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Step-parenting

Connect with other Mumsnetters here for step-parenting advice and support.

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101 replies

pastel01 · 01/04/2019 21:41

I’ve just come out of a relationship and have been reading people’s stories on this forum.
I know kids don’t ask for their parents to break up and meet someone new. I appreciate that’s tough. However, I do feel that people get a hard time on here when they say they dislike their stepchildren. We’re only human! It isn’t easy when you’re doing your best in return to be totally unappreciated and looked down on.
My ex partner of 4 years had 4 children, 2 older children from one relationship, 2 children from another (boy 13, girl 12). He has them eow and one evening a week. We never lived together. At first everything was great. Got on with them well, never tried to be their mum, never in their face. We introduced my two children (dd14 and ds13) and all was good. Dp’s daughter loved me, was always filming me videos telling me how much she loved me, wanted to call me mum and was constantly saying how she wanted me & her dad to get married.
About a year in the boy started to be rude to me and dp did not correct him.
We had many rows about this and it wasn’t perfect but things improved. Nearly two years ago we went on a holiday. Dp’s son was a nightmare - when dp did correct him he would scream he hated his dad and he was a rubbish dad and he never wanted to see him again. It got to the point where all three other kids had had enough of him too. After him consistently carrying on without any correction from dp I lost it and told him off. He argued back. We did manage to sort it out but it did cause problems for me and dp.
A few weeks after that dp’s daughter was very off with me and went to her bedroom & stayed there all day. She kept asking to go to her nan’s (her mum was away for the weekend). In the evening dp told me that she didn’t like me. I went to have a chat with her and ask her what I’d done. She was so cold and unfeeling and said she just didn’t like me but wouldn’t give me a reason. I was so upset I went home with my two kids. Dp’s older daughter was crying about it and hugged me goodbye.
I gave dp’s daughter space, didn’t visit when she was there then she stopped seeing her dad altogether. Said he’d told her off for the way she’d been to me. She also admitted to reading a message to me on his mobile where he said a child shouldn’t split us up. She told him he’d chosen me over her and that if he didn’t split up with me she wouldn’t see him again. She told him she wouldn’t cry at his funeral. She cut all his side of the family off.
That was 18 months ago. Since then dp has seen her a handful of times. He messages her positively and for the most part has been totally ignored. She did send him a message to say she couldn’t bare to see me again and was surprised he was still with me (towards the end of last year). Dp’s ex said it had nothing to do with her and was keeping out of it but did agree to take her to counselling at the beginning but it didn’t assist in her wanting to see dp.
Dp and I had a great relationship. We only ever rowed about this issue & Ive walked out many a time out of feeling a sense of responsibility but always went back because I missed and loved him.
Last week dp received a text from his daughter to say she wanted to see him at the weekend. Naturally he was delighted but it hit me that I could never like or trust this child again. Yes, I know I’m the grown up and there must be underlying issues but it made me realise that she may still not want me in her life and Im not prepared to hang around waiting to see dp when she’s not around.
So I ended it. Dp has never wanted to break up with me over this but he’s stuck in the middle of a situation and Ive realised that his 12 year old daughter needs her dad far more than I need a boyfriend. Life sucks sometimes!

OP posts:
swingofthings · 04/04/2019 10:21

Maybe it is false but its better than being rude
Personay of I know someone really doesn't like me, I rather they ignore me than say hello with a smile whrn deep inside they are thinking 'hope you drop dead' but that's irrelevant.

The question is if they said hello with a smile, thank you after you cook and did a couple of chores, would that make them pleasant stepchildren?

Rose, the toilet thing, my son used to do. Yep, not nice but not the end of the world either. What you describe of your SS is really not unusual behaviour.

So it does come back to this: when it is your own kid, you don't like it but it doesn't define your child as there is a lot more to them than these poor habits. When that's all you focus on, it brings on intense dislike which they will feel and respond to accordingly.

All these are signed of low self esteem rather than poor discipline. Helping these kids to like themselves is the way for them to feel happier and in return want to make others happy.

hsegfiugseskufh · 04/04/2019 10:33

Personay of I know someone really doesn't like me, I rather they ignore me than say hello with a smile whrn deep inside they are thinking 'hope you drop dead' but that's irrelevant

yeah, I think you'd probably feel differently if these people were teenagers, who you lived with for however many days a week or full time, who you also cook for, clean for, pay for.

Sorry but no matter whether the child is mine biologically or not, they need to use their manners. Its not hard, its common courtesy and it prepares them for the working world where you will likely have to work with at least one person you cannot stand, and you cant be a petulant little shit about it then.

you're not seeing this from a step parents POV, you're doing the parent thing of looking at your kids through rose tinted glasses, and thinking well its ok that he's rude to whoever because he's brilliant and creative and whatever else. Not good enough. I wouldn't stand for it with any child whether they were mine biologically, step child, adopted child, child I was looking after for a day. Its not on to be rude. Not ever. Its not about focusing on the bad habits, its about teaching children (bio or not) how to behave. Step children aren't exempt from that in my house.

also, because behaviour is not unusual, doesn't make it acceptable.

your posts just illustrate that your standards for your children and their behaviour are really low.

The question is if they said hello with a smile, thank you after you cook and did a couple of chores, would that make them pleasant stepchildren?

certainly more pleasant than one that treats your house like a hotel, ignores you but expects you to run round after them.

I don't think its always low self esteem either. I think its pure laziness, some teenage hormones thrown in there and often, with the other parent they expect different standards, so there is no consistency in expectations of behaviour.

for instance, if I was your childs step parent, I would probably be frustrated that your child was lazy and rude, and frustrated that you didn't give a shit.

pastel01 · 04/04/2019 12:32

Let's face it, some teenagers don't even like their own parents. Does that mean that parents should be ignored in their own home?

I totally agree with you @PlantPotParrot.

OP posts:
Bananasinpyjamas11 · 04/04/2019 19:14

@plantpot I agree I think there’s a HUGE difference between a kid just being a normal moody teenager, and one who just wants you OUT of the house. And is prepared to carry this on for years.
@rose unfortunately I think this happens way too often I think she actually enjoys the fact he's vile towards me. where the Ex fuels the step kids hatred of SM, it’s even got a name ‘loyalty bind’. It’s nothing to do with a personality clash or teenage hormones, and it’s a bit ridiculous to try to attribute this as cause.
@pastel it’s just totally different, the resentment that many experience as SMs from teenagers, it makes their partners doubt their relationship, it makes them feel an outsider in their home, as it’s a step parents homevtoo. I think very few parents of moody teenagers have their marriage rocked or feel pushed out.

Just really, really tiresome and unhelpful for parents with no experience of step parenting to constantly attribute these as causes, because of their own limited experiences.

stealthmode · 04/04/2019 20:42

Hold on. You actually think it is societally acceptable that if someone does not like you, or gel with you, to simply snub you/ outright ignore you? That’s hilarious. As an aside people may want to start reading up on the most important critical skills we should be instilling in the youth of today as they prepare for the jobs of the future. Because tech and automation will displace more jobs than we realise.

The number one skill? Emotional intelligence
Two? Creative thinking
Three. Storytelling.

All three of the above require mental agility, a real understanding of navigating of human emotions and reading situations. The basic of which starts by teaching children (and yes teenagers are children) manners. Basic manners. Hello. Goodbye. Thank you. Can I help? How are you?

This idiotic notion of ‘of course you can ignore someone you dislike’ is NOT equipping children with the basic skills they need. If any of my nieces/ nephews/ DC behaved this way in anyone’s home, including mine and I witnessed it or heard about it, they would be pulled into line sharpish. Plenty of teenagers have wandered in an out of my house and not ever have they behaved in these ways. I always get a ‘hello ms Stealthmode’. ‘Thank you’. ‘Goodbye, thanks for letting us come over’. They even stretch to a ‘can I get that for you’. (Ok that last one happened once, it is a rarity).

People coming on here defending terrible manners towards any other people, irrespective of whether these humans are SM’s or not, terrible excuse for parenting. Terrible.

And would I tolerate this happening in my house? And continually turn the other cheek because they have ‘loyalty binds?’. Not a chance.

Bananasinpyjamas11 · 04/04/2019 23:46

Yes @stealth I’ve had this round and round argument before on these threads, with many posters saying that of course anyone should ‘have the right to ignore anyone else’. I pointed out that this could be legally defined as bullying, but to no avail! As step mums we shouldn’t ignore and therefore bully our step kids, but the same really does go vice versa!

Anuta77 · 05/04/2019 04:06

To be fair, sometimes the ignoring thing (I don't defend it, I know now how bad it feels) could be because the child feels bad inside, not dislikes the SM. I remember not being able to say hello to my new SF who suddenly moved in with my mom. I was 16 and was confused, shy, etc. I just couldn't bring myself to say hello and I know that whenever we would end up in the same room, he would stare at me expecting it. I didn't hate him, after a while, I even liked him, but I just couldn't...
One of my SSs started ignoring me once after I had a problem with his mother who shared all the details with him. As I later realized, he felt bad, because he actually liked me and later apologized.
But the problem is that when it's not your child, you don't know what's inside their heads. That's the difference between how you feel when the rudeness comes from your child or your stepchild.

Decormad38 · 05/04/2019 04:39

Teenagers can be nightmares. That’s a fact. You have more leverage as their biological mum but that’s it. Move on and get a chap without so much baggage. There’s no point in saying the kids are like this or that. Their behaviour is part teenage hormones and part fallout from parents splitting.

swingofthings · 05/04/2019 06:04

you're not seeing this from a step parents POV, you're doing the parent thing of looking at your kids through rose tinted glasses
I can totally understand how unpleasant it is as a SP to live in these conditions, however, I think SP can also become so engrossed in their anger and frustration that they lose sight of what it is like for the teenager. I don't have rose tinted glasses at all, I just know that teenagers who are rude, blaze, uncaring are teenagers who are hurt, usually hurt by adults who are much more focussed on what they want and what they think is right for them, rather than trying to understand what goes in the head of the teenager.

your posts just illustrate that your standards for your children and their behaviour are really low
No, it illustrates that I understand that teenagers don't come in perfect models, that some of them are emotionally disturbed, full of confusion and hurt and being rude is usually their way to express their anger in what they consider to be the mildest form of anger.

A nightmare teenager can become an amazing person given the right conditions with people who see them as people with qualities and potentials rather than a body that invades their space because most likely that is exactly how your step kids feel around you, that your life would be wonderful if they were not there and that will make them feel like they are perished food worth nothing more than being thrown in the bin. And yes, that will make them feel sollen, grumpy, and ungrateful. It's hard to thank someone for cooking dinner when deep inside they know how much they resent doing it and wish they didn't have to.

Saying that, I totally understand not wanting to clean and cook for them so why do it? The teenager is likely to be much happier if their own parent did so.

I wouldn't want to be the step parent of a miserable teenager and yes, they do come across as very hard to like, but I am pretty sure I would rather step away from them than getting to the point of growing such contempt and resentment towards them that some step mums clearly feel towards their step kids.

hsegfiugseskufh · 05/04/2019 10:04

swing

you're massively projecting here;

A nightmare teenager can become an amazing person given the right conditions with people who see them as people with qualities and potentials rather than a body that invades their space because most likely that is exactly how your step kids feel around you, that your life would be wonderful if they were not there and that will make them feel like they are perished food worth nothing more than being thrown in the bin.

pretty sure nobody on this thread has even hinted at feeling like that. And to be honest, the "right conditions" are never going to be letting them do the what the fuck they want, including being rude, and ignorant to whoever they want. Those conditions are never going to turn a shitty teenager into a lovely adult.

hsegfiugseskufh · 05/04/2019 10:07

this is what annoys me of the view of step parents, you assume that we all hate our step kids, that they're in our way, an inconvenience.

I don't think most step parents feel like that, and If I felt like that I certainly would leave because even if I gave no shits about the child, why would I voluntarily live with someone I disliked?

you're very narrow minded, and I to be honest don't know why you feel the need to comment on every single step parenting thread, because you're views are always derogatory and negative towards step mothers, I don't think I have ever seen you come here to be supportive or give advice other than "if you don't like it leave"

stuffedpeppers · 05/04/2019 12:24

My 2 DCS hated their now Ex SM - she was vile to them.

I taught them to always be polite, say please and thank you and good morning. If that was all they could do then fine. Be the better person!

It infuriated their then SM whose exclusion behaviour, rudeness and down right fucking bitchiness got worse.

They existed and were a permanent reminder of me!!! EX had nothing to deal with - they were polite, well behaved but did not engage with her antics. They were very young at the time and had not asked to be put into that situation. SM wanted respect but she did not deserve it, they lived with the situation because they had to not because they wanted to.

Now 5 years on - the eldest is articulate on the subject. Understands that they did nothing wrong, the appalling behaviour from her was driven by jealousy and by displaying impeccable manners under extreme provocation - in the end, they came out better. Why the hell should a 4 and 6 yr old have to learn that lesson.

This thread seems to have descended into a blame the father and not the SM - so multifactorial as to why these behaviours occur and how they are dealt with.

2 of my current dscs are fine, the 15 yr old grunts to my existence. He will grow out of it - it is just another phase.

hsegfiugseskufh · 05/04/2019 12:34

stuffed not all step mums are like your childs step mum... why would we blame ourselves when we have done nothing wrong?

yes, some step mums are arseholes, but not all, and a lot of the time they are let down by their DH / DP.

stuffedpeppers · 05/04/2019 15:50

plant- i know that there is a full spectrum of SMs DF, EX SDCs DCS etc.

However, this thread has descended into a blame the DF for not supporting SM thread and if they did what the SM wanted then all would be better. So far the Ex, SDCs and the partners have all been to blame - very little reflection of the SMs as to how they might be perceived or how their behaviour may exacerbate a situation.

My DCS have new SM - lovely sensible - we talk get on and act like adults

hsegfiugseskufh · 05/04/2019 17:47

However, this thread has descended into a blame the DF for not supporting SM thread and if they did what the SM wanted then all would be better

Well for a lot of us that is our experience, that dads/men are a bit crap in this situation.Hmm

Not sure anyones said they should "do what we want" so im not sure where youve got that from.

Youre basically saying we should all take a look at ourselves and realise its our fault.... errrrrrm no. Hmm

Bananasinpyjamas11 · 05/04/2019 18:14

Unfortunately it is SMs, and usually step mums, who become the scapegoats.

If I could have changed myself - so that the problems with my DSD and DP went away, I would have gladly done it. I just wanted a happy home.

However, the problems were not caused by me. So there was nothing I could do. The same for many other SMs.

swingofthings · 05/04/2019 18:18

you're massively projecting here
So was Dusty but she was actually thanked for sharing her experience. A bit of a selective accusation.

I don't think most step parents feel like that, and If I felt like that I certainly would leave because even if I gave no shits about the child, why would I voluntarily live with someone I disliked?
You're are right there, I am reading from some posts here that a number of sm have a strong dislike of their teenage step kids and would be happy if they didn't exist. But that's because the way they are spoken about is so derogatory, it's hard to understand how someone who care about someone who could refer to them in such a tone.

Why are you assuming that because I try to share explanations as to why teenagers can sometimes act in unlikeable manners and that it doesn't mean they are horrible people who will turn into poor mannered adults, it means that I'm insulting stepmums. I don't reply to all sm thread, and I do respond at times supporting the poster (sm). Even in this thread I've said that I feel for sms and wouldn't want to be them.

Yes, I do think some stepmums struggle to understand teenagehood and don't seem to want to try. That doesn't mean I don't think they have it hard, far from it.

My posts are not about allocating blame. There are about trying to offer a perspective from the teenager. It doesn't make the teenagerctotsllly blameless nor the sp solely at fault. Surely its about gaining a better understanding to try to open communication to find a way to better harmony.

swingofthings · 05/04/2019 18:28

why would we blame ourselves when we have done nothing wrong?
To me that says it all really. How can you be so sure that you aren't doing anything wrong?

I certainly learned that sometimes I do get things wrong. They might seem right from my perspective but are not from the other person.

Resolving conflict is not about putting all our energy in trying to convince the other that we are right and they should do as we say. It's about listening to their perspective, expect them to listen to ours and come up with compromises both agree with, whether it be by accepting a situation that is half way, or agreeing to one side for one situation but the other side for something else.

And blame is pointless. We all try to do our best with the resources we have.

hsegfiugseskufh · 05/04/2019 19:12

Im not saying were perfect or never wrong, im saying that a lot of us have tried our best for years and theres nothing wrong with that.

You talk about resolving conflict like its so simple which just goes to show you haven't got a clue. A lot of us arent even "allowed" to try and resolve conflict because dp/dh say they will sort it, and dont. Or ignore the conflict hoping it will go away.

You cant resolve conflict with someone who you're not allowed to discipline or even have an adult conversation with. For me, dp wants to resolve conflict but in practice isnt always very good at it.

Saying step mums dont want to try and understand teenagers is just ignorant to be honest and again suggests you just dont get it at all or how hard it is.

swingofthings · 05/04/2019 19:58

I've mentioned a few times on this thread that I could totally appreciate how hard it must be to be a step parent to a difficult teenager.

Being a step parent is hard, there is no doubt about it at all, but that doesn't mean that the step parent should have the right to dictate how the kids should be parented and disciplined because they are convinced they know better than the actual parent.

What they are entitled to is to not do anything dutiful towards step kids who can't appreciate it.

hsegfiugseskufh · 05/04/2019 20:03

but that doesn't mean that the step parent should have the right to dictate how the kids should be parented and disciplined because they are convinced they know better than the actual parent

Who has said that they should?

Whats been said is that dps/dhs dont always help the situation and can make things harder. Not "we know best let us discipline your children". Its not about "knowing better" and nobody has said it is. Its about not accepting being treated like shit by your step child, for not wanting to be taken advantage of. For wanting your dp/dh to do something about unacceptable or rude behaviour. None of that is unreasonable.

What they are entitled to is to not do anything dutiful towards step kids who can't appreciate

Well, in theory yes but that doesnt fit with the mumsnet ethos that step kids need to be treated like royalty. Stepping back is when you start getting the "youre a heartless bitch, leave your husband and his child immediately" comments.

Anuta77 · 05/04/2019 20:17

I wouldn't want to be the step parent of a miserable teenager and yes, they do come across as very hard to like, but I am pretty sure I would rather step away from them than getting to the point of growing such contempt and resentment towards them that some step mums clearly feel towards their step kids.

And what would you do if you are in a relationship for a while and have children and a mortgage with your partner, things are going well with step children and they suddenly change their attitude and become rude? If they only come EOW, so you really don't have much impact? You tell your partner and he doesn't believe you or says they are just joking? if it's not as bad, but it still hurts you? You will just leave?

What you describe about rude teenagers is not wrong, but it's easy in theory.

Not all SMs have experience with teenagers. Not all of them have internal ressources to understand and resolve problems (ex. if they have young children that require a lot of time, work, house chores, fatigue, older children who need help, driving to activities). Parents lose patience with their own kids and nobody says the're arseholes. If I get annoyed with SD whom I don't discipline, I'm spiteful, resentful, blablabla.

I'm a person who wants to resolve problems, but I didn't feel that I could just ask SD to take time away from her phone and ask her what happened with her feelings. I wouldn't even know how to go about it!

swingofthings · 06/04/2019 08:10

Anuta, I totally agree with your post. Dealing with teenagers is very tough, tough for a parent, certainly tougher for a SP. It is tougher because there is something missing that helps parents and that is unconditional love. So whereas parents will indeed lose their rag, this will be balanced by a feeling of love and faith in our kids. We might anger our kids but this will be balance by us at other times, doing things to make them feel worthy of being loved. It's like teachers. The problem is when you get to the point of such exasperation that all the focus is on the negatives and a feeling that you have nothing left to give to the teenager to make them feel good about themselves. When a kid gets to the point of believing that they are hated and reminded how unlovable they are, they respond by being rude, uncaring and ignoring.

Of course there are kids who we are just never going to like no matter what. I can think of three children of my friends who I have never felt anything positive for even though of course they are adored by my friends.Its just the way it is. If they'd been the children of my partner, I just wouldn't not have continued thexrelstionship because the like of anything positive for the kid would haveinevits ly got in the way of our relationship.

This is about kids who were pleasant or OK and turn into teenage monsters when even as a parent, it becomes a real challenge to like them. I totally agree about not having the internal resources to deal with it, it's really tough. Even as a pare t, I felt really helpless when I was first faced with it but what I learnt that totally changed my way of dealing with it is that as I struggle more and more to like my DS, the same happened to himself, he too find himself harder and harder to love, and it's that self loathing that made him an aggressive, rude, unpleasant twat. It was almost as if it was easier to act like that to validate how he felt about himself.

I tried the strict, disciplinary, punishing approach and it was a disaster because all it did was make him withdraw even more into himself and his self esteem took even more of a dip. It was actually showing him that whatever his behaviour, whatever he threw at me, whatever he thought of himself, I still love and believed in him and gradually slowly, he started to see good in himself and believing that maybe he wasn't a lost cause. Its taken some time but he is now starting to show appreciation for what I do for him, not because I expect it but because he is not so focussed on his internal misery any longer and can start to look around him. His thank you are now genuine rather than just blurted out.

Speaking with other parents who had difficult kids and friend teachers, this is all too common behaviour and indeed, seem to be more common amongst kids from seperated household who struggle to feel they fully belong to the two families they share.

I'm a person who wants to resolve problems, but I didn't feel that I could just ask SD to take time away from her phone and ask her what happened with her feelings. I wouldn't even know how to go about it!
I know, it is so hard to speak to them because it's the last thing they want to do. I used to ask ds to do things 1to1 thinking that's what he wanted to do but he would just refused and it infuriated me and hurt my feelings that he would rather stay in his room but continued to ask and incredibly, one day, he's the one who came to me and ask about us going out for dinner just the two of us. I made sure when we did to only talk about the good things to make it a pleasant experience. Since then, we go out once every 3 weeks or so, he is always up for it, we have fun, he is pleasant, polite and thankful and it is now even himself who will bring up some difficult conversations.

It takes so much patience and understanding and yes, how can step-parent be expected to have it when it is enough of a challenge for a resident parent? I only post because I strongly believe that when you are faced with difficut teenagers, being strict and demanding can often have the opposite effect and if that's the case with a parent it certainly will be with a SP. This is why partners can appear weak because they know that the best way to go a out it is to focus on showing their kids that they understand and respect their turmoil rathercrhsn confront it.

That's why I think that if getting invested in trying to be patient is just too much of a ask (rightly so), the best attitude to have is one of not getting involved. Not ideal but better than growing mutual apathy and resentment.

And yes, hormones certainly play their role! I'm going through the menopause and I feel like I'm 14 again! Thank God my OH is being patient with me. It's not me, I don't know why Ive gone from a confident self assured adult to someone with low self esteem and who doesn't like the person she's turned into. I know it's not me and I'll come out of it but the quickest way to do so is to have my OH support that despite being grumpy, miserable, moody and the rest, instead of expecting me to sort myself out, he reminds me that I'm still worthy of his love and affection. So yes, I think I'm in the right state of mind to understand what my DS goes through although he still infuriates me at times!

hsegfiugseskufh · 06/04/2019 08:16

This is why partners can appear weak because they know that the best way to go a out it is to focus on showing their kids that they understand and respect their turmoil rathercrhsn confront it.

Whilst this may have been your approach, i dont think this is a conscious approach made by a lot of nrps. I think their approach is often "ignore it and say nothing in case they stop coming over" which doesnt work because it just causes resentment with other people in the household.

And whilst i undedstand how your sons behaviour was caused by self loathing, as you put it, even then i wouldn't agree that its ok to be rude to people.

stuffedpeppers · 06/04/2019 10:45

Am not saying - SMs take a look at yourselves and see it is your fault.

However, to say it is all the EX, DF and DSCs fault and the SMs just need support is absolute bollocks. It is all those components put together.

New SM ( who I like) upset eldest by asking him to do something repeatedly over time which he can not physically do - due to a health issue.Which she knew about. He started getting rude and ignoring her because everytime she said something he got embarrassed. Behaviour got worse - i dropped off DCs one day, he stormed passed her at the door and yelled I am not doing x so don't ask.

All got resolved then and there but it took months for DC to forgive her and forget.

inadvertent actions by one person to another cause hurt .
No one is blame free in these situations