Refusing to have DSC

[Nights11]

I'll keep it short!

My husband works in a high pressure job which is under a lot of straight from lack of staff. As such he's having to work emergency night shifts which he doesn't usually do, sometimes staying away from home. It's all a bit of a mess at the moment.

We are struggling to work this around when we have DSC which is 50:50 3 nights one week and 4 the next.

I work long days too in another high pressure environment (law) and at the moment I'm also doing 99% of most things at home with this situation at my husband's work. We share nursery aged children so they are in nursery in the day but I'm collecting after work and then it's home typically as DH is leaving and I'm responsible for everything then on. I'm also having to fit in bits of extra work in the evening once they are in bed just to get things done and basically I'm flat out exhausted too!

Basically the issue is my husband's ex is refusing anything which isn't DSC coming as normal whilst DH is working. He's offered to pay for childcare, he's offered to pay more maintenance, he's offered to have them more when he does get home ect... She works 3 days a week and doesn't do nights so there is no reason they can't stay at her home during the night.

I appreciate its annoying and it means it may be harder for her to make plans but I don't feel the responsibility is mine to then take DSC on the nights / days DH is away.

They are 11&13.

I'm basically flat out refusing, which may sound unreasonable but I am so exhausted and the last thing I want is 2 more children to care for half the week when DH isn't even around most of the time.

Basically I've said if DH isn't here then DSC will need to stay with mum or at her house. It's the holidays, DH has offered to pay for clubs, she works from home 3 days a week and they are old enough not to disturb her if they stay there, as I say he's also offered to pay more maintenance too but she wants them to come here like normal even if DH isn't here.

@DuchessDarty

This quote isn't mine "Your DH is a shit father & you're a selfish madam" to quote a previous poster.

Yes people are being lovely to the op and subtly or ^ unsubtle suggesting that op isn't being a team mate by agreeing even though she's already taking on most of the household stuff and half of her partners joint childcare responsibilities. But sure I'm overreacting people are just being warm and fluffy.

That said my comment wasn't @ you or any other of the posters (I haven't read your comments) who have suggested op doesn't have to do this.

Being proper committed doesn't mean your childcare regardless if your SF or SM. Don't get me wrong you can offer, but it's not a moral failing if you go I can't (for no explanation) and I have looked after my DSD many a time without father (due to him accidentally cutting off fingers ect during work). I'm simply point just because you have uterus doesn't also mean you are childcare but the parents have to compromise somewhere either by getting a nanny to stay at dads home (which as I read it and I mentioned this before mum doesn't agree to) or summer camp ect but both of this arrangements need flexibility. For instance summer camp maybe 2 weeks long (mum may not be happy to have the kids away for that long and only agree to whatever the agreement is now).

The flexibility has to come from both sides, it's clear mum thinks that op should be doing this and therefore is why she's being so flexible.

That said let's not pretend you didn't understand the turn of phrase I used or the fact people (not specifically anyone including you) are taking subtle and unsubtle digs at op.

Why is he paying maintenance if it’s 50/50?

This. It needs to stop immediately. So long as he makes sure the kids have all they need.

And why can't her partner help? They are surely on an equal footing to you.

I think you've had a hard time on here. Normally I'd say just grit your teeth and do it for the short term but it really sounds like you are at your limit.

Does your DH have parents who can step in and help with the older two?

And I think that’s fine. You may be right. Or it might be more complex and no one is right or wrong, but nevertheless kids are trapped in the middle. What if the OP supports her husband in that role as it benefits them both, and her children, but doesn’t want to look after his older, preexisting children while he’s there? These situations are often not clearcut.

That said, I’d struggle with this, hence why I couldn’t marry a man with children already. It’s a life decision.

I completely agree with you op
and I expect the posters saying you are wrong are most likely single parents or in same situation as your dh ex wife.
my parents divorced,I went to my dads every other weekend,to see my dad
no point going if he wasn’t there.
i don’t get why he pays maintenance for 50/50.
maybe the situation needs to go to court for a judge to decide what’s fair,they worked it out between them ,with no court order ,you said ..so maybe it now needs to be court ordered .
i don’t think 50 /50 suits your dh any more ,he obviously can’t do 50/50 if he’s at work ,with no one to look after kids at home .
it is a difficult situation for sure ,and I can see everyone’s point of view ,there is no easy answers.

I am in the same position as both your DH’s ExW and you.

I am a mother of 2 (not DH’s though) and also stepmum to 2.

I also have a really mentally draining, full on job that I work long hours for (I’m a QS).

My DH also does shifts and works nights, he also cannot refuse to do night shifts or emergencies so I understand the position your DH is in. In some jobs, you really aren’t give a choice i.e. emergency services, factory work etc.

My Ex’s (father of my son) shift patterns also regularly change so I have to accommodate that. I could be selfish and say “No, you have to sort childcare if it should have been your time” to him. But I don’t, you know why? Because I put my son first and I’d rather he was with me as his mother than anyone else if his dad isn’t available for whatever reason.

My ex isn’t out on a jolly, he’s working to provide for him and our child, to keep a roof over their heads.

The people who are saying that your DH needs to get another job are completely deluded. The cost of living has gone up so dramatically in the last year… household bills have gone up at least £600pcm between utilities, petrol and food price increases.

Both my DH and Ex (in their 40s) have been in the same job type since they left school at 16, it’s not that easy to retain when that’s the only thing you’ve ever known. And doing night shifts at the moment is sometimes the only way to keep on top of bills as they pay extra.

My DH’s ex also works only 3 days a week and she expects me (who isn’t the parent and works 50 hours min a week, whilst raising my own 2 kids) to look after their children when DH isn’t capable.

Absolutely f*cking not. When I married my husband I did not agree to become default childcare or a 3rd parent to my SC. I have no desire to take on that responsibility and have been clear from the outset that that’s my view. I will support DH, be kind to them and treat them with respect but I will not look after them in lieu of their actual parents if I don’t want to.

OP I know how you feel. The burnout is real. Do not feel even the slightest bit guilty about saying no.

I would never do his ex another favour though and I would stop maintenance immediately. Flexibility works both ways… she doesn’t get to work part time, have the kids part time, offer no support in the other direction AND reap the financial benefits of you and your husband tying yourself in knots.

Oh, did I also mention that I am also a stepkid and a single mother to my eldest (in the sense I gave her full time and provide financially for her completely solo).

You are not wrong, I quite frankly think the mother in this instance is behaving disgracefully. Imagine being so petty and uncaring of your kids that you’d take the view “not my problem, not my time” and refusing to have them.

I’m honestly baffled. She sounds utterly selfish.

@shreddednips i don’t believe the whole childcare thing tbh. He’s working nights so where and what childcare is it exactly that he’s offered?

@Louise0701 if he’s working nights, when exactly do you think he’ll be sleeping?
It’s really not a difficult concept to grasp is it.

And it’s summer holidays, so I assume mum isn’t happy about having her kids around when “it’s not her time”.

@ITookABathWithAinsleyHarriott op worded it as “having to work emergency night shifts” I read it as though he was doing these as overtime as well as his usual shifts. If he has the children 50:50 that includes overnight. The issue is OP doesn’t want them overnight. Hence my question; what childcare is he suggesting for overnight, whilst he is at work. Not the next day when he’s sleeping and they will no doubt be out with friends anyway.

I can see this from all sides TBH.

From the mother’s side I can see that she might think that her children’s father is gradually reducing his time with his children and that this is a slippery slope. Unfortunately this isn’t uncommon, and I can absolutely see why she would resent suddenly being told he can no longer have the children 50/50. The only reason he can actually do this is because he’s divorced and thinks he should just bat the responsibility back to his ex.

However, I also question why she would refuse to have them even when he isn’t there. My eXH works abroad a lot and whenever he is abroad the DC have stayed with me, it was never even a consideration that they would go to his partner to stay.

From the OP’s perspective, while I can in part see why she wouldn’t want the responsibility of his DC, fact is she married a man with children, and unless you want to essentially live seperate lives it’s not unreasonable to think that she would sometimes have a relationship with those children independent of their father and as part of his family.

And from the children’s perspective, I can see them posting on a thread like this in years to come and saying “when we were growing up, our father started to work the kinds of hours which meant we couldn’t stay there any more. Our mum refused to have us if it wasn’t her time, and our stepmom refused to have us in the house unless our dad was there.”

It seems none of the adults are putting the children first, and this is very likely to lead to resentment as they grow up.

If it's short term than I'd gladly have the children. You and your dh are supposed to be a team. If his work/extra money are required and you agree with this then you need to help out with the kids when it's his time.

Those poor kids - you sound very resentful.

His ex is entitled to stick with the agreement. As a team with your husband you sort the kids, out all the kids, between you. If he was off out drinking I would not blame you. But he's working. For the family.

You still haven't said why he is paying her maintenance when they have 50/50? Maybe if he explains that he doesn't have to pay her any under this arrangement, she will change her tune?

If it's short term than I'd gladly have the children. You and your dh are supposed to be a team. If his work/extra money are required and you agree with this then you need to help out with the kids when it's his time.

Did you miss the times where Op said she is absolutely frazzled doing her own job and the bulk of childcare for their two children already?
And presumably OPs work / money is also needed - or are you assuming she is just earning pocket money while he earns the proper money?

I second everything @ITookABathWithAinsleyHarriott says. It's the best post on here!
I'm a dm who has also had to work my work around exh's. His work for many years was just not flexible but mine was. His dm helped out the odd time if neither of us could do a school run or similar & I always thanked her for that. However It was not her job to care for our children.
This woman is majorly taking the piss & is getting everything her own way inc. maintenance. Yet again we have a dad trying to do his best to resolve a situation & getting called a crap dad. The same people here would also be calling him a crap dad if he chucked in work & couldn't pay maintenance & I bet his ex would just be SO supportive of that! - not!

Hi @Nights11 this sounds very stressful. Being on the brink already and having stress added is just so hard -especially when it's other unreasonable people putting their shift onto you (and I count your DH and ex equally in that category)

This is a good plan. Just make sure your Dn executes the part that ranges the childcare, and you do all the packing to take yourself off.

Please also remember that the DSC need to have this explained to them - their dad should do that but it would be helpful to them, I'm sure, to hear reassurance from you that this move is focussed on your current needs and exhaustion , not anything about needing to get away from them.

The situation is an unusual one, also. If you have two children under four years of age, and a partner who is able to work a lot of extra hours, and earn more, why would you be working flat out? Children are often falling sick at this young age, until their immunity builds up, and, as we know from other threads, you have to take them out of nursery to look after them, on these occasions. You can't leave a three and a one year old to play happily for hours on in the front room: they need constant supervision and parental input when not in nursery. It does to me that you may have loaded too much responsibility on to your own back, which, be in turn, means you don't have capacity to cope with these emergencies, like your husband needing to work a lot of extra hours. Or is it just that you both feel very busy and stretched, and you, in particular, are wondering if it's absolutely necessary to have the kids, during the week? . It is true, of course, that once you start to break the arrangement, it's easier to do it again.

If it's wrong to introduce kids to a new partner too soon, I guess the mum feels that her free days are ones to see a new partner, if she has one. But more likely she's just panicked by the unexpected change to the existing arrangement.

This is a matter of opinion. I am a team with my DP when it comes to our joint responsibilities. SC is not one of those, he is a joint responsibility with his ex, and it is not unreasonable to say that they are the "team" responsible for him.

Send them to PGL?

I bet the kids would prefer to stay with their mum rather than be looked after by OP or a nanny at their dad’s house just for the sake of them being there.

It does to me that you may have loaded too much responsibility on to your own back, which, be in turn, means you don't have capacity to cope with these emergencies, like your husband needing to work a lot of extra hours.

Mildly shocked/amused by the pure casual sexism of this statement. Why is it for the OP to adjust her working arrangements so she has 'capacity' to cope with 'emergencies' like her husband being busy at work? It sounds like she's just about coping with her own responsibilities but doesn't have headspace for his. He needs to sort his own shit out.

Neither the OP nor the ex are support human beings who exist to facilitate the dad's career 🙄.

To all those blaming the mum for not facilitating the dad. Let’s write it another way. Dad wants 50/50 with the kids. Dad then decides to boost his income so now expects the mum to take on all his contact time and now do 100%…indefinitely. And she’s a terrible mum? Seriously some people need to give their head a wobble. This is exactly why men get away with picking and choosing their responsibilities.

My husband works in a high pressure job which is under a lot of straight from lack of staff. As such he's having to work emergency night shifts which he doesn't usually do, sometimes staying away from home. It's all a bit of a mess at the moment.

I've reread the post and whether it's relevant or not I don't think DH is choosing to work extra night shifts...
But...
As a parent of children that still need his care on his 50/50 nights if he were to refuse and was sacked could this be classed as unfair dismissal?

The people who are saying that your DH needs to get another job are completely deluded

so as a single parent, if your work changed your work rota or demanded more of you, what are you going to do? Just leave your kids home alone? Or put in place some childcare and look for something more suitable? If you want your child 50/50 then you need to be available or make the childcare arrangements. Your ex partner should not be your back up as childcare, except in some kind of unforeseen emergency. That’s the benefit of a 50/50 arrangement for both parents - best of both worlds, your kids as much as possible and the freedom to both work and play the rest of the time, safe in the knowledge your kids are safe with their other parent or that their other parent is putting place suitable childcare. If you can no longer do 50/50, you need to come clean and sort it with the other parent.

It baffles me that people refer to the other parent as "childcare"
I am looking after my children today and not at work. I am not providing childcare so my DH can go to work... I am spending time with, playing and taking care of my own children.

What would she do if they were still together? Have the children at home all the time? God forbid 🙄

@Diverseopinions why are they both working flat out? Because they probably have to so they can afford to live, no one works themselves to exhaustion or works antisocial hours for the fun of it.

Many people “over-stretch” themselves trying to make ends meet. My once comfortable wage is no longer so comfortable to support myself and my children.

Also, who says she doesn’t have back up help in emergencies if the children get sick? I have my side of the family who would help out if my kids are sick and I needed to work. Their help doesn’t extend to my SCs though.

@Heatwavenotify or you could write it another way…
Dad has had 50/50 custody and still continued to financially support his ex’s household even though he is not obligated to.

Dad has also been flexible in the past and helped his ex out.

Dad’s work situation has now changed and he finds himself in a difficult position whilst trying to look for a new job. He is expected and pressured by his employer to undertake extra shifts. If he’s been there less than 2 years then his job could seriously be at risk if he refuses as employers can dismiss you without reason in the UK prior to this point.

Or perhaps the extra shifts are necessary for his to do as the cost of living has risen suddenly and he’s plunging money into 2 households.

His wife is burnt out from working full time and looking after to infants to facilitate her DH working so he help to provide for his ex’s household too, all whilst them also burdening 50% of their costs as they live half the time with them.

Ex works 3 days a week, has 50% of her time child free, gets paid maintenance and would rather her children are being looked after by the mother of her children’s half siblings, who she knows is already stretched thinly, rather than look after her own children a bit more temporarily.

DH has offered his ex more money to provide day time childcare to ease the burden. If the kids are easy as everyone keeps saying then surely they’ll be no bother for their mum?

Everyone keeps saying “what about her free time?” WTF? Why should the person doing the least in this situation who is actually a biological parent be thinking like this??

This isn’t a point scoring exercise against her ex, this affects her children.

Some exWs on this board really shock me… they seem to spout off about how they need time off etc from their kids and would rather have them palmed off onto an unwilling, exhausted person then look after their own children. Dad is not on a jolly, he’s working!!!

From my perspective, the worst part about being split up from my son’s dad is having to share custody. I wish I could see him every single day! I can’t imagine a situation where I would insist he went for contact time when his dad isn’t there, or vice versa.

But then again my Ex and I both have our child’s best interests at heart. We are parents 100% of time and do get to demand days off.

OP is not in the wrong here, not even a little bit