Should step children be able to come and go as they please?

[timelord92]

Just that really!

I have a DSD who is 16 and has complained to her dad that she thinks she should be able to come and go as she pleases as this is supposed to be her home too. She feels like she shouldn't have to text to say can she come. We have regular contact set up every week where she will stay 2 night a week on the same days but sometimes she will text if shes coming earlier than planned or something like that.

I get what she is saying but surely everyone needs a routine so we know what is happening and how to plan things.

I should also point out that her mum also expects her to communicate what time she is due back and whether her stay is extended here.

Just wondered what other people's thoughts are. Are there any step parents here who don't have a fixed schedule and allow a bit more leway? How does it work for everyone?

It is a tough one but there are a few options. It sounds like you have a good enough relationship with mom and that there is the same level of expectation there from her so you are not fighting a lone battle.

If part of the issue is food then be honest with her, at 16 she knows she is a fussy eater - I have one and she definitely knows! A simple conversation of look DSD you know we love having you here but I feel awful if we don't have food in for you and don't know you coming, it makes me feel crap and don't you you to feel like we don't consider you - what can I get for the freezer so I always have something in for you? This then makes her feel that you care, you think of her and if she rocks on up and wants feeding she has picked what there is herself.

The not being prepared can be a two way thing as well, if you know of nights that you can't do pick up/drop offs a text at the start of the week to her - Hi DSD, not sure what your plans were this week but Dad/we are out x night or won't be able to pick you up x night so if you were planning on coming over avoid those nights.

I think if you or DH take the lead on how to communicate she will pick it up and won't feel like you are just trying to push her out.

Re maintenance, I would just see how it goes, she may start coming meal in week but less at weekends as she wants to go out with mates or she may be starting to feel more comfortable and seeing you all more often but hate being tied to a routine. If a more established pattern occurs then you can get DH to talk it through with mom as you will have more to base it on.

I have 1 DS and DSD who have there own places and DSS who lives with us BTW (DSD does treat ours like a hotel, with babysitting facilities as standard ) DS is more annoying as he is meant to come for dinner with his GF and messages on day to cancel and just at the stage where DS (16), is learning that I need to know if he is eating with us or not.

It's common courtesy to just have a heads up from anyone. My own DCs have to check if it's ok to come and get something from home if they are at their dads. There are obvious reasons why they can't just rock up and come in when DP and I are home alone!

@NorthernSpirit

God I would love for this to happen.

I have 2 SDC - now 12 & 15. The mother is an absolute control freak. They have the same contact order from 8 years ago. Mother won’t budge (they still have to be dropped off at 4pm on a Sunday so she can bath them (I shit you not)!

She won’t allow any time unless it’s written in the order. There’s absolutely no way the 15 YO would be ‘allowed’ to visit dad unless she said and it was written in the CO order.

Out of interest, at what age would DSC normally start deciding contact for themselves? My 15 YO DSD is very immature and highly controlled by her mum. I was hoping things would of started changing by now and she’d have more say in things.

Her Mom Actually baths her at 15??

Many people don't have the money to be paying more than they owe

This just makes the child/children sound like bills...saying money "they owe."

I owe Ex £10 more for DD this week, as she stayed less or I need to pay £10 less. You might s week be talking about the electricity bill.

Unless people are swinging in poverty, is buying the foods that SC eat such a hardship without deducting it from CM? Or is it the extra units of electricity they consume.

I find it far too petty to be splitting hairs over this.

@SandyY2K would you be saying that a resident parent is petty if contact with the non resident parent reduced and they expected more maintenance?

Dp and his ex are in the lucky position that it doesn't matter about variation in contact and we just assume it balances out. However, if money is an issue then I can see how it could make life quite tough if things like this aren't taken into account.

Have you never been skint before?

I don’t get on well with DSS but even I would let him come and go as he pleases.
If he was coming on his own terms it meant he wanted to, needs some respite from his mums or missed his dad.
Totally worth the hassle of a last minute dash to the shop for some extra dinner supplies.

@KylieKoKo

would you be saying that a resident parent is petty if contact with the non resident parent reduced and they expected more maintenance?

I would say the same thing either way when minimal changes are involved.

If the child went from having 6 nights with the RP, then it became 5/6 nights with the NRP...then that's significant and the CM should be adjusted....but not for a couple of extra nights here and there.

Before talking about reducing or increasing payments....I would expect that it's justified based on how the new arrangement has developed....i.e. even though the SC said ad hoc...in reality over the last couple of months, they have actually been staying a solid 4/5 nights a week.

The RP is more likely to not be so resistant to the suggestion if the NRP bases it on facts. I understand that if they are low on cash they may still be resistant to the idea of a reduction in CM and tell the child they can't spend the additional X number of nights with the NRP because they need the money.....if this happens it's most likely to affect the child's relationship with the NRP.

There are more important things than money when it comes to children with parents who have split up.

At every junction...the best interests of the child should be a priority for the parents.... note that I say parents, not steparents, as I don't think a SP is obligated to do so....it should be the parents of the child doing what's best and not quibbling over providing meals for children they brought into the world.

@SandyY2K I understand what you're saying about not quibbling over small changes, but people are very quick to say things like "you're making the children sound like bills to pay, you should just be happy to see them" when it's the NRP, which very rarely gets said to a RP. It's not always small amounts, I've seen the same thing several times on threads where the OP is a "NRP" (or partner of) who pays huge sums of money when they have the kids 50/50, or have effectively become the RP and are having the kids the majority of the time. There are always a good deal of comments telling them they may not owe anything but why rock the boat, they should just be happy the money is going to the kids, surely? Don't they love the kids?

It's a highly emotive way of responding to a situation that is not emotive. It's nothing to do with loving the kids or being glad to see them, for the adults to sort out their finances in a way that is fair. Not to mention the double standard. As much as a RP might be told it isn't worth changing things, it's very rare for them to be told they don't really care about their kids and are just being mercenary if they mention maintenance.

On top of that, it is quite privileged to think there is absolutely no way seeing the kids more could put a financial strain on a parent. Many people are that skint, yes, and have to budget very strictly or go without to cover the maintenance they already pay. It is something they have to consider to be able to accommodate seeing them more, and it's very emotionally manipulative to accuse them of not really caring for the kids and just viewing them as a financial obligation when they do.

In theory she can come and go as she pleases but the practicalities if that are unlikely to work for most families.

How do you know how much food to buy on your weekly shop? How much food do you get out of the freezer before going to work for the evenings meal. Do you plan to ever go out in the evenings in case SD wants a lift somewhere? Do you not go out in case SD turns up and she needs some support with her homework etc etc.

16 year olds like to think they're grown up but they rarely understand or want the practicalities that being grown up brings.

[quote SandyY2K]**@KylieKoKo

would you be saying that a resident parent is petty if contact with the non resident parent reduced and they expected more maintenance?

I would say the same thing either way when minimal changes are involved.

If the child went from having 6 nights with the RP, then it became 5/6 nights with the NRP...then that's significant and the CM should be adjusted....but not for a couple of extra nights here and there.

Before talking about reducing or increasing payments....I would expect that it's justified based on how the new arrangement has developed....i.e. even though the SC said ad hoc...in reality over the last couple of months, they have actually been staying a solid 4/5 nights a week.

The RP is more likely to not be so resistant to the suggestion if the NRP bases it on facts. I understand that if they are low on cash they may still be resistant to the idea of a reduction in CM and tell the child they can't spend the additional X number of nights with the NRP because they need the money.....if this happens it's most likely to affect the child's relationship with the NRP.

There are more important things than money when it comes to children with parents who have split up.

At every junction...the best interests of the child should be a priority for the parents.... note that I say parents, not steparents, as I don't think a SP is obligated to do so....it should be the parents of the child doing what's best and not quibbling over providing meals for children they brought into the world.[/quote]
@sandyY2K it's very easy to say there are more important things than money when you've never really struggled for it. Some people have a very low budget for food. If you only have £30 a week for it an extra tenner is a lot.

The best interests of the child are that both parents can afford adequate housing and food for them. If a change in contact hours jeapodises that then maintenance needs to be adjusted accordingly.

@KylieKoKo

The best interests of the child are that both parents can afford adequate housing and food for them.

Absolutely...and if providing just one extra meal per week would genuinely cause such significant financial hardship and the food budget is that tight....then the NRP should honestly and openly tell their Ex/RP that it's a problem.

I have been in this exact position OP and I am 100% with you, there are too many problems with coming and going when a teenager pleases.

I got all the ‘it’s her home too’ thrown at me as if I was some kind of witch!

It’s her home, SOME of the time. And SOME of the time it’s very healthy for a SM and her DP to have some time to themselves where they know a 16 year old isn’t going to just come along.

At no other situation would a teenager have two homes that are exclusively theirs whenever they want. To turn up for dinner whenever they like and expect to have food. To turn up when SM is working from home and put a loud game on. Or turn up when DP and SM are having a cosy night in getting intimate on the couch - bang the door opens!

It really isn’t that hard to have SOME idea of when someone is going to be in your home. If they were living there then you would know to have food in all the time, and would also know roughly when they were out and due to be back. It wouldn’t be ‘oh they haven’t been back for 2 days, they must be at their mother’s’

Just as an illustration, this is what happened when my DSD did insist she could just come and go as she pleased:

• she’d consistently come when DP was at work all day and just me and my young DS was at home - I had no idea if she was sick or supposed to be off school - as she would get extremely stroppy if I asked or texted DP.
• there was no time, ever, when I just felt like I could relax for the day without the kids. One day we got DP’s mum to babysit just so that we could spend the day together - for the first time in 2 years - and relax in the house. Guess what, DSD came in and insisted on taking over the living room playing GuitarHero and I had to just go to my bedroom to get a bit of peace. Yes of course DP should have said No - but if you say it’s okay for a teenager to come anytime and just relax then it then creates arguments if actually we wanted the living room to ourselves just that once.
• Everything just gets assumed and no one knows where the teenager is - it’s a vulnerable and tricky time of life when it is really better for the growing teen to have a parent have some idea of how long they’ve been out for etc. DSD on at least two occasions left one parents - at one point overnight and neither parent had any idea and assumed she was with the other - but instead was doing something pretty worrying for her age - it was a really easy way of going AWOL and neither parent knowing what was going on.
• DSD did start to use her ability to come and go to be quite stroppy with me to be honest, it really didn’t help our relationship at all. She’d come in Ioudly for example at the baby’s nap time and wake the baby up. If she’d even texted before I could have said wait an hour. If she lived with us full-time, which she did for a while, then this was more of a daily known thing and she got to know when it was a good idea to be quiet in the house. So all these little stresses get maximised.
• She started having an eating disorder and so it was really important both parents had the right food in and both knew how much she was eating. Totally impossible once she started to insist she could come and go as she pleased.
• It caused more friction between me and DP as it honestly felt like the worst position as SM. I said I would much rather she just live here full-time but that as much of this would be just me as DP worked long hours, we’d have to come to some arrangements to live together harmoniously between us both. DSD wouldn’t hear of it and DP would rather ignore it by pretending any problems existed.
• I could go on... anyway unless you have a really good relationship with your step child, and they are not in any way vulnerable or going under their parents radar, it’s not a great idea.

I would expect a teenager to be able to come and go whenever they want.

As in not need to ask permission, but should always text or ring to say they were coming just Incase there might not be enough to go around for dinner or just Incase there were plans already made that meant you wouldn't actually be at home.

I would be happy for them to come whenever they wanted but would want notice to make sure I could sort out food if it was around a meal time that sort of thing.

I would hate for them to turn up just as we were sitting down for dinner and not have enough for an extra person.

But generally I do think step children have a crap deal and they should be able to treat both homes as home if that is the kind of relationships they have.

At no other situation would a teenager have two homes that are exclusively theirs whenever they want. To turn up for dinner whenever they like and expect to have food. To turn up when SM is working from home and put a loud game on. Or turn up when DP and SM are having a cosy night in getting intimate on the couch - bang the door opens!

Totally agree. This is yet another example of people thinking that a child with separated parents should have more perks, freedoms and liberties than anyone else.

@Coffeepot72 I agree, although to me it’s not the perks so much, it’s the lack of any boundaries, confusing and bad dynamics. A child, a teenager, who can go between two homes whenever they like is not being parented for a start. It’s impossible to parent, and yes I do still think older teenagers need some kind of parenting. It also isn’t healthy for them, an argument? Go to Dads, to punish Mum. Only go back if she backs down. A sibling wants you to get out? They tell you to go to Mum’s away from Dad’s house. Feeling depressed? Go to the house where you can go under the radar. Want to play loud computer games but Mum says No? Go to house with only SM in as she will get into too much trouble for telling you to put headphones on...

All of the above happened to me!