Advice needed - Step Parenting - feels like make or break. :(

[Mummafee]

I have been with husband 10 years and married 8. I have 2 children from previous (now 16f and 14m) and he has 1 (15f). We now have one together (6m) and I’m due a baby in 6 weeks...
My SD has always been really difficult towards me but I always tried harder and treated her with more love because I understood why she behaved the way she did. However over the years it got worse and she started to tell lies about me and also my children but still we continued to welcome her as again whilst it hurt I understood. However 3 years ago after an upset over something silly she went home to her mum and said I emotionally abused her. Complete nonsense and my husband was in the room at the time so backed me up that I never said what she said. However her mum loves the drama, hates me and said she was never coming to our house again..
So for the last 3 years my husband has met up with his daughter and taken her shopping, out for meals, cinema trips e.t.c on his own. She has had no contact with my kids or her half brother. During this time she has treated my husband horrendously and he has been in bits over it.

Anyway I said to my husband right at the start that now enough was enough and to put this right she needed to tell the truth about what happened. It’s not fair that her mother and his parents (who don’t speak to us anymore mainly because of all this) have believed these lies. However as she hasn’t wanted to come back this hasn’t been addressed.

Now though she wants to come back to our house (she’s not getting on with mum, she says dubious things to my husband about how she is treated by her step dad and mum (I imagine are lies) and she’s acting out and depressed.

However right I’m suffering from prenatal depression (not wanting to admit this here but it’s important to note), I’m 6 weeks of having a baby, I can hardly walk due to pregnancy, my youngest son doesn’t know who she is anymore, my two oldest don’t want her here (as she’s been so unkind in the past and has caused so much upset)...

But she wants to come back and her mum now says she can’t cope with her anymore so she has to come to us... like right now!

It’s been 3 years and the timing is crap. I’m really upset as I desperately do want things to be ok and to be a happy merged family but she’s caused nothing but upset and drama and I don’t want me or my kids around it right now. It seems whenever something important is happening she kicks off somehow...
but my husband is heart broken... how can I resolve this so that I consider the impact on everyone... I find it mind boggling that her and her mum think after all this she can just waltz back in to our home with the red carpet treatment and with excited faces waiting for her?? But then that’s her life.. she’s been a bit of a spoilt princess and doesn’t know consequences.
she also still hasn’t admitted she lied about what happened to her mum or her grandparents and she won’t now (and apparently I’m pathetic for even asking) so I feel the last 3 years of what we’ve been through and teaching her about boundaries and consequences is pointless.
All my children are well balanced lovely kids and I’m concerned the impact of having her around will cause them.
I’m also just holding myself together and I’m feeling very anxious about it all. I just want to focus on having and adjusting to having my baby and my kids adapting to this big change...
but instead she has once again made it about her. It’s hard not to feel angry. My husband I can tell is resentful towards me right now for not just bowing down like I have always in the past... or somehow magically making it all better (again like I normally do) but right now I just don’t feel I can.
It makes me wonder if it’s best to end my marriage to be honest... I thought this would get easier as she got older... part of me just thinks if I leave my husband I don’t have to put up with this ridiculous situation and the anxiety around it and nor do my children, My SD gets what she wants (her dad to herself) and my husband can have his daughter back in his life full time of he likes. But I love him and I know he loves me and doesn’t want to break up our family. I just can’t cope with it anymore. It’s been 10 years and I’m broken.
If your still with me here thank you. I really need support and advice. X

Oh and if he doesnt recognise she has serious issues that need help hes a fucking idiot & you have no hope.

Im amazed he seems to think its ok for her to not follow rules/help out either. Does he not realise how damaging that is? Hes setting her up for a lifetime of failure! No one will date, or be friends with or employ a person like this. Although I guess shes probably rather charming when she wants to be.

You also have the right to mimimally get involved, because she doesnt want you - she wants him.

Maybe a solution is s to tell him that you no longer want and will not accept his doing any more for your separate children than you are willing to do for his. If his daughter has to live in your mutually owned home, both the daughter and your 2 children that are not his will only be allowed to be there for the exact same amount of time. He will no longer be permitted to provide any financial support for your 2 older children and you in turn will not provide any financial assistance for his daughter.

All children will be expected to be civil and polite to everyone in the house. You will each take personal responsibility for disciplining your individual children.

If the 2 teen age daughters cannot share a room, the house should be reconfigured so that each girl has the same amount of personal and private space.

The new plan would not require or permit either of you to accept more than you are willing to provide to the other's child/children. This might not be the way that either of you expected to live, but it would relieve either of you from feeling burdened or put upon. Sometimes , a reasonable solution is to be unwilling to accept that which you are unwilling or incapable of doing for the other.

This plan would serve to make your household an equitably managed house if less than a family home. It does not appear that you have ever blended as a family and perhaps that is not in the cards for you all as a group.
Maybe the goal has to become peaceful and civil co-existence.

Even though you experience
your children as being wonderful to him , that does not mean that he always experiences them that way, and you certainly have not experienced his daughter that way. Separating financial responsibility, participation in school activities, any expectations of parenting involvement, equalizing the amount of time that your separate children spend in the house, creating an equal amount of bedroom space for your separate children, and insisting upon the same amount of civility from everyone in the house may go a long way in resolving your immediate problems.

The only children that will be mutually patented and have involvement that involved the 2 of you together should then be the 2 mutually patented children.

This should be the plan until such time as you all can get some family counseling.

"Maybe a solution is to tell him that you no longer want and will not accept his doing any more for your separate children than you are willing to do for his. If his daughter has to live in your mutually owned home, both the daughter and your 2 children that are not his will only be allowed to be there for the exact same amount of time. He will no longer be permitted to provide any financial support for your 2 older children and you in turn will not provide any financial assistance for his daughter."

@Tiredoftattler I'm guessing you think you've had a "gotcha!" moment by cleverly ramming home the point that this man's daughter ought to be treated the same as the other children in the house. You're conveniently ignoring that DSD already has a permanent residence; it's the DSD's toxic behaviour that's causing substantial issues for the family not the other DC's behaviour; and that OP can clearly cope with looking after her older DC's without her DH's input but the same does not apply the other way round when it comes to him looking after DSD, because he won't be around for much of the time due to his job. You're also ignoring the fundamental fact that OP is enabling him to work the hours he does because she is looking after their joint child (plus imminent new baby) so unless he finds a more flexible job he'd be needing to contribute more financially regardless in order to pull his weight.

The entire issue within OP's household is caused by the fact that OP's DH is incapable of treating his children equally by giving DSD boundaries and consequences. Equality will not be created by letting DSD move in without giving her those boundaries. He either treats everyone the same by strictly enforcing the same rules and treatment for all, or he treats them differently which includes the option of not having his daughter to stay. "Let's banish the resident DCs from the house to make things fair" nonsense that you're clumsily using to make your point is all part of the selective approach to equality that is creating conflict in the first place.

There isn't a way for DSD to move in with a caveat of no-one is left alone with her (and to be quite frank this is how it needs to be because you have no idea how vindictive she may become) Unless it is stipulated DH drops her at the grandparents when he leaves for work and collects her when he has finished so she leaves and returns for school from there?)

Weekends, how will that work?

Noone should be giving up their rooms to appease DSD, however if you have a toy room/dining room that could be turned into a bedroom but OP has already said she would have to share with her DD who she accused of stealing so I will assume there isn't any available space. No way I would be letting my old child feel vulnerable in her own personal space.

There's that age old saying OP, you've made your bed, now you have to lie in it. This goes for both DH and DSD.

No way I would be letting my old child feel vulnerable in her own personal space. my own child..... 🙄

To : My Cat Hated Everybody

There is no gotcha moment involved. Both sets of children have 2 sets of parents. Nothing is being asked of one set that is not asked if the other. OP would no longer be in the position where more is asked of her than is equally imposed upon her husband.

Nothing suggest that her wonderful children would have less time in the home than her dangerous and despicable daughter. They would all spend the same amount of time in the home.
The new baby is the 5th child coming into the home. These are not some young and inexperienced parents . Both the OP and her husband are seasoned parents fully aware of and experienced in integrating an additional child into the home.

I guess what troubles me most is the assumption that he step daughter is horrid and that the mother is probably lying about her illness. All of that may be true ,but it is equally likely that having received only one perspective and account of the situation that there are additional factors involved in the situation. For instance ,no one has asked why the extended family members were so willing to believe the child if in the years of first hand observations they had witnessed the OP as the loving and accepting step parent that she describes? Isn't it likely that some of them would have said " in all of these many years, we have never observed the OP behave in that manner; that is just not at all like her? "
.
These people may never become a blended family, but maybe living in an equitable situation may permit them to co-exist.

I am a firm believer in not accepting from anyone more than you are willing to provide to them .

Equity would not impose a burden on anyone.
Understand, I am not blaming anyone. This is not a situation that requires blame. This is a very complex situation that requires a solution. A solution that creates equal responsibility for both may be the only way that they can resolve this.

It may also be time for them to live apart for a while. That would give each of them time to develop an appreciation for what the other brings to the table or time to become responsible and independent in their own right.

The OP sounds like a capable woman ; she can probably manage her home with 4 children. The husband sounds like a dad who loves both of his children. He too can probably manage and provide a home with his daughter full time and his 2 younger children on a part time basis. If they are unable to learn to co-exist , the management of separate households will be the only recourse.

OK the OP clearly states that boundaries and consequences exist in their house, just not with DSD so the smarmy wonderful children remark is unjustified and uncalled for.

Have you never across anyone vindictive? They do exist but because everyone lives a label it's glossed over as MH. Her DSD sounds like my step sister..... And 30yrs later she is exactly the same behaviour wise.... With no MH issues.

Well if the OP is abusive as you speculate here, then a good father wouldn't let her move in at all.

'For instance ,no one has asked why the extended family members were so willing to believe the child if in the years of first hand observations they had witnessed the OP as the loving and accepting step parent that she describes? Isn't it likely that some of them would have said " in all of these many years, we have never observed the OP behave in that manner; that is just not at all like her? "

No its not, you do realise that inlaws can be dickheads dont you?
They have nothing to do with ops 6year old so I wouldnt have any problem determining their feelings on the matter are of little importance.
Besides as OP said her husband was there and saw nothing of the sort happened.
Your 'solutions' arent solutions at all. Absolutely ridiculous ideas you have posted which are not compatible with real life because as op has said time and time again her dh treats his child differently to the rest of the children, there are no consequences for her behaviour.
With your 'solution' all that would happen is her own kids would see that the child would be able to cause mayhem and get away with it, and OP would have no option but to put up with it as dh would be the only one to 'discipline' his daughter which he wouldnt do because he doesnt!
You cant have different rules for children in a blended family its doesnt work.

The only short term solution for now is for him to move out with her.
I also dont think you are here to actually help op but do sly digs.@Tiredoftattler.

Both sets of children have 2 sets of parents. Nothing is being asked of one set that is not asked if the other. OP would no longer be in the position where more is asked of her than is equally imposed upon her husband.
I called it a gotcha moment because I don't believe that you sincerely consider it to be a feasible solution in any way, shape or form. The general consensus on this thread is that the DH should move out with DSD for a while. From OP's point of view it's a far from ideal solution but the one which is most in DSD's interests. Your proposed solution above of DSD living in a household full of people ignoring her is not.

Even if your suggestion was workable in reality, there is absolutely nothing about this scenario where what is being asked of the DH is anywhere near what is being asked of OP and her children. Equity would not impose a burden on anyone if DSD was simply going to be a passive presence within the household where everyone but her dad could ignore her (and how could that possibly be healthy for DSD herself let alone anyone else?). Until the DH is fully on board with DSD being subject to the same house rules as everyone else her presence in the house will be detrimental to all involved all the time she's allowed to continue with the lies and the disrespect.

For instance ,no one has asked why the extended family members were so willing to believe the child if in the years of first hand observations they had witnessed the OP as the loving and accepting step parent that she describes? Isn't it likely that some of them would have said " in all of these many years, we have never observed the OP behave in that manner; that is just not at all like her? "
Many of us will have first hand experience of what it is like to be subjected to lies, abuse and prejudice simply for being dad's new partner so yeah, in context of how OP comes across in the rest of this thread I'm willing to believe she's tried her best throughout. When push comes to shove most families side with their blood relatives, you see it happen a lot when there's been an affair but the family will stick by their cheating son/daughter rather than the wronged SIL/DIL. If you don't believe that OP hasn't been lied about (e.g. the screaming and finger pointing in face incident that OP denies happened) then that's up to you. But your attitude is sailing close to wind of victim blaming IMO.

I get the sense from this and your posts on other threads that your view of step parenting is a default assumption that a) The dad NRP is either a deadbeat or a disney parent b) The step mum parent hates the RP and tolerates her DSC at best and c) The DSC and RP need advocating for which is why you always show up on these threads with your what ifs. If a woman posted in Relationships about issues with her DH being financially abusive she might be questioned as to whether she's had debt issues in the past but if she says no, she is taken at face value. She isn't told over and over that there's two sides to every story and she must be doing something to warrant how she's being treated. I'm affording OP the same consideration.

To: chicken head
I was not suggesting that the OP was necessarily abusive. I was stating that this is a very complex situation and we have only one perspective being presented.
I am at least willing to think that there are more and varying perspectives to this complex life situation.
My life experiences have taught me that most tales have more than one side and that many can have different but equally valid interpretations.

We would all agree that the OP is in a difficult and troubling situation.

She is receiving a lot of support as well she should. However, an Amen corner and name calling and blaming the other parties do not indicate objectivity , nor does it lead her any closer to a solution.

I feel very sorry for this entire family. It would seem that everyone of them is hurting and none of them are willing to admit that they are not the victim in this situation. It is a tale of 6 and soon to be 7 victims.
There are no martyrs in this story just very rigid and inflexible participants all of whom seem to be quite comfortable saying " it's my way or the highway. "

Do these people want to be right or do they want to get to the right place? Nurturing anger will certainly make it grow and give it a life of its own. All of these people seem to have well tended gardens filled with anger and old injuries.

@Tiredoftattler

I can see that from this thread, but I don't feel that the OP herself has particularly closed down options here. Whereas it would appear that her DH somewhat has.

There is a middle ground to be had, for a temporary period of time. This would appear to be the DH and OP, with necessary support, gradually reintroducing DSD back in to the home and the rules that apply to life in that home.

No single persons needs are of more importance than any other in this situation, especially to the extent that resentment is allowed to fester and create real long term damage.

The DSD has unfortunately been misled by her parenting. She feels like she is pretty unwanted I should imagine. But to be welcomed back in to the fold she needs to accept and acknowledge that other people do matter. She is not an only child.

Well that was an interesting read..

@Tiredoftattler firstly thank you for your input and your perspective. It is useful to hear an alternative idea... however your ‘solution’ is not going to work for my household. I want a family, a home, a safe space...
For me your resolve will bring more resentment, upset and separation between us.. not the united working together family that I actually so desperately want.

Also I haven’t been rigid or wishes to hold on to anger or be unforgiving... over the last 10 years I have kept my mouth shut, bent over and done all I can to try to keep peace... often at the expense (and I’m ashamed to say this) of my own DCs and also my own feelings or values.

But right now... at this point in my life.. with all the extra things to consider.. I feel I somehow have to make a stand... for me, for my children... I don’t know if that makes me a victim still?

Of course there will be other perspectives.. the ex, my DH, my SD, the GP... But I can only give you mine here. And if you wish to speculate on the facts I have given that of course is fine. I know the truth and I have never abused her.

To : chickenyhead
I agree with you. I think that this is such a sad situation. I think this family grouping will have difficulty surviving intact if there is not more flexibility and willingness to be open to both introspection and change for the entire group.

Nurturing old injuries and failing to step up as a parent seem to be a sure fire route to failure, and both adults in this situation seem to have found those to be the hills upon which they are willing to die.

Unfortunately, they may very well kill their marriage in the process.

Are either of them equipped to manage their homes, children, and life situations without the other? If not, the lack of flexibility on the part of both seems to be moving them in that direction.
They will be 2 people both of whom needed to be right rather than 2 people who ended up in the right place.

Who among us wants to be that man or woman who ends up 10 or 15_years from now still nursing anger and telling takes of the mistreatment that we suffered from our current or former spouse? Long nurtured anger must be a very unpleasant companion to take with you on your life's journey.

I think that getting it right now matters more than being right,but that is just my personal opinion

@Tiredoftattler
I’ve been reading your comments with interest and I see where you’re coming from but you seem to be repeatedly referring to the OPs being accused of abuse as if it’s just a minor inconvenience she should just get over.
It is not minor. It is not just an old grievance that OP has been deliberately keeping alive. Something as serious as this need to be acknowledged and apologised for at the very least before bridges can be built.
If not, it shows that the girl either doesn’t see that what she did was wrong (= dangerous, could do it again or worse) OR she enjoyed herself too much (= dangerous, could do it again or worse) OR she genuinely has convinced herself that it was true (=dangerous, could do it again or worse).
She should not be around OP and the rest of the children until the past is acknowledged, apologised for and remorse shown. Anything else is just inviting all sorts of trouble.
Stop making OP out to be in a huff she just needs to get over for everyone else’s convenience.

@Mummafee

Well that was an interesting read..

@Tiredoftattler firstly thank you for your input and your perspective. It is useful to hear an alternative idea... however your ‘solution’ is not going to work for my household. I want a family, a home, a safe space...
For me your resolve will bring more resentment, upset and separation between us.. not the united working together family that I actually so desperately want.

Also I haven’t been rigid or wishes to hold on to anger or be unforgiving... over the last 10 years I have kept my mouth shut, bent over and done all I can to try to keep peace... often at the expense (and I’m ashamed to say this) of my own DCs and also my own feelings or values.

But right now... at this point in my life.. with all the extra things to consider.. I feel I somehow have to make a stand... for me, for my children... I don’t know if that makes me a victim still?

Of course there will be other perspectives.. the ex, my DH, my SD, the GP... But I can only give you mine here. And if you wish to speculate on the facts I have given that of course is fine. I know the truth and I have never abused her.

You've been totally reasonable here. You are trying to keep your family safe and happy.

Op, any update on the surgery or is DH still out with SD?

I hope he doesn't bring her to your house tonight with her bags and try to force this on you.

Tattler you are giving equal weight to all the adult parties' opinions and behaviours, but although there may not be a clearly defined "right" in this situation there is most definitely a "wrong" and that wrong is DH's proposal to move his DD in when he has stated he is not going to enforce any rules or boundaries for her. OP would be failing in her duty as a parent to her DC if she failed to protect them from that.

@Vodkacranberryplease

I wouldnt put her in a room with a 6 year old that doesnt know her!! That could be a disaster.

In terms of who you can see I think that the point is that you BOTH go & see a child psychologist. TOGETHER. You spell out the issues, stick to the facts re events, & ask what the best thing to do is. She might be able to point you in the right direct CAHMS wise. Or just try CAHHMS straight away.

You need to keep pushing but once in the system they are great by all accounts.
www.nhs.uk/using-the-nhs/nhs-services/mental-health-services/cypmhs-information-for-children-and-young-people/

You should really take things like school reports too. It sounds like he doesnt know a damn thing about his own daughter. Whats she like at school etc? Whats she like when its just them? You mentioned he made accusations against him as well - what were they? And what triggered them?

You need this to be a condition. Its very simple.

• She needs her own room
• She has to follow the same rules & do housework like the others
• You will need extra support having given birth & wont be able to do much for her. So you may need a housekeeper/nanny part time
• Shes never alone with anyone but him
• You both need to work together to get her professional help. NOW.

No ifs, not buts. No cancer or feeling sorry for her or making exceptions.

If he doesnt agree he is TOTALLY unreasonable. And is putting his own children at risk as well as making the house into a toxic mess. She fits in or she doesnt come.

Just like real life.

This is an excellent point. This child is not learning that the world doesn't revolve around her wants and desires. She is fundamentally incapable of surviving in the real world as she is. I would also wager that she has a good bit of discord in her friendships. Behavior so ingrained in a person always spills over into other area of life.

It's another way this child's parents have failed her, and it's a huge one. If she doesn't learn now, she's going to have real issues in life.

I think you need to encourage your DC to be open and honest with the feelings and concerns about DSD potentially moving back in.

Your DH seems absolutely oblivious to the hurt and upset that has been caused to them. The only way forward is openness and honesty - not that your H will be able to stomach it but he seems to genuinely think you are the only person with an issue about it.

To : Glespeace
Please let me say that I am not doubting that the OP did not act in the manner that she says she did; nor am I doubting that the child may not have felt that she was emotionally abused in her relationship with the OP. It is quite possible that both of those things can be true.

As a parent, an aunt, cousin and school volunteer, I have often observed children telling lies and having revisionist view of situation s. I have seen young children say " he or she hit me" when I have witnessed the event and knew that not to be the case.

I do not think that my go to response was that any of these children posed a danger to themselves or anyone else. If a legal or mental health system would not have deemed those situations as ones that would have warranted removal from the home, I am not inclined to think of them as situations that warrant denying your child access to your home.

In any case, I do not think that my opinion is any more valid than the multiple opinions that have been offered. I hope that this family finds a solution. It will be unfortunate for all involved if they have to experience yet another divorce. There will be no winners in this situation.

God bless all of them.

@Tiredoftattler
A child who habitually lies and manipulates her family as this girl does is dangerous, not least because of the mental toll she could take on everyone before we even consider the consequences of her lies were to escalate.
This is hardly OPs “go to” response. The girl has a home with her mother, and OPs children and OP herself deserve to be safe in their own home.
The issues are not minor and should not be just swept under the carpet as if they never happened. It’s too serious for that approach.

He’s back but we haven’t spoken really.

Whilst he was out he text saying he was passing where my older DS was and said he could pick him up but he would have SD in the car...
I text back and said not to worry I already had it sorted...
He then text back saying ‘but I’m passing... fair enough if DS doesn’t want to but shall I not ask him?’
I replied saying I didn’t think it was appropriate right now as he’s never done this before and it’s not fair on DS to put him in that position.
I had no reply to that.
When I did speak to DH on the phone he was clearly angry.
And since we’ve both been home he’s fine laughing with the kids but hardly said a word to me...
I can’t believe I am being unreasonable here or really understand why he is angry at me?

It highlights to me that he really doesn’t seem to understand how serious it is what has happened...
I also don’t understand why SD on the day her mum is in hospital would be happy to see my DS?

Maybe she wants to be distracted @Mummafee. There's no right or wrong way to deal with this sort of situation.

TBH I think your H is trying to railroad over your boundaries, he is intent to force DSD onto you and the other DC desperate to be one big happy family.

He hasn't heard from the older ones how they feel or what they want. He wants it swept under the rug and everything to be hunky dory.