Refusing to have DSC

[Nights11]

I'll keep it short!

My husband works in a high pressure job which is under a lot of straight from lack of staff. As such he's having to work emergency night shifts which he doesn't usually do, sometimes staying away from home. It's all a bit of a mess at the moment.

We are struggling to work this around when we have DSC which is 50:50 3 nights one week and 4 the next.

I work long days too in another high pressure environment (law) and at the moment I'm also doing 99% of most things at home with this situation at my husband's work. We share nursery aged children so they are in nursery in the day but I'm collecting after work and then it's home typically as DH is leaving and I'm responsible for everything then on. I'm also having to fit in bits of extra work in the evening once they are in bed just to get things done and basically I'm flat out exhausted too!

Basically the issue is my husband's ex is refusing anything which isn't DSC coming as normal whilst DH is working. He's offered to pay for childcare, he's offered to pay more maintenance, he's offered to have them more when he does get home ect... She works 3 days a week and doesn't do nights so there is no reason they can't stay at her home during the night.

I appreciate its annoying and it means it may be harder for her to make plans but I don't feel the responsibility is mine to then take DSC on the nights / days DH is away.

They are 11&13.

I'm basically flat out refusing, which may sound unreasonable but I am so exhausted and the last thing I want is 2 more children to care for half the week when DH isn't even around most of the time.

Basically I've said if DH isn't here then DSC will need to stay with mum or at her house. It's the holidays, DH has offered to pay for clubs, she works from home 3 days a week and they are old enough not to disturb her if they stay there, as I say he's also offered to pay more maintenance too but she wants them to come here like normal even if DH isn't here.

@ITookABathWithAinsleyHarriott
My favourite reply!! Spot on.

Wish I knew you in real life 😂👏🏼👏🏼

That’s an awful lot of assumptions. For a start it’s not being asked to be flexible. It’s not a day here or there. It’s basically…I’m abdicating responsibility of his kids.
mid be had worked less than two years you could be sure the Op would have mentioned that.
As I’m sure she would have clarified the massive amount of maintenance the mother seems to be getting.
You have no idea about the mother’s time. Non whatsoever. You sound like an angry step mum. Seriously stop blaming women because the dads act like kids are optional extras.
If I don’t have childcare…guess what, I don’t work. I’m self employed so don’t get paid. But that’s just tough. I make it work because I have to. Everyone is under the cost of living crisis. His time is not more valuable than the mother’s. He needs to step up and parent.

What would she do if they were still together? Have the children at home all the time? God forbid

they’re not together The deal is 50/50. She doesn’t have her children at home all the time. The ex is not living up to his end of the 50/50 deal right now. Do you expect the ex to keep her 50% of time without her children totally free so that she is able to step in at a moment’s notice? Because that would be expecting your ex to be your childcare, wouldn’t it? Or should she be able to get on with her life and do whatever it is she needs to do, free from the worry of childcare because the deal with her ex is that he has their children 50% of the time?

If it’s 50/50 and she only works part time, then why is there maintenance? Meanwhile you are almost at breaking point and expected to fill in the gaps.
My partner has a very rigid contact schedule with his ex. There’s almost no changes except time of handover in holidays and long weekends that aren’t we’ll set out in the court doc. There’s NO favours between the parents. Without this framework I don’t think I’d survive being a step parent. I feel for you!
As I suggested upthread, is there no option for your partner to discuss his childcare commitments with his work? If they are so short-staffed he’s hardly going to lose his job for asking?

No but they have given her the heads up that they have a temporary change to arrangements whilst he is looking for a different job.
I would drop ANYTHING for my children. I would never expect the step mum to look after them and I certainly wouldn't make them feel completely unloved and unwanted just to prove a point of a 50/50 informal agreement. They have been flexible with her even with the 50/50 agreement and she can be the same with them.

@Heatwavenotify
You sound like an angry step mum. Seriously stop blaming women because the dads act like kids are optional extras

If you had bothered to read my posts you will see that I share custody of my son with my ex. I was also a single parent for 11 years, I have one child full time with no maintenance whatsoever and have primary custody of my son. I also work full time. I am not an “angry stepmum”, I am a mum though and in my opinion the mum is being selfish here.

That’s an awful lot of assumptions. For a start it’s not being asked to be flexible. It’s not a day here or there. It’s basically…I’m abdicating responsibility of his kids

No, if you’d bothered to read the posts instead of making assumptions yourself you’d have noted that dad is having to do emergency shifts due short staffing and is looking for alternative employment. He is asking for flexibility in the meantime and has even offered to financially ease his ex’s burden further.

It’s not flexibility. It’s handing the kids back because it’s not convenient. Well it might not be convenient for the mum to have them full time.
The Op has said they have been flexible but If the mum suddenly said she had to work so could they take the kids indefinitely during her time would they agree to it? Judging by the fact the Op won’t do it for her husband, (which is her right), she wouldn’t do it for the mother.
Big difference to showing a bit of flexibility a day here or there.
In the real world…

We need you to work nights.
I can’t as I have nobody to look after my kids.

End of drama. Parents all over the world manage like that. Is it easy? No. But that’s how it works.

It’s not flexibility. It’s handing the kids back because it’s not convenient

It is the very definition of flexibility!!! Compromise and willingness to change a schedule defines flexibility.

Would you have this attitude towards their mum if she asked him to switch up on occasion?

Well it might not be convenient for the mum to have them full time
You’ve completely contradicted yourself. So the kids are an inconvenience for the mum and that’s ok, righhhhtttt.

We need you to work nights
I can’t as I have nobody to look after my kids
”You’ve been here less than 2 years and aren’t showing yourself to be a team player. We are terminating your contract” is also a very real possibility

End of drama. Parents all over the world manage like that. Is it easy? No. But that’s how it works
Again you’ve contradicted yourself, you previously acknowledged that you have had to take unpaid leave from work to facilitate your childcare responsibilities. Dad in this situation is supporting 2 households, I wonder how mum will cope if his income drops so considerably (or he loses his job) and he withdraws the extra maintenance he has been paying or that her children will be living in potentially poorer conditions half the week.

All because mum can’t be bothered to be flexible and have her own children stay at her own house a little bit more often temporarily.

Wow.

I couldn’t imagine treating my ex or children that way to be honest.

But let’s all cry about how unfair it is for the part-time working mum who until now has had half the week to herself and also been paid for having them at her house.

Flexibility for a day here or there is not the same as an indefinite amount of time. Surely you can see that.

At no point has it been said that he has worked there less than two years.

Being self employed and not being able to boost my income when I have no childcare is just part of life. Not sure what the contradiction there is.

You also don’t know how much maintenance is being given. Money for uniforms, school trips….I’m sure if he was paying the mum’s mortgage that would have been mentioned straight away.

You have no idea what the mum is doing or not doing. But her life should not have to abruptly stop because her ex husband wants to change arrangements. Sure it’s great if she can accommodate that but it’s not always possible. Calling her selfish when you don’t know her circumstances because she won’t drop everything because the dad wants to change the arrangements that were put in place for their kids…now that’s wow!

So much hate for the mum. And everyone should applaud the dad whilst he blames his ex for not looking after the kids on his contact time. It’s really sad.

Stand firm ex wife!

don’t let a disorganised mess of an ex husband and his highly stressed new partner (I bet you are not the least bit surprised that your ex’s fuck up is making her feel shit because I suppose you would have experienced the same. Hence “ex”) grind you down and force you to do this.

@Heatwavenotify did you miss this when reading the OP?
He's offered to pay for childcare, he's offered to pay more maintenance, he's offered to have them more when he does get home ect

He is asking for FLEXIBILITY around the days he is having them i.e. can we swap days around if I have to do the emergency shift.

He has not said he isn’t having his kids or piling full responsibility for them onto their mum, he has asked for some flexibility around the dates!!!

Calling her selfish when you don’t know her circumstances because she won’t drop everything because the dad wants to change the arrangements that were put in place for their kids…now that’s wow!

No, I’m calling her selfish for trying to insist a 3rd party who is not their mother looks after them. OP has said mum has said “why doesn’t OP have them?”

Yes, that is selfish. She is not working at night. She is the other parent and therefore default if their other parent cannot fulfil their obligation. That is literally what being a parent is!!!

Dad’s need to work trumps mum’s need for “me time”. Sorry but it does. Also the same in reverse.

It’s amazing how some people don’t see looking after your children as a responsibility that you can’t just abandon when you feel like it. They should come first. It really is as simple as you are in charge of them you can’t do anything else unless you can find childcare or another adult to help you out. I agree with the person who said this arises from misogyny- the male is the one who gets to prioritise everything above his responsibilities but of course it’s the women not facilitating this who are in the wrong?

We can spend all day tooing and throwing about the why's and wherefores of OP's dilemma but ultimately there's two boys here that don't seem to be wanted by anyone.
Hopefully they're not hearing any bickering that's going on.
I can imagine logging in to MN one day and reading DS/DSS not inviting me to his wedding, says I'm not part of the family.

Infact if I was one of them boys I'd be squirreling away any pocket money I may get and moving out at 16.

I agree with the person who said this arises from misogyny- the male is the one who gets to prioritise everything above his responsibilities but of course it’s the women not facilitating this who are in the wrong?

I disagree. I would be saying this about the dad if mum needed to work nights and he said “no, it’s not my time” whilst just going to bed in his own house. Nothing misogynistic about it, they are the parents.

What’s misogynistic is the ex expecting the stepmum to look after the kids she didn’t create just so she doesn’t have to.

It really is as simple as work trumps down time. One is a necessity, the other isn’t.

Funny how the ex happy to accept payment for looking after her kids on her own time though and not complaining about the inequality of that. It doesn’t matter what he’s paying either, it’s 50/50 but she’s happy to accept any maintenance then she’s happy with inequality as long as it’s in her favour.

It seems that you think the dad’s needs trumps everything and are judging a mum who you have no information about.

If you think that it’s ok to call her selfish than that’s up to you.

The bottom line is, it’s his contact time. He’s asked if she will indefinitely look after the kids during HIS contact time. For her own reasons she has said no. Whatever those reason may be.

Therefore he will need to source childcare elsewhere like everyone has to manage during their contact time. The same applies to the mum if she suddenly finds herself in a difficult position. Parenting. Sometimes it’s just hard to juggle. That’s life.

It’s not the Op’s responsibility at any point. It’s the mum’s responsibility during her contact time.

@BungleandGeorge Absolutely!

I would drop ANYTHING for my children

then you are lucky to not to have the worry about paying a mortgage alone, feeding your kids or paying the bills

I would never expect the step mum to look after them
I have never said she should? This is the ex’s responsibility to sort out, not his new partner

and I certainly wouldn't make them feel completely unloved and unwanted just to prove a point of a 50/50 informal agreement

who says the kids feel unloved and unwanted? Most kids are perfectly able to rationalise that going and frying between 2 separated parents is just the way it is. And if it is the ex wife making the children feel unwanted and unloved, why is the father who is making his work his priority also not making them feel unwanted and unloved? Perhaps he’s the one who needs to look at his priorities?

They have been flexible with her even with the 50/50 agreement and she can be the same with them

can she? You know her and her current commitments? What is going on in her life? She’s not got an additional job the OP knows nothing about? Isn’t caring for an elderly relative or sick friend? Isn’t studying? Isn’t unwell herself?

I can only speak from my experience, but when my kids were young, I managed to attend a PGCE course without them realising what I was up to…..Pre-pandemic I also had an every other weekend half day job my kids and therefore the ex knew nothing about because it didn’t affect them. I kept a close eye on my dementia-ridden mum for a couple of years before she could no longer live alone - again not something I discussed with my ex and whilst I am sure the children saw the decline in their grandma, we didn’t name it until she went into a home…I have no clue what my ex is up to on a day to day basis. If he says he can’t have the children, I just take him at his word rather than try to second guess him and his motives because, frankly, it’s sod all to do with me. when you live separate lives, there’s a lot you can do without the other person really knowing about it and the less time you have with your children, the easier it is to keep stuff quiet both from them and an ex.

When men and women have kids, they come first and work has to come second.

When my dc2 turned 10c his care needs rocketed and I had to give up work. This meant that his Dad was able to take a far less flexible job and earn more (which he had to do to make up for loosing my income).

Financially it has been ruinous. We are selling up and moving into rented. But my son needed a full time carer and both dh and I did what we had to do.

Your dh needs to tell his employers that he can't work those hours because he has no childcare for his two kids. Then you can both take it from there.

If it is a temporary thing and you don't want to risk loosing dh's income, then you'll need to look after dsc until he gets a new job.

Life is about choices and these are yours.

I would drop ANYTHING for my children.

Shame this dad won't, isn't it? Even to the extent of just refusing to do overtime. Or is it only mums who need to be prepared to drop anything for their children? Is this just a mum requirement rather than a parenting requirement?

@ITookABathWithAinsleyHarriott
perhaps you should consider why your opinion is:
parent not responsible for the children=selfish
parent who is responsible for the children but wants to ignore that responsibility and please themselves- not selfish?

denying children the continuation of 50/50 residency which they are used to and settled in is not good for them

and why do you keep saying it’s work v spare time? Their mother works. Usually people with 50% residency do their work/ study/ flexible shifts/ appointments etc when the children are elsewhere.

Their mother works part time, and her evenings are free time. She doesn’t work nights.

denying children the continuation of 50/50 residency which they are used to and settled in is not good for them

Of course it’s not, that’s why dad has asked for some flexibility and asked to switch up the days so he can still see his kids. But mum is being selfish because she has said no and is insisting they still go to the household knowing dad is unable to be there.

She does not work nights. He has asked to switch days so he can both honour his time with his kids AND work to provide for them.

Yes it is only eating into mum’s free time, dad has offered to sort out clubs / childcare so if she’s working on those days she doesn’t have to worry about looking after them. He has also offered to have them more on his days off.

Tell me… who is benefitting from mum’s refusal other than her? She is making things unnecessarily difficult for her kids, her ex and his wife. Her having them there does not inhibit her ability to work if dad has offered to sort the childcare. She only has to have them overnight and dad will make up the difference in different days.

People are deluded if they think there is an abundance of jobs which can support 2 households, dad would not be doing night shifts etc and missing out on time with all of his children and his wife if there was another option.

When men and women have kids, they come first and work has to come second

This is an extremely black and white view! Do kids live on fresh air and cost nothing??
There have been many times where my job has had to be out first in order to be able to provide for my family.
Sometimes ensuring you have a stable job and income IS putting your kids first.

But if you don't have childcare, you don't have childcare.

However harmful it is to the stability of your job, no parent can just walk out the door and leave their children unattended.

In that sense, the children have to come first.

I dont blame you. You aren't there as unpaid childcare. And by the sounds of it you have a huge amount going on.

If he has offered loads of options and she is refusing to change just say no. I have a feeling she will change her mind and accept something else.

Do you think she's being like this because it's school holidays and the kids are off for 6 weeks and she doesn't want the extra "hassle" of having them there while she wfh?

Yes I agree @Goldbar, which is why I think their mum is being selfish. Maybe he needs to be black and white about it and say I cannot refuse these shifts as it could put my job in jeopardy. If he has no income then the full financial burden of the kids will fall onto mum.