Why is the new wife / stepmum ALWAYS wrong?

[milkyface]

I've read a few threads on this in the last few weeks, and I can't honestly get over some of the responses.

Step mums (and potentially dads but it's usually step mums who write the op) are always wrong according to at least half (probably more) of mumsnet.

You see your stepchild often - you are too involved and should let the, have dad - child time on their own.

You don't see your stepchild often - you are not interested and your stepchild will know you don't like them

You have your own child from a previous relationship - focus on them and leave dad and stepchild to it

You don't have your own child - well you obviously know nothing about parenting

You have a baby with a man that has children already - you've ruined his current children's lives

You speak to the ex - you are too involved and over step the line

You don't speak to the ex - you should communicate better

You help your dp/dh with childcare - no you are too involved your significant other should give up work immediately and spend all his time with his child and not you

You don't help - you don't like your stepchild, you are selfish, you should act like part of the family

You have a good relationship with your stepchild - you have overstepped the line you are not their mum or their friend

You are not overly fond of your step child - you are pure evil and that's that

Oh and last but not least...... You knew what you were getting yourself into

Oh and let's not even get into maintenance, or the fact that obviously ex's are never wrong, never abusive, never threatening and always perfect mums who only want the best for their kids.

Rant over

And before you say it I know all step mums are not great and not all mums are shits I'm just saying mumsnet seems to think all mums are great and all step mums are shits

AvaCrowder my stepmum was pretty awful too, she was also ok. My dad was not a good dad

rach I remember you from the other thread that talked about "who should post"

Let's be honest it's rare to see a step dad posting about his difficulties it is majority SMs. I think this is what causes so many issues

I don't get this comment - it's women who start the vast majority of posts in any topic across this site whether stepparent or not.

With regard to the OP I agree. I'd also like to add that I hate the comparison/implication that Stepdads just seem to get on with it whereas if only Stepmums did the same all would be OK. It totally disregards the expectations put upon women whenever it comes to childcare/family life whether blood related or not.

It's nearly always the woman who does the majority of childcare/family stuff whether in a together or a blended family so she inevitably gets more put upon her e.g she'll already be doing the school run for her own kids or making the evening tea so she also ends up taking on that responsibility for her step kids as well - you rarely see it happen the other way round.

A stepdad however is nearly always the new partner of a RP and is coming into a setup where mum's the one "in charge" and running everything already so not only do SD's tend to have far fewer expectations put upon them but they as a couple aren't constantly worrying about every little decision resulting in access being stopped - this creates a very different family dynamic. Of course being a RP has its own stresses too (especially with deadbeat NRP's who dick about with access or child support) but they're not stresses that are laid directly at the stepdad's door in the way that childcare/shopping/cooking etc tends to get laid at the stepmum's door. Of course I see stepdads helping out with stuff but it's still nearly always the woman doing all the thinking/planning behind it all - it's a common complaint in together couples. Until wifework etc is addressed by society as a whole and there is genuine equality between the sexes then comparing stepmums with stepdads is like comparing apples with oranges.

I disagree Tempus majority of step dads who get with the mum often end up living with the child in question ( I know it can be the other way round). My DH does more for DS in terms of ex and his DW hes him in the school holidays, school runs on occasion, hospital appointments and generally guided him throughout his life since the age of 2 he is a parent to him as much as he is a parent to the other two.I'm sure he doesn't like my ex coming to collect DS but he knows and respects their right for them to have a relationship he gets on with it because he has to, someone questioned how he could put up with having an ex collect DS twice a week his answer was that it was DS right to a relationship with his father and they triumph any thoughts or feelings he has. I also think men aren't as emotionally charged in the same way women are which is why more or less it tends to be mothers and new partners who clash.

I couldn't have worded it better OP. I don't understand the comments about how the sm should step back and not be involved and stay out of everything. The sc are becoming part of their family, and it feels like a lot of comments (from both other sm and not) are aimed at how they should remain uninvolved and leave the real parents to it. I don't think being a sm isn't a real parent just because she / he isn't the birth parent. The sc is part of their new family - should they treat them like a guest?

And I don't think it's just the birth mothers causing the bad feeling. A lot of comments come from women who claim to be a step mother themselves - surely by staying out of it and leaving your partner to the parenting and the meal times and bath times etc you're creating a rift in your family?

Why would you not want to be a team and show your dsc what a functional family looks like - they already clearly know what it looks like when two parents don't live together and all the heartbreak that goes with that, surely the best way forward is to show them what a happy, United home looks like where everyone cares and is involved with everyone else?

I don't think being a sm isn't a real parent just because she / he isn't the birth parent. The sc is part of their new family - should they treat them like a guest?

That's all very lovely, but totally ignores the feelings of the most important people - the DCs.

I used to think like you do. I threw myself into welcoming my DSC, including them in the family, initiating new traditions and routines.

Resentment and rejection followed. They didn't want that. They expected to be guests in our home. They wanted special treatment on account of their part time/children-of-a-separated-family status. They didn't want me to be involved - to cook, clean, care or even speak to them.

I can't blame them - that is what they had been taught. I had absolutely no chance of countering that.

But the utopian 'let's all be one big happy, blended family' is rarely simple and if it is successful, you can guarantee the SM isn't asking for advice on MN.

If a stepmum advices another to back off its usually because they've made that mistake themselves and recognise the signs. It's not about creating a rift in the family, it's about choosing the "least worst" option for everyone involved.

And I don't think it's just the birth mothers causing the bad feeling. A lot of comments come from women who claim to be a step mother themselves
Given how often I'm flamed for giving that advice I often wonder why I still bother - because stepmums like yourself will never believe it until it happens to you.

Your example kind of makes my point though starry - your DP helps with parenting and does school runs "on occasion" but I bet you wouldn't dream of defaulting such things to him by virtue of his sex as so often happens the other way around. And I bet he doesn't do more than you whereas I've seen plenty of Stepmums do more child-related chores than their pisstaking DP's - often by default e.g shopping, cooking and cleaning happens to be their role already so naturally that includes the DSC unless SM specifically excludes them. There's a current thread where the SM is on maternity and is/will be picking up the majority of school runs and childcare for both dad and mum. There's another thread on Relationships where the OP feels guilty for not wanting her DP's three children round every weekend because he expects her to do virtually all the additional work. I can't say I've ever seen it happen the other way round.

shopping, cooking and cleaning happens to be their role already so naturally that includes the DSC unless SM specifically excludes them.

And if a stepmum does that (excludes them or expects their parent to care for them) she's "creating a rift" in her family

Some of us are old enough to remember when the partner/spouse of a NRP did have to provide details of their income to the agency responsible for assessing child maintenance.

I know this used to happen. It must have been been really hard work!
So glad they don't take nrp partner's income in to account anymore.

My impression is that fewer men read parenting books and forums so tackle parenting by going with the flow or speaking to other men like their siblings, father and friends for advice.

Women tend to be the RP and I suspect that new partners fit into the routines decided by the mum. I think that NRP often don't have a routine as visits tend to be on weekends so rules are not seriously enforced as visits are treated like a holiday. When a new partner sensibly brings up long term rules like children staying in beds and not co-sleeping with daddy then it makes the stepmother seem unreasonable as she's driven the change and kids prefer the way that things were before.

When a new partner sensibly brings up long term rules like children staying in beds and not co-sleeping with daddy then it makes the stepmother seem unreasonable as she's driven the change and kids prefer the way that things were before

Interestingly, many stepparents don't try and force a change for fear of damaging the relationship, but resentment begins to simmer under the surface.

Those stepmums who are 'brave' enough to enforce boundaries, saying to their DP - "I'm happy for you to co-sleep with your DC but I'll sleep in the spare room" are often slated for being unreasonable - as if they should accomodate whatever parenting choices their DP makes irrespective of the impact on themselves.

I can think of no other situation in which an adult would be told that they should co-sleep with a child no matter how uncomfortable they (the adult) feels about it - yet stepparents are told they are damaging their SDCs if they don't put their own needs to one side in order to accomodate the SDCs preferences.

NN - but if you're joining a family (and when you get involved with someone who has children, then of course you're joining their family - you don't get just the man or woman, you get the whole family) then I can't understand why you wouldn't involve yourself in family life. And that includes things like sharing cooking and cleaning - if you stayed out of it all, and had a relationship with just your partner and not the dsc, what would be the point? You'd always be the outsider surely?
And I appreciate you've had bad experiences - wouldn't it be great if someone who had made a success of your situation felt comfortable in posting advice instead of being shut down for their utopian ideas of blended families? And I don't mean me, I mean that it would be great if this board was a space everyone could feel comfortable voicing their successes without someone else pointing out all the things they're doing wrong when they're offering advice to the person who originally posted. Because I don't think the problem is blasting the person asking for advice, it often seems to be blasting the people offering advice on how they're making a success of co parenting dsc in difficult situations. Im sorry we disagree on that not being in the best interests of the dc

When you're in the wrong then you are, its not a matter of who you are.

If SM's get told they are BU, its because they are BU. Pretending to be part of a poor put upon group who are attacked for no reason...its just bullshit.

when you get involved with someone who has children, then of course you're joining their family - you don't get just the man or woman, you get the whole family

It's that kind of single minded, blinkered advice that can create more problems than it solves.

Not all families want a stepparent to join them. Forcing yourself into a dynamic is a recipe for disaster.

And judgemental comments like "what would be the point?" only go to further undermine the confidence of a stepmum who has tried everything and is reluctantly accepting that they can't achieve it.

NN I think you misunderstand me. I'm not criticising you, I'm asking what you get out of the situation - if you're not part of the family? and like I said, you've tried everything you can think of, but like you, there's other people out there who've done it differently and they've found a way to make it work. Surely you want to hear from them - and create a space where they could come to you and give you help and advice? I don't think that it always feels valued when people do post about how they made a success of those challenging circumstances - so they're reluctant to do it because it gets twisted to show how they're too involved and they should stay out of the co parenting of the dsc. I appreciate you're still finding your way - but that doesn't mean that the advice from your own situation will pertain to other posters - and it's just as damaging to tell them to back off just because that approach didn't work for you. Or make them feel bad because it's working for them. Like I said, I don't think it's the OPs asking for advice who get all the flaming, a lot of it is people posting about how they did it or what they do that is working for them and could potentially work for the OP

I'm sorry your situation is so hard for you - I can only imagine how awful it must feel to have to remain on the outskirts of your own family - and I really hope someone who has had a similar experience can give you guidance and hope that it will improve

It's much easier to slot into a relationship where you're with the primary decision maker. The stepdad can kind of just slot into the place where the dad used to be i.e. mum doing most of the house/child stuff whilst dad helps out. The dynamic doesn't actually change that much as rightly or wrongly fathers are traditionally a lot more hands-off parents than mothers. You only have to look at the average school run or who's the one doing the part time jobs or taking emergency leave to see that's the case. (In cases of dads doing equal or more than the mums then I doubt very much they'd only be seeing their DC EOW anyway).

The trouble comes when a male NRP fails to realise that post-separation they are also now "mum" so when a new partner comes along and is expected to slot into the place where mum used to be then there'll be a lot more expected from her than just "helping out". I think that's why many Stepmums can struggle with doing stuff for DSCs - I don't think anyone would begrudge helping out a bit (or even a lot) but by virtue of being female you find the balance creeping up and up until the usual equilibrium of the "two adults plus kids" household is restored i.e woman more hands on, man more hands off. Except that woman is not the DC's parent!

I'm asking what you get out of the situation - if you're not part of the family?

I have a strong, fun, loving marriage, a strong relationship with my own DD, and the knowledge that she has a positive role model in her DSDad.

I appreciate you're still finding your way

Um, no. My relationship with my stepDC's ended three years ago.

I can only imagine how awful it must feel to have to remain on the outskirts of your own family

More judgement - it's not awful for me at all. Why do you think it would be? By saying you "can only imagine how awful it must be", you are undermining our way of doing things, that works for us. You are projecting how I "should" feel about the situation.

I have never challenged other people posting their own experiences. Each situation is unique. What I will continue to challenge is posts like yours, which make judgements about what the aspiration should be and how anything other than that is somehow "not working". My way is working for me.

*I think its a very difficult situation. I am not excusing the crap comments but it must be incredibly hard to give your child over to your ex knowing another woman will also be parenting your child.

But I know I would also find it REALLY hard for my child to come home raving about how amazing the step mum was and if my parenting methods were questioned.

I know that is incredibly selfish but it must feel like you have lost your husband and your child.*

It works the other way too. My dh was thrown out of his own house and had to watch as his very young children started calling the OM "dad". While people judged him for being an "absent father" and praising her for doing such a wonderful job with the children "as a single parent". While he was living at his mums, trying to see the kids as much as possible, while working every hour to pay the maintenance she deemed she needed. It very nearly broke him.

At least if you're female chances are you'll get to keep your house and main residency, and will only be dealing with the evil stepmom a few days a week. If you're nrp you're watching another man in your house, seeing your kids more than you do.

Also, why is a father who goes on to have more kids with a second wife taking food out his existing kids mouths, or replacing them etc. While a mum in a second relationship (there's a thread atm about someone wanting a baby with her new partner) having more kids is seen as natural and her choice?

NN again - not personal - it feels like you think I'm attacking you (and I'm trying very hard to make it clear that that is simply what I am inferring from your conversation not what I'm projecting) and I'm not. I asked a genuine question and you've answered it. I'm sorry if my feelings about the situation have upset you, I didn't intend them to. I did say I didn't understand and as you say - you are happy with your current situation. That's great. I didn't even say that you shut down the other posters with the good ideas - I said that it happens and I think that valuable contributors are deterred from posting. I struggle like everyone I assume does, and so I like to hear from people who've been successful so I can see how I could do it differently if what I'm doing isn't working.

It's clear we have different views, and that's the whole point of a forum. I don't understand of doing it so I asked questions about how it fulfilled you. You've explained and answered my questions - if you feel my position was judging you, you're wrong. It was empathy at how hard I imagined it to be. You've clarified that you're happy and it's not hard - your way is working. I've not been in your situation where it's completely broken down so I can only imagine - I can't draw on my own experience. If what I imagined isn't your reality then that's great - it doesn't change that I would feel empathy for anyone in your situation who wasn't satisfied with the way things are. Just like it doesn't change that you're fulfilled and happy in your situation. There's no judgement.

There's no judgement.

But there is judgement.

"It must be awful"

Now, that doesn't actually bother me at all - I came to terms with my situation a long time ago and wear my "wicked stepmother" badge with pride - but for a stepmum who feels relief from withdrawing from her DH's DC's, reading your comment "it must be awful" fills her with doubt.

Her mind is suddenly full of questions and self doubt:
Is she a dreadful person, because she doesn't feel awful about it?
Why are people questioning what she gets out of the situation? Should she be considering ending the marriage?
Why do people think "it's not working"? What should be happening if this isn't right?

I think fathers often put stepmothers in a situation where they can't win. For example, there are many stepmothers who are not asked forced but end up providing holiday childcare for stepchildren despite having a new baby or children of her own shocks me. I can't see the reverse happening unless it was a one off emergency and thanks to sexism, the grandmothers and aunts would be helping.
Women are traditionally considered maternal so I think they end up feeling more pressure to succeed as a stepmother. They bite their tongue and end up being considered the bad guy when they explode later. I can't see stepfathers biting their tongue in the same way.
I see a lot of stepmothers on here direct anger at the kids or ex rather than their partner. I get that it's sometimes hard to see the wood for the trees but if they recognised that earlier then they would have solved things or left the relationship.

Because to me it must be. If I were in your situation it would be. Until we had this conversation I didn't have another point of reference on this. Your situation makes me sad. That's not judging, that's my feelings. If you didn't want other people to have feelings on your situation then why would you post it on the Internet for all to read? youre the one who volunteered all the background on your situation - if you didn't want questions on it, why volunteer it?

To be honest in my situation DS SM isn't particularly hands on with DS it's often his DF who cooks in their household and cleans rather than SM, they work both full time at present but she's often out with friends when DS visits and does her own thing, not that I blame her she isn't obliged to stay and participate in majority of things because DS is there. Things might change as she's currently pregnant with her first child so she maybe more hands on as she will have her own child to see to so its a case of all children are seeing to all the children in the household rather than a step child that comes round with no children within the household.

Would I expect her to help out with childcare due to her being off on mat leave and she is a teacher not at all I do think mothers can take liabilities but then my ex only has DS two weeks for holiday access a year so I accept the two weeks help I get. Me and DH work it out between us to cover the rest of the school holidays.

if you didn't want questions on it, why volunteer it?

You're not asking questions, you're projecting your own feelings and values onto me.

As I said, it doesn't bother me - I've been judged and condemned by far worse than the MN jury - but a stepmum who has finally found some relief by making herself scarce every weekend could well feel judged and insecure reading someone saying "your situation MUST be awful" . Why should it be? For her, it's not awful at all, but your assumption that it is leaves her questioning and doubting her own decisions.

As the woman of the household you're expected to do the bulk of childcare, housework, bath times etc...
Old fashioned view I know but it's still there.
I work part time whilst dh works full time. dh's exw works part time whilst her dp works full time.
Me and his exw have the same roles in our own households- that is, to pick dcs up from school, do most of the housework, holiday childcare, etc...
I have quite a different dynamic with my stepchildren than their stepdad does. He goes to work, earns the pennies and gets to come home and his job is done, with nowhere near as much childcare or nitty gritty stuff involved for the dscs like I do.
That's exactly the same role as my DH has with the very same children- His children.

So the dynamic I have is a much more hands on, running around feeling exhausted type of one. Very much like the role their mum has for the very same children. Much different to their stepdad. I don't get to come home from work and just put my feet up. I have 1 child from a previous relationship and 2 DSCs, so as a mum and stepmum I do the bulk of everything.
So it kind of makes my teeth itch when I see that someone has said the stepdad does a lot more for the children and has a tougher job.

I don't think I am in any way better than him, I'm just pointing out that there is a huge difference in the expectations of a stepmum and a stepdad. I do also realise this isn't the case with everyone though.

NN like I said - to me it would be awful. I think it's really sad especially for the children. I am a child of a blended family and I've chosen to join one when I met my DH. I would find it very hard as either a child or a parent if communications and relations had broken down in my family to that extent. I don't understand why I'm not allowed to feel that way about it or express it? Of course if I came up to you in the street and voiced these opinions unsolicited then I'd be completely out of order. But I didn't. You told me your experience and I told you how I would feel if it were me. I'm entitled to my feelings even if they contradict yours. Just like you. If that makes other parents in your position question their decisions then that is the nature of the online forum. You've certainly made me question whether a blended family is the right way forward - I've considered it and can definitely say I wouldn't change a single thing about my own family or decisions based on your feelings. We are here to hear alternative views. I've heard yours and I'm happy they work for you - but you say that I shouldn't voice my feelings as it may offend others in your situation - I don't agree with that. And to be clear, disagreeing isn't judging or attacking. It's simply a different point of view.