To further 'assist' exw for dcs sake?

[JJfish70]

Good morning everyone.
A friend has directed me to this place so hopefully I can get some advice here.
I am a dad of three aged 22, 18 and 16. My exw and I are divorced for 10 years & we were separated for 2 years previous to our divorce so are12 years apart in total. There was no one else involved on either side, we just were totally incompatible and should never have gotten married. Our eldest was unplanned and we tried to create a family together but it just did not work.
My exw had just left a job when we met and has not worked outside the home since. When we split we agreed I would keep working and she would stay minding the children. I have a good job that involves a fair bit of travelling and I fully appreciated that this made her going out to work while the children were small difficult, as my schedule changes from month to month. This was reflected in our divorce settlement. I pay well over cms which I am more than happy to do. I also undertook to pay for all school extras such as trips etc. and all third level. I have just finished off paying the mortgage on my exw's house which she now owns outright. She also received a six figure lump sum in lieu of spousal maintenance.
I should add that she also moved to the far end of the country to be close to family. This meant I also had to purchase a small property for myself near her home in order to see and spend time with my children.
Now the current issues I'm facing are as follows.
Exw has never gone back to work despite the children getting older and more independent and despite me offering to pay for childcare if needed. She has also proven herself to be very bad with handling money and I am regularly contacted buy my children who say she has no money to give them for shoes, haircuts, that type of thing. She herself has also contacted me looking for money when something happens like her car breaking down. She is always complaining I don't give her enough and says she has gone through the lump sum. How, I don't know, but comments from the children would seem to back this up.
When my eldest turned 18 I stopped his maintenance but give him an allowance & pay for his third level. When he is at his mums and not in his accommodation I have told him to use his allowance to contribute to his mums household which he does. My daughter is 18 and not finishing A levels until this summer so I still pay her maintenance but plan on doing for her what I have done for my eldest once she starts college.
This means the only 'income' going into my exw's house will be the maintenance for my youngest son who has two more years left in school.
My exw is now kicking off massively and demanding I give her more money which my solicitor has emphatically said I should not do. However when I say no she threatens to sell the house and move to another town where some other family members live and threatens to pull our youngest out of school where he is very happy. This could all be bluster but the cold fact is that she is not going to be able to run a house on £200 a week given her lack of money management, her past history and no savings, so I think she will end up doing something drastic like selling her house.
I still travel a lot for work and I have been in a relationship with a wonderful woman for the past 6 years. She lives in the south of the country and has been remarkably understanding and patient of my situation and the fact that I have to spend so much time at the far end of the country because of my children. It has long been my plan to sell my home in the town where my children live once my youngest goes to college and to use the equity to buy an 'our' home with my partner. However I am now extremely worried that my exw will just sell up and even if she doesn't do it now she will do it in a few years and my children will have no home to go back to as she says she will move in with a sister where there would be no room for our children, and will live off the proceeds of the house sale. They of course know they are always welcome at mine and my partners but their lives are in the north as are their friends & their colleges of choice.
At the moment I'm feeling that I should maybe give her my house up there to live in and thus provide some stability for my youngest as he goes through A Levels and let her sell her house and bank the money. Another part of me feels I should put the house in my children's names as their inheritance and they and she can live there as long as they want.
Either way if I go down any of these roads I am giving up buying a home with my partner. I'm very torn as I am worried about my children and their stability but I also feel I deserve to start living my life now they are all older. I am a fairly successful businessman but I have very little surplus personal money as it has all gone on the divorce settlement and on my children and I cannot afford to keep housing them all AND purchase with my partner.
My family members all tell me I'm mad to keep bailing her out but none of them are divorced so they don't really understand my worries regarding my children who will all still need a base until they go out in the world and get jobs.
My partner has a very good and very specific job and I don't feel it would be fair to ask her to give all that up to move miles away just to provide a base for my adult children especially as I would still be travelling for a few more years and they would be coming and going from college. However I also feel it's unfair of me to keep expecting her to keep living this half relationship with me given our ages and the ages of my children.
If anyone has any ideas I would really appreciate it as I'm getting to a stage where I cannot see a way through.

I think you have been very kind to support your ex for so long but now is the time to draw a line. Your children are either adults or nearly adults. They can make their views known to your ex.

Your ex needs to learn to stand on her own two feet which will not happen if you keep supporting her like this. I would call her bluff this time.

You run the risk of losing your current relationship for the sake of giving in to your ex’s bluster and blackmail.

Just to add in relation to your post title, what you are describing is far more than just assisting her. You are talking about choosing things that are life changing for you in terms of housing and relationships. Say no.

Honestly from everything you've described you have been more than fair this whole time.
You should not bail her out any more. You've been more than fair. DO NOT give her the option of selling her house and moving into your "spare".
It might be an option to keep that house there for your kids to use as a base, but honestly as they grow older and move out they might just have to come to terms with the fact their mum has moved and there isn't a house there any more.
Same if she does choose to move house and your DA has to change schools. Is she really that petty? At that point it's on her and her decision.
Obviously we don't know this woman but it does sound like she may be the type just to make threats because she knows you'll comply - especially if she's using the kids as a weapon.
Have you ever called her bluff before, and has she gone through with what she was threatening. You'll know better than us whether she is likely to actually follow through.
As long as your children are aware they are always welcome at yours that's I'd say the best you can really do in this situation.
Your ex sounds very manipulative.

Don't give her your house.
There has to be a stage where she needs to grow up. I know a woman exactly like this, her ex kept her until their children became financially independent and then she expected her children to keep her, even when they had left and had families of their own. Once they eventually said enough was enough, she surprise surprise got a job. I think you are in danger of it going the same way and passing the problem to your children.
I think you need to become the resident parent at least for the 16yo. A couple of options I can see are you relocating to your northern home until your youngest two finish A Levels. Otherwise just your youngest needs to move down to you to attend a local to you school. Nothing will happen with your middle child anyway between now and A level completion. Once they are free of A Levels they and the eldest can also join you to use your home as a base when home from college / uni.

No OP, you need to cut this off otherwise you'll be financially supporting her forever. Your children are more than old enough for her to work now.

You have already paid off her mortgage, all she needs to do is get ANY job and she'd have enough money to live on.

Could you let your 16 year old live in your flat there if his mother decides to sell up and leave and he wants to stay? (And go and see him regularly?). Not ideal, I know, but would mean he could stay with his friends for A levels..

Don’t do anymore. If she carries out her threat then could your 16 year old live in your property to continue school, then you sell once they have decided what they want to do for further education?

At 16 they can decided what they want to do as regards living accommodation. Yes it may mean you going there more often for a while, but surely that’s worth it?

You delay selling for a few more years

Then your ex has to take responsibility for herself

Don’t… She knows how to pull your strings. It’s time she adults up. Let her know that you’re willing to pay for your child to stay close to school and that cms payments cease if she sells.

Help your children not your ex-wife.

These are two separate issues.

So if your ex-wife sells up then it is nothing to do with you. Stop engaging with her over her financial affairs as it is nothing to do with you.

With your children due to their ages they can live independently so keep your flat up there until your youngest is university age or nearly 20, and then make sure you have a spare room in your new home.

If and when necessary give the older ones rent deposits and one months rent. However only give them this once. Any other time make it a loan with a signed paper agreement that they have to pay you back even if it is £10 a month. Otherwise you risk them ending up like their mother. This doesn't mean you can't give them money towards a house deposit but they shouldn't expect it.

Thank you all for your replies and you have all just reiterated what my family have said to me.
To address a few things.
Exw threatens a lot but I always capitulate. I know this is not good but when you're away in another country with work and you child is on the phone saying mum has no money to buy new trainers what do you do? She says things like if you don't get my car fixed your children will have to go to school in the rain. One Christmas she threatened not to do Santa unless I gave her more money. That was years ago and I didn't give in to her. I had bought my own Santa gifts for the children but found myself having to spend Christmas Eve buying whatever toys I could lay my hands on for her house as she had followed through on that threat and had bought them nothing. I think that experience scarred me & I have probably given in too much since. Her threats regarding the house might be just that but I don't trust her. I do know that if she stays put I will have my 16 year old on the phone every day for the two years looking for extra money as his maintenance alone will not be able to cover the household costs.
I have tried to talk to my youngest about switching schools to come down south but he insists he won't do that and gets quite upset when we discuss it.
I'm not in a position to become a resident parent due to my job schedule and as it is my job that is funding everything including third level education for three, cutting back or retiring is not viable for a good few more years. I appreciate that my exw has been impacted by my job which is another reason I have tended to give it to her. I could let my 16 year old live in my house up there but I don't know if that would be a great idea. He's a great child but I'll admit that I don't think he'd be the best at keeping himself if I had to be away for a stretch.
I feel like every turn is a dead end with a brick wall and there is no solution whereby both I and my children can be happy.

How does she propose to support herself when all 3 children have left home?

You are just being far too generous JJFish, your children are old enough now that if anything does happen, you can explain that their mum is the one choosing not to buy them X or not to go to work.

As for trainers etc, you can always give your 16yo an allowance/pocket money or whatever each month (assuming this is affordable for you) which would cover some of these things if needed.

I know it's hard as she's making you out to be the bad guy but you really aren't. You need to stand firm and let her throw her toys out of the pram. You are not responsible for funding her whole life.

With no mortgage, she could work 2/3 days a week and have enough to get by, she is taking the absolute piss.

Also, at some point your children will need to go through some difficult feelings about this because even if you continue to support her until your youngest is 18, after that you'll still be getting calls from them because she's moaning to them that she can't afford X, Y and Z because of you.

She needs to sort herself out and she'll only do this if you stop financially enabling her. She will continue using your children to guilt trip you forever so you may as well nip it now rather than letting it drag on for another however many years.

Do not give her your house.
Give her the CMS she's entitled to and help your child with things they need. Stop getting sucked into paying for more. You only have a short few years of this left and your ex knows that and is probably panicking about how she will manage. That's not your problem. She's made choices and while the children were small being a SAHM was a fair choice. But this day would always come and she should have planned for it, by working or training.
Don't compromise your own future anymore.
Your ex is unkind to her own children to use their unhappiness as a lever to get more money out of you.

Give the CMS amount and pay the rest directly to the children.

I think you would be absolutely mad to do the things you are considering. If she actually does move house in a dirty process to you paying her the appropriate amount, couldn't the kids live with you in the local house you have until they don't need to anymore?

They are so close to being adults I would strongly advise against throwing everything out of the window over a couple of years.

You have been very generous.

I think there are 2 separate issues going on here. You need to pay her child maintenance and no more. If you want to help the kids out with new trainers or whatever on top of CMS then give that directly to them, they're old enough now.
You need to start cutting the financial ties with your ex now.

Then there's the issue of where your kids will live if their mum sells their house.

Is that a bluff, will she actually leave her kids effectively homeless?

Can the kids live in your flat with you staying there whenever you're in the UK? The 18 and 16 yr old could live there together, although that's not ideal.

You could change jobs. I know you don't want to, but you could. Then you could base yourself in your small house until the youngest finishes school.

Or you could insist they move and live in your home down south. That's not going to be a popular choice I know.

None of these choices are great, I'm sorry you're in this position. How much do the kids know, can you have an honest conversation with them about the options or are they quite loyal to their mum?

If you keep the house up north until your youngest is 18, can you then sell it and use some of the money to set aside to help them with rent/deposits for house?

That will be of better long term benefit to your children than throwing it away on their mother who cannot manage her money plus should still allow you to retain enough to go to the house with your partner.

I don't understand why she would sell the house just because you stop giving her money but she won't if you continue?

She's not even paying for the house so not like it would be saving her money to move...she'd just be selling up to live somewhere else but she'd still have the same problems surely?

Oh these posts make me so angry. I've managed for nearly 15 years as a single, working mum of 3 with an ex that pays sod all. You have been generous. She needs to start to live in the real world with the rest of us.

It is unlikely she will sell her house because she'll have huge legal fees and tax to pay on the new one. Don't give her yours - it's probably what she's hoping for.

She's not even paying for the house so not like it would be saving her money to move

Depends on the size of the house. I live in a big 4 bed semi. I will be down to 1 child by September. It would be financially better for us from a running cost point of view to be somewhere smaller with lower ceilings. Somewhere newer would need less maintenance. But those lower costs will be offset by the huge cost of moving for many years. So I'm staying put!

She has power over you because you can’t be the resident parent because of your job which is too good an earner to give up.
Sounds like you are addicted to the money.
If i were you i would take the financial hit and make changes to my work life so i could be a more involved, ideally the resident parent.

TBH she sounds like a vile parent who uses her children to manipulate you. It’s possible she has poisoned your kids into the same way of acting. (Daaad, i need trainers...)

If this is not yet the case, you still have the chance to create a space for your younger children where you can actually parent them sensibly.

I’d give up a large income to know that i’d taken my last chance to teach my kids that there is another way of operating which does not involve being a manipulative shit.

Otherwise you may have regrets for many more years to come if your adult kids start this kind of behaviour. Their hold on you will be lifelong, whereas you can let go of your ex wife once your kids have left home.

What's the 22 year old doing do they go to university or do they work and contribute lodge?

Reading things from your side, you have obviously been very generous. You have enabled her though. I bet she is getting a bit panicky that the money will be stopping and time to stand on her own two feet for the first time.
Keep the home, let your youngest live there. Could private school be an option for the youngest’s a levels?
It must be very upsetting for the dc even though they are older to be torn between the two of you. If they need trainers etc, transfer the money to them.
Good luck, truly.

Ride it out and see what happens I say!
If she uproots your youngest they’ll have to move either way. So give them the option to move with her or move to stay with you. If they choose you then if you can afford to, hire someone to check in on them every day while you are away. Like a home help that goes in the evening and makes their tea, helps with washing, makes sure homework is done etc. Give them an allowance to spend on clothes/fun and do an online shop. Another option would be to let them live in your property near their current home on weekdays with home help there.
Either way do not give in to her ridiculous demands. So long as you are legally covering what you need to in terms of maintenance she doesn’t have a leg to stand on. Your kids know you are there if they need you, but any extra on top of maintenance you need to pay should go straight to them to use as they require.