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This is never going to end. Having to consider leaving boyfriend to protect my children from his ex.

114 replies

ThisMustBeMyDream · 05/11/2020 22:02

There is so much back story.

This thread gives a sense of the issues if you want more background www.mumsnet.com/Talk/stepparenting/3549889-There-goes-our-easter-holiday.

Yesterday accusations were made against my children. My biggest fear came true. I have spent over 3 years of my relationship terrified of this moment. I knew that mum was capable, but hoped that time would help allay whatever was going on in her head.

Now I'm having to consider if I can continue in my relationship because I don't think my children can have any more contact with partners child.

My partner had a phone call Tuesday from social care. Mother made an allegation against one of my children, of which I'm sure you can guess the nature. Luckily for me and my partner, I have never allowed the children to be alone together. They are always supervised when here (we still don't permanently live together - he maintains a separate property) because I needed to protect my children. We both know the allegation to be untrue because the children are not left alone (which is exhausting, but I felt necessary until the mother was more reasonable - which I had hoped time would bring).

I had a social worker visit yesterday, who concluded that she had no concerns that anything had happened. She spoke to the children. She was very nice and reassuring. All well on my front. Her investigation will be completed within 3 weeks, other than a safety talk to my children so they can tick a box there is no further follow up. Report will state children are safeguarded by each parent, no concerns.

Child has been medically examined. No concerns there either.

The child is 3 (almost 4). They have repeated an allegation to the social worker - but we don't have the full story still. Social care is in two authorities. My authority told me one version, the childs authority told another version. Childs authority was asked today to confirm allegation, but they said they weren't sure yet and they were still trying to find out what it was from the child Hmm.

Partner was told he can still maintain his contact, but until my authority send their report, child should not come here. Fine by us both. Social worker reports back to mum, no concerns, dad to maintain contact in his property until report is through.

Of course, mum refused. Said no contact at all. Made further allegation that child is now saying daddy tells her not to tell mummy things (again, untrue).

It is exhausting. This mother will not rest until she has what she wants. She plays a long game. She bides her time. This is a child who is not quite 4. This will be the 4th application to court (2nd enforcement, 2 previous child arrangement applications). Me and my children are now being made in to her collateral damage.

I can not tell you how angry I am that she stooped this low. I knew it was possible, but did not believe she would go this far to try and stop contact.

If this had not affected my children, I would be able to tolerate the situation. But now my children have been targeted, I don't think our relationship is tenable. I can step back, we have our own property. The children can be kept separate. But, I just don't think that is a life I want to lead. It is incredibly painful to find myself here. I know couples do do this when children are involved. But for us, it doesn't feel right.

I can't see a way through this. My children will suffer both ways. Obviously they could suffer more if further accusations were made. But should we go our separate ways, my children will have the only male role model in their lives taken away. He enriches their lives incredibly. He has been there for them for 3 years. They are only 7 and 5. They don't remember life before him. He has enabled them to take part in extra curricular activities (I couldn't do it without his support), he has enabled me to change my job to be there for them more by providing childcare at unsocial hours, he has taught them through lockdown and beyond (he is a primary teacher). He is a father figure to them when their own father did not want to be. Even my oldest child (18) has had his life improved by my partner being present and thinks highly of him, despite the teenage years being one of the most difficult times to consider blending a family. Had he not reacted well to him, then we wouldn't be here over 3 years later as again, my children are my priority.

I feel sick. I will always put my children first. But this feels so incredibly wrong. All my children are going to suffer either way now, to varying degrees.

I guess I don't really need advice. Just understanding and a little moral support. I'm just so bloody angry.

OP posts:
FingersCrossedForAllOfUs · 05/11/2020 22:47

This is really tough OP, I feel for you all.
My only suggestion would be, does your DP have days each week when he doesn’t have his DC’s? If so could you all spend time with him then?
I know it’s not ideal but at least you could continue to keep your relationship going but safeguard all the children from the unfounded accusations.

I read your other thread too, has the ex been assessed for MH issues? There are so many things she has said and done which are at the detriment to her children’s welfare. Is she safe to be looking after the children at all?

ThisMustBeMyDream · 05/11/2020 23:47

Yes, he does have days when he doesn't have his child. Often months because mum has withheld contact again (!). But the order is EOW plus a night each week for dinner (with the added proviso this should be overnight as child gets a little older and it is practicable) along with 50% of all school holidays. He wanted shared care. But this is what could be agreed, so he accepted it as in his childs best interest.

However, we both feel that long term two households is not what we want, nor would we feel it was best for all children involved if it wasn't for the mothers actions. It would be forced because of her. That would simply lead to resentment and upset for us and the children.

We both wish to buy a home together, to marry etc. We have spent 3 years building our lives towards the end goal of being a family in the traditional sense. We have taken the slow and steady route, done everything we can to make the children feel safe, happy and loved. It feels like we are all being punished completely unnecessarily. Injustice. That is what it feels like I guess.

Do I want my life and that of my children to be dictated by a 3rd party? That is essentially the choice I have to make. Can I suffer it? What is better? At the moment it just all feels awful.

The previous s7 and social care reports do discuss that mum has a MH history, but not in detail. My partner said she has a history of depression and anxiety over many years, and has had medication, but no deeper MH concerns have been explored at any point.

No major concerns have been made about the day to day care of her children. So is she safe to care? Well social care think so, or they have previously. Nothing has been said this time to alter that. So one can only conclude that yes, she is deemed safe to care for them.

OP posts:
LyingDogsLie1 · 06/11/2020 07:38

OP I’m so sorry you’re going through this. It sounds horrendous. Also sounds horrendous for your DSD. When I read Child has been medically examined. No concerns there either. I thought how traumatic that must have been for a young child, especially given it’s totally unnecessary.

If your man is worth it OP, I would suggest you take a step back but maintain your relationship. If you currently live in separate homes, can you continue that until this lastest saga is dealt with and your OH stay at your house with your kids but not vice versa?

Is it worth you contacting a solicitor re these frivolous and damaging claims? I don’t think The Mum can go unchecked here. It’s not ok to make these allegations.

LyingDogsLie1 · 06/11/2020 07:40

Do I want my life and that of my children to be dictated by a 3rd party? That is essentially the choice I have to make. Can I suffer it? What is better? At the moment it just all feels awful.

Don’t let her take this control, take it back OP.

Have you read the book “Say Goodbye to Crazy” it might help.

zatarontoast · 06/11/2020 09:22

However, we both feel that long term two households is not what we want, nor would we feel it was best for all children involved if it wasn't for the mothers actions. It would be forced because of her. That would simply lead to resentment and upset for us and the children

OP I think you have the blinkers on. You need to put aside for now what youwant and prioritise the safety and well being of your children. For now you should remain in separate households and forget about moving in together until these issues are resolved. It is absolutely horrible what she is doing, but ultimately your children being put through SS assessments and being accused of sexual abuse is simply not worth it.

ThisMustBeMyDream · 06/11/2020 09:32

That is my point @zatarontoast. Which is why I feel that ending the relationship may be the better option than trying to continue something that will cause resentment and upset.

OP posts:
wewillmeetagain · 06/11/2020 09:41

If she has put her child through an unnecessary intimate medical examination, then that child should be removed from her care as she is an unfit parent!

LyingDogsLie1 · 06/11/2020 09:43

I did wonder re Mum having custody here - she doesn’t sound very balanced. All of this must be traumatic for her child too.

Anxiousannie32 · 06/11/2020 09:44

From what you've said this man does enrich your life and your children's lives. It seems so wrong that your family should be torn apart because of the poisonous lies and unhinged behaviour of his ex. Why is she so hell bent on destroying your relationship? Surely separating will give her what she wants? I totally understand your desire to protect your kids, that should always be your priority. But I can't help but think you and your dp need each other's support. A united front would show her that she can't get what she wants by acting like this.

Is there nothing you can do to raise your concerns either with the police or SS? Getting a young child to lie about sexual abuse is fucking abhorrent.

I would suggest living apart for now and maybe reducing contact between all of the kids if necessary, but don't let this vile bitch win.

notapizzaeater · 06/11/2020 09:54

Can you not ask SS to stay involved ? You e evidence she's fabricating things showing a pattern of behaviours. I'd put off buying a house together but continue with the relationship- why should you you and your children loose him because of her,

sassbott · 06/11/2020 10:14

OP. I’m going to be blunt. End it.
I’m not going to go into my personal history with my exDP but it is very similar to yours.
Long time together, separate properties, children never left unsupervised (for precisely this reason and fear of this happening). My exDp’s EW has a history of making serious unfounded allegations and having their children medically examined.

Sadly. I tried to persevere for years. But it’s exhausting. I too wanted (maybe) one day to remarry, potentially live with someone etc etc. We too took it slowly. Earlier this year the sad reality kicked in that all of those were off the table and my priority ultimately had to be my own well-being and those of my children.

Unless there is very real concerns about the day to day appearance of a child, no one will do anything. Pre Covid, it was tough to get anyone in Cafcass to look at the actions of my exDP’s EW (she got away with absolute murder). Post covid, agencies are so stretched with a spike in horrendous cases, this will simply be closed and moved along. Mother will simply say child reported it and as such she has told the agencies. The child has repeated the allegation so no one will be looking at the mother.

The other side I am sorry to say is that all of these children are young. 4,5,7. Fast forward 5-7 years. An allegation against a 14 year old is a much more serious matter.

I’m sorry OP, but I would end this. As much as you may love this man and him you, you are exposing your children to very real risk. If anything sticks with any of your children (especially as they get older), this has very real world ramifications (including simple things like admission to university).

I’ve ended my 5 year relationship for very similar reasons. And whilst I am deeply sad, I am also very relieved to not have to live with this in my life. Because it will take a toll on your mental health too. Not to mention, what have your children been told about why they were interviewed?

My children would be furious if I continued to expose them (in any knowing way) to risks. Protect your kids. His ex, his kid, his problem.

sassbott · 06/11/2020 10:22

I would also add. I made the decision on the basis that I came to the conclusion that for this relationship (and his heinous ex), I was basically giving up the chance of a happy future. I was signing up to a life of this.

I am very content with it just being me and my kids. I’m not saying I want to live with someone FT. I’m not saying I want to remarry. But what I do want is freedom and choice in my life, choice to do what feels right for my partner, my children, any other children. My choices got removed one by one, by the high conflict EXW.

People in these situations have a choice.

  1. father let’s the high conflict parent win and walks away from the child (not an option is it?)
  2. both partners agree to lead separate lives when one child is visiting, and that’s their future (very personal choice and both partners needs to be on board)
  3. both partners push on regardless and don’t let the EXW crazy behaviour dictate what they do (fine if you’re single, but what risk does this expose resident children to?)

None of the books (and I’ve read them all) help.
Until you’ve lived with a completely crazy ex, manipulating a child/ children and causing complete havoc in your life, no one has a clue. Because no authorities do anything. They’re too stretched. So you either Teflon up and take this on or you walk away.

I loved my exDP, but not enough to waste the rest of my life in a partnership ruled by his exw’s conflict.

LyingDogsLie1 · 06/11/2020 10:27

Sassbott I’m sorry for your situation. I thought the exW in my situ was a nightmare but this is something else!

Jroseforever · 06/11/2020 10:30

I’m just baffled you haven’t left way way earlier

My children versus boyfriend?

Well, I can’t even dignify the question with a response!

VioletSunset · 06/11/2020 10:34

What a horrible, conniving woman. I would either do what a pp says and ask social services to stay involved, tell them she is so incredibly malicious she is trying everything in her power to split you up and have them monitor things. Or leave. What a shit situation. I hope your DPs ex gets her comeuppance

sassbott · 06/11/2020 10:47

@LyingDogsLie1 sadly there are women this high conflict. And unless there are very real signs of neglect/ abuse and children appear fine in all other areas? Sadly IME Cafcass do nothing. And put it down to conflict between parents/ anxiety in the mother.

I will never date a man with young children or an exwife whom is high conflict ever again. I’m quite content to stay single and just focus on my peaceful world.

LyingDogsLie1 · 06/11/2020 10:53

@Jroseforever

I’m just baffled you haven’t left way way earlier

My children versus boyfriend?

Well, I can’t even dignify the question with a response!

OP has made it quite clear she is in this predicament because of her consideration of the children.

Clearly it’s an evolving situation and she hasn’t just disregarded her children from the outset.

Jroseforever · 06/11/2020 11:04

Oh come on

This has been pretty serious and stressful for some time. Read the OP.

Each to their own, but I would not have subjected my children to this for this long. No ifs or buts.

Magda72 · 06/11/2020 11:05

@ThisMustBeMyDream - @sassbott has given you excellent advice.
And @sassbott I'm really, really sorry it has come to this for you.
I have two extended family members who did not walk away financially but who did walk away physically. Both genuinely thought they were doing the right thing by their kids (we're talking 20 plus years ago) as both exes were horrific & both men felt that their presence in their kids lives was actually doing the kids more damage than good. Both men have MH issues as a result as do some of their now adult children.
All that being said - I left my exdp for the same type of reasons as sassbott & while his kids are happier as they now have dad all to themselves, I know for a fact that exdp is suffering mentally. Bar walking away from his kids (which he would never do) that man has NO hope of another relationship or a bit of a life for himself as exw (and now his older teen kids) won't 'allow' it.
I feel so sorry for good dads in these situations as these women are pure poison & again sassbott is right - the authorities cannot & will not do anything unless there is very physical evidence of abuse. They cannot prove emotional neglect/abuse or parental alienation which is rife unless the kids corroborate and ime no decent parent wants to put their kids through that as the outcome is so uncertain. Dads in these situations cannot 'win'. They either sacrifice their own happiness for their kids & stay under the thumb of a heinous ex until the kids are adults, or, they walk away. They lose both ways as do the kids because no child (no matter how loving/consistent etc, their dad is, escapes the trauma of living with a poisonous mother.
Of course dads can be poisonous too - but it seems that bitter dads disappear (traumatic for children but not on a day to day basis) whereas bitter mothers often have majority custody & seem to make it their lives mission to destabilise the relationships between their kids & their dad & anyone he may have the audacity to bring into their lives.
Walk away. Your dp cannot win this one and by default you & your own dc will be dragged further down.

LyingDogsLie1 · 06/11/2020 11:13

This has been pretty serious and stressful for some time

OP has taken the burden of the stress. Now it’s becoming an issue for her kids she’s taking action.

Jroseforever · 06/11/2020 11:15

Ok - I get that.

I’m saying - the environment, that person in my life (and by association my children’s) that drama, fact taking up their mother’s energy and focus...

I would have left much earlier.

LyingDogsLie1 · 06/11/2020 11:36

That’s fair enough that you would have acted differently, I just didn’t think it was a particularly constructive or entirely fair comment to someone seeking support.

longcoffee · 06/11/2020 11:46

Hi OP. Haven't been in an exact same situation, but I do understand to a certain extent.

My DH's ex-W was arrested for child sex offences connected to his children. The children's, and our, whole world has been turned upside down.

We have supported the children through what can only be described as a hellish ordeal, interviews, examinations etc, and we have both been dragged in with interviews and will now have to testify. The children are understandably emotionally overwhelmed, and behaviour is horrific, all stemming from being unable to manage the emotions that they are having to handle. Not their fault at all, but an added complication to an already very stressful situation. Seeing one persons actions totally tear apart the three people I love most is devastating, and causes ongoing anger on a daily basis.

In the middle of this, DH and I lost our first baby very late on in a pregnancy and I had to be induced and give birth, but couldn't take the time to grieve, as we were straight home and back into disclosures, interviews etc. The day of our baby's funeral I came home and spent 5 hours on the phone to the fucking police.

Throughout my pregnancy, I was 'marked' by social services as our address was noted due to the children being with us - my baby would have been born being known to SS, Despite me having no involvement. I was signed off work with stress by my GP following a midwife referral, and referred for counselling as she was concerned my stress levels would negatively impact the pregnancy.

DH has said he wouldn't blame me if I left - I wouldn't, the children need me and he and I need each other (and have no issues within our relationship!) but I totally understand how it can feel like you are backed into a corner. I felt horrible bringing a child into that situation, but fell pregnant two weeks before the arrest. We're now faced with the decision as to whether we try again with a trial looming (could be a year, could be three, fucking COVID) or put our life on hold due to ex-w's actions.

Only you know what feels right. Some people are programmed to be dickheads and that will never change. I would be reluctant to let my children grow up with her looming in the background, BUT it depends on whether the pros of your DP outweigh the cons of her batshittery.

Jroseforever · 06/11/2020 12:11

@LyingDogsLie1

That’s fair enough that you would have acted differently, I just didn’t think it was a particularly constructive or entirely fair comment to someone seeking support.
No but not every thread has to be met with a chorus of support. As long as not name calling or abusive then in spirit of discussion to be able to express a non supportive view.
Viviennemary · 06/11/2020 12:16

Could you report her to the police for making malicious accusations. She can't get away with ruining people's lives.