrate animosity to them due to not having met. She does not have to do that. The kids will not witness this meeting, it makes no difference to them. An ongoing relationship obviously would but this meeting is not an ongoing relationship.

In terms of how you establish one - as others have said, you meet naturally down the line (or don't - not everyone does). Or you could say "it would be great to meet some time, no pressure though and whenever suits you", which is a world away from "you must meet me before you meet the children, or you are not allowed to by my grand authority as mother". That is not a good way of starting a positive relationship. A mother that would behave that way is not somebody I would have any inclination towards meeting.