The reverse and another perspective

[SandyY2K]

I saw this on another forum and a lot of the content sounded so familiar in terms of what SMs say.

Are you quick to assume your stepkid’s mum is High-Conflict, just because she challenges an opinion or decision of your husband’s?

Do you read every email/text between her and your husband? Are you helping him craft every response? Are you responding on his behalf?

Have you put rules in place about how often, or by what means, your husband is allowed to communicate with her?

Do you think you’re a better parent than her? More importantly, do you tell people that?

Do you badmouth her in public? To colleagues? In-laws? In front of the kids?

Is everything her fault? Do you think that your life would be “perfect” if she wasn’t in the picture?

Do you demand to attend all exchanges, school functions, or sporting events if she is going to be there? Even if you know it could cause extreme conflict? But, just because you want your presence known?

Tips to become a Low-Conflict Stepmom

In all decision making, consider her perspective. Your take on a situation is not always right, and sometimes, more heads are better than one.A difference of opinion in parenting does not mean that she is “high-conflict.

I hung around MN trying to get the ex perspective on things. I wasn't a mother, I wasn't a step child, I'd never been with a man with a child before. What the fuck would I have known about all this?
Did not make any difference. One day the wind changed and amicable relations turned into an utter shit show.
Not saying it was because she found out DH had a new girlfriend just saying that after observing 9 months of calm the wind changed pretty much at the same time as she found out about me. Could be a coincidence.

I think sometimes second marriages or relationships with step children end for the very same reasons that that first marriages or prior relationships end. I think that once the rose colored glasses, honeymoon phases, the excitement that comes with a new relationship, etc all dies down , there is just this man and this woman, these 2 men or these 2 women and the incompatibility becomes obvious. It is far easier to blame the ex, the kids, the difficulties of blending, than to say " we are not compatible, we want different things. " Blaming all of these others , allows you not to have to blame yourself for moving to fast, failing to fully disclose or fully explore , or to take any real responsibility for yet another failed marriage or relationship.

It is not unlike the partner who complains about the lack of alone time.
You often read a complaint about the lack of alone time and the causes are often attributed to demands/ needs of the children, the ex,work, in-laws, etc. In these situations, I have never seen the questioned posed as "what is it about me or our relationship that causes him/her not to need or want to spend more time alone with me?". The onus of the problem is never " my partner is not experiencing a need or desire to spend more time with me;" the problem is always that other people are causing me not to have that which I believe myself to be entitled. " In truth, people make time to meet those needs that are necessary for them.

I truly believe that some issues are manufactured or blown out of proportion because they provide an opportunity to place blame on something other than simple ,everyday, common place incompatibility.

In the best of relationships a partner gives all that he or she is capable of giving. Sometimes there is just not enough intersection between what they have to give and what you need or want. To me that is not failure on anyone's part; that is just a realization that my needs and your available offerings do not coincide.

I very much try to be mindful of the ex in some ways, and will put DP off bringing things up with her if I think he's being unfair or would be walking into an obvious bad reaction from her. I do try and put myself in her shoes and often tell him the reaction he'd get from me if he said X or Y to me. There have been times when I've admired how she's handled things compared to how I think I would, and same with my DP too.

But I just think the reality is that having children with someone you subsequently split up from is a hugely less than ideal situation for everybody. The exes, the kids, the new partners, the grandparents....everybody.

The whole situation naturally means that there are conflicting interests from day 1 and it's a balancing act from then on. Particularly if someone chooses to bring a new partner into the equation, as quite often their interests will be in direct conflict with the ex's.

Also let's not forget that mums and dads aren't always on the same page even when they are together. A lot of people did/didn't do certain things whilst with their exes because it was easier to avoid the arguments or because the one parent primarily cared for the children while the other worked so they both sucked it up. Things weren't rosy and working harmoniously between them otherwise they likely wouldn't have split.

I think one of the biggest and hardest things for people to compute is that once you make the decision to split up, you have no control over what goes on in your ex's life, which realistically includes decisions they may make for your children. People think the existence of children entitles them to cast opinions and dictate things in someone else's home and it just isn't the case, and is even less the case when someone meets a new partner who they care about more than they care about pissing off their ex.

^^This would be such a huge challenge for me if I'd been the one primarily caring for children for years, I know that I would massively struggle with the loss of control and not knowing what my children were doing/being fed/when they were going to bed etc etc. It's natural. But it is the collateral damage of splitting up from someone.

I feel like so often we're looking for the villain of the piece when actually there usually isn't one - it's just that the situation as a whole is almost impossible to navigate without everyone involved not being happy at certain stages.

What's that saying, everyone is the villain in one persons story.

It's all about perspective. You cannot know what a situation will be like until your there. You may think your new job is going to be Brillant and life changing, and that maybe true or maybe life changing just not in the respect of it being Brillant. It might be a hell hole but you won't know until your there.

If we could all accurately say this will definitely end badly and predict the future then we would all be wining the lottery.

Everything is about chance and risk to a degree. For me I wouldn't be able to be with a man who had never had a long term relationship at the age of 38. This would be from my view a red flag as they haven't had/been about to to live or work as a team in a relationship. This doesn't mean they would be a awful partner they could be the best ever but I perceive the risk as being higher than what I would like based on the facts and assumptions I hold.

The same goes with blended families, there's nothing naive about assessing the situation with the facts you have in the beginning. Those facts will change as life isn't static. To call people naive for not being about to be mystic meg re all the challenges life and kids throw in a blended family, is ironically in my perspective naive in its self and slightly ridiculous.

For others that single man would be perfect as they have no baggage or ex's to deal with. There risk assessment would be lower than mine. Neither is wrong.

No one is so insightful to be able to predict the future and anyone that pretends to is ridiculous.

@Youseethethingis I think (in general) women invest more of themselves in partnership & children than men. I don't mean we're better parents, but from an early age we're told that our identities are heavily linked to being a mother, being a wife, how we look, holding on to 'our man'. And I think what when these things fall apart a lot of women cannot cope, & the presence of another version of ourselves seemingly succeeding in what was once 'our life' is a bitter spill to swallow.
@LittleMysSister I too was very mindful of my exdp's ex as I too was an ex. Unlike her however I literally was 'replaced'. Exh left for the ow who he wanted to be second mum to our dc from the get go. I had to dig really deep & I mean REALLY deep, not to give in to bitterness & that sense that my identity had been both eradicated & taken over.
I had always worked and this was a massive help as I had an identity outside of the home, but I had to do a lot of therapy to unpick all that societal stuff I'd absorbed from childhood onwards that no matter what I did being a wife & mother was the most fulfilling & important thing I'd ever do.
As primary caters its unbelievably h hard to watch someone else come into your dcs lives & to see your dc bond with them. But love is not finite & I really wish more women would realise that the more people who can be kind to their dc the better.

As primary caters its unbelievably h hard to watch someone else come into your dcs lives & to see your dc bond with them. But love is not finite & I really wish more women would realise that the more people who can be kind to their dc the better.

Magda72, you're amazing.

the presence of another version of ourselves seemingly succeeding in what was once 'our life' is a bitter pill to swallow.
I don't have an exw to worry about, but DH's older adult children fill much the same role. The above translates very well into:
The presence of another version of our Mum seemingly succeeding in what was once 'her life' is a bitter pill to swallow.
You gave me an aha moment there - thank you.

@SandyY2K what are your thoughts on a new(ish) partner coming in and asking for certain changes which benefit the children in some way? Like more consistency and stability? Not all change is bad for children

I've read threads where the SM wanted a change from, for example, every Saturday night to EOW, giving everyone quality time with the kids and proper down time, and also resulting in more contact with the kids as they'd be there for the whole weekend.
Many posters were still on the attack.
There's just no talking to some people.

@Youseethethingis

I've read threads where the SM wanted a change from, for example, every Saturday night to EOW, giving everyone quality time with the kids and proper down time, and also resulting in more contact with the kids as they'd be there for the whole weekend. Many posters were still on the attack. There's just no talking to some people.

But what if that every Saturday night been working just fine and dandy for everyone else except the SM? The SM's opinion that it is better (for all the reasons you describe) is just that her opinion. Of course she can ask for change (well from her DP it is up to him to manage the question with is ex and children (age dependent obvs) but if the answer is no from any of the other parties than what?

There are a plethora of threads where the SM asks for changes or imposes rules because she thinks it is 'best' - what is it about being a SM that means you (general you)are the arbiter of what is 'best'? (obvious extreme straw-man arguments that will shortly be incoming aside).

All the previous comments about being available for a relationship and willing to compromise within it are well made; but they don't apply to the children involved, or indeed that ex but that probably doesn't need saying. There is likely a sweet spot when the children are very young (say < 3/4 perhaps) where new norms can be made and again when they are teens/young adults (> 14 maybe) but those intervening years are tricky.

I know my children lost a lot of respect for their father as they say him becoming a different person to the one they remember living at home - I am sure his new partner thinks he is available and compromising - they saw it as him prioritising her and their (his and hers) new life - to the detriment of their relationship with him (and her tbf).

They ranged from 6 to 13 when he left. Interestingly as the older two grew-up into young adults they become more, I guess, forgiving and understanding of him but they don't have the relationship with him that they would have had they felt they were his priority. Simply they remained mine; but felt they weren't his. He would I am sure disagree vehemently, but 8 years down the line the reality is very clear. And to be fair he was a hands-on, doing the grunt, paying his share type of man - no issues in that respect.

@PinkGinny

My thoughts would still be the same on that. SM is absolutely not the arbiter of that is best, all she can do is express her views/wants to her partner.

As far as I'm concerned, after that it's up to the dad to decide what to do, since he's the one who knows both sides of the situation.

He is free to say to SM "no sorry, every Saturday works best for us as DS does a hobby on Sundays at his mum's" or whatever. And then SM is free to decide if that's OK for her to continue with, or not.

@PinkGinny
All well and good, but the point I was making is that asking for change isn't necessarily going to automatically come from a bad place or be some horrendous trauma just because it was the SM who suggested it.
As for the threads about knowing what's best - The problems often seem to come where it's the old "taxation without representation" bit. If she's left doing the cooking of course she's going to feel it's her place to feed the kids what she sees fit to cook, for example, and not what the parents may or may not want them fed.
I myself out my foot down regarding pick up times as I do them all, and drop offs too as neither parent drives. They were happy to change things to suit themselves but when I needed an adjustment I was told "but that's not what the legal agreement says".. to which I said "then you can sort yourselves out then, I'm the one doing everyone a favour, DSD can come or go whenever the two of you like, but I'll only be going to collect her at this time or not at all".
Probably a massive overstep to some on here but I've never had a problem again and dare I say I might even be a bit appreciated for doing it now.
Totally not on the same scale as the crackpot SMs who totally trample over all boundaries in their quest to be the new Mummy, but still.
One other thing I've noticed is that 50/50, while arguably being potentially unsettling for the child, means that both parents are theoretically building their lives on the same blueprint.
It's much harder to build your whole life around someone you only see once a week or EOW. It's much harder to build a life outside your children if you are in sole charge 90% of the time. It's a circle that can't be squared, at least until they are quite a bit older.

They ranged from 6 to 13 when he left. Interestingly as the older two grew-up into young adults they become more, I guess, forgiving and understanding of him but they don't have the relationship with him that they would have had they felt they were his priority. Simply they remained mine; but felt they weren't his. He would I am sure disagree vehemently, but 8 years down the line the reality is very clear. And to be fair he was a hands-on, doing the grunt, paying his share type of man - no issues in that respect.
@PinkGinny this is a good point and well made. But you know, I sort of think that the nrp often can't win because it sometimes seems like the dc expect the nrp to sit home waiting for their access time. If the nrp does this they literally have no life but if they move on with someone else & changes are made everyone loses it & so often the sm becomes the scapegoat.
We can all argue back and forth as to who has it better/worse - the rp who has minimal time to themselves but has the huge plus of the dc, or the rp who gets a much easier ride parenting but who misses out on their dc.
I know in an ideal world my exh would have wanted both his dw, our dc full time & me gone (& I don't mean that in a nasty way) - but it just doesn't work like that.
I often get the impression that people who wanted to be rps seem to think their exes should just wait around until the dc are free to see them.
My dc don't have the relationship they would have had with their dad if we had stayed together but that's not because they were never his priority it's because they don't live with him. They have a very good relationship with him but the closeness of day to day living is not there - how could it be?
Yes, you can argue that he didn't prioritise then when he left for ow but he obviously felt that he couldn't stay; he didn't love me anymore & to be honest I didn't love him either. He & his dw are a much better match & at least our dc have been shown a better relationship than the one they would have witnessed if we'd stayed together.

@Magda72 and @Youseethethingis interesting you both kinda assumed I was the resident parent - or at least that's what I'm reading into your responses. The arrangement was 50/50 for the first 5 years (8.5 years down the line now.) I think the very fact he did have 50% of the week to build his new life (with his ow too) made it enough worse in their view.

what is it about being a SM that means you (general you)are the arbiter of what is 'best'?

What is it about being a parent that makes you (general you) arbitor of what's best?

Surely what is best is all adults (and older sc) being respectful of each other and coming to an agreement. It doesn't have to be a constant battle.

@Magda72 I just want to say that the fact that you don't seem to carry bitterness towards your ex abs his wife even though she was ow shows a great amount of mental strength.

We can all argue back and forth as to who has it better/worse - the rp who has minimal time to themselves but has the huge plus of the dc, or the rp who gets a much easier ride parenting but who misses out on their dc.
I know in an ideal world my exh would have wanted both his dw, our dc full time & me gone (& I don't mean that in a nasty way) - but it just doesn't work like that.
...
My dc don't have the relationship they would have had with their dad if we had stayed together but that's not because they were never his priority it's because they don't live with him. They have a very good relationship with him but the closeness of day to day living is not there - how could it be?

Magda I agree so much with all of this.

My DP would have loved to have his children full-time but it just would never have worked. Their mum was and always had been their primary carer, and her work life was organised to accommodate that. Aside from the logistical issues with work, DP knew that the upheaval to their lives for him to effectively take them away from her would be far greater than the other way round - not that she ever would have agreed anyway, obviously.

It is so tough for both sides. Their mum complained frequently about how exhausting it was to have both children alone the majority of the time, how she never had any time to herself, wasn't getting much sleep with them waking up etc, which was completely true....but equally she also wouldn't let DP have them any more frequently as she didn't want to be without them, and she wouldn't let him have the youngest overnight at all for the first few months.

Then on DP's side, he was devastated at losing that daily intimacy with them, not being a part of their school lives/seeing them with their friends, worried about keeping their bond strong, trying to process not really feeling like a 'proper' dad anymore because it wasn't part of his daily life.

The reality is there is no winning for anyone once parents separate. There are always highs and lows on both sides and one or the other parent is always missing out on something they never thought they'd have to give up when they first became a mum/dad.