The Women's Rolling Football Thread season 2024-25

[DuncinToffee]

All ready for a brand new season ⚽💪

Previous thread

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/sports/4879827-the-womens-rolling-football-thread-season-2023-24

The sound wasn't great @TizerorFizz

No idea why women are so bad at penalties, as I said it used the be even worse.
Mindset over power and skills, I think

Jess Carter was slow but the defence and midfield in general were poor. It was Walsh who gave the ball to a Swedish player for the first goal and Williamson who barely tried to get back to support Carter and Hampton for the second.

But it was Carter who made a poor pass to Walsh to begin with which caused Walsh's error.

I don't blame Carter for the second goal, that wasn't her fault but after the first goal she did make a couple of other mistakes. I remember thinking that things come in three so hopefully that was all her mistakes and after that she did make some really good long-range passes.

Don't get me wrong, she was terrible, and she oughtn't be playing in the next match but I think it is unfair to focus just on one player when it is a team game.

Yes, it is, but the problem is that she was so much at fault for the first goal so it is difficult to forget that especially as it was within 2 minutes.

I actually don't think that she should definitely be left out of the next game just bc she had a bad game yesterday. It depends on how Italy play. If they play like the NL, then perhaps she should stay as she had a good game against them. If they play like Sweden then she definitely shouldn't start.

Unfortunately, SW rarely makes changes, so I think she will stick with Carter regardless, but I hope that I am wrong.

@MustTryHarderAndHarder Any decent analysis is going to say Jess Carter is slow. If you think about the men’s game, Kyle Walker was only a fraction slower than Dina Asher Smith in sprinting. He’s past his prime now but it’s such a huge bonus in covering fast breaks and tackling. Then you play the ball intelligently. I don’t know if we have faster defenders, but we need them as wing backs and as players who can set up attacks. All we did was hoof the ball over the top of the midfield. We eventually ended up with 5 attacking players on the field so in the last 20 minutes there was an urgent need to get the ball to them, accurately. We managed it but it felt a bit like Sweden going to sleep and us getting luck.

Carter's problem is that she is not a great distributor. Fantastic 1v1 defender but I was amazed to see SW put her in the centre of a back three - would have expected our best passer (LW) to be there - and she was so susceptible to Sweden's excellent pressing. I do think England got lucky, but they fought for it and the subs were game changers. Sweden could and should have put the game to bed in the first half.

I love Sweet Caroline, especially the #duh-duh-duh# bit.

But I watched the game with the sound turned down because the style of commentary and punditry in England games is really starting to grate with me. Anyone remember Laura Basset's own goal against Germany in 2009(?) which cost us the game? There was loads of sympathy for her, which was great, but nobody pointed out that she was at fault, rather than unlucky, because she went with the wrong foot. We should have moved on from that.

Women's football in England is caught between trolls on the one hand who are outraged that women are even allowed to play, who don't want to see any articles about women's games on BBC Sport...and on the other hand, hagiographers.

@Snowypeaks DH and me just want an honest analysis. I don’t like any player being ripped into, but most managers realise when a player is struggling and make changes. SW was slow to do so and it can be costly. Gareth Southgate was similar. Prem managers get crowds yelling at them. They get the message sooner.

I too dislike the plucky unlucky tag. Players make mistakes. They all do. The men often acknowledge it to team mates. I’ve not seen this so much between women - maybe mistakes are just too regular and expected?

England defenders seem to be old fashioned defenders. A fast attacking full back in the men’s game is exciting. The women hoof it upfield too much. I think SW needs to ensure it’s played on the ground and ensure goalkeeper distribution and psssing between backs is secure. No letting nippy forwards in by poor passing. Fingers crossed for the semis though!

@TizerorFizz
English women footballers come from a place of being lesbians supporting each other and carving out their own safe place in football. Obviously the proportion of straight women has increased over the years, but essentially that vibe is still there. Sticking together is everything. I did find it interesting though that Leah Williamson was told (either by SW or Renee Slegers) not to be so critical of teammates!

Not sure I agree with this:
England defenders seem to be old fashioned defenders.
I'd say it's a mixture - LW and Alex Greenwood are ball-playing CBs and Millie Bright and (say) Jess Carter are more no-nonsense. Although Bright's distribution is good.

A fast attacking full back in the men’s game is exciting. The women hoof it upfield too much.
Again - I'd have to disagree somewhat. Lucy Bronze is the epitome of a fast attacking full back. Niamh Charles is very attacking when she plays on the left. And I suspect some of the "hoofs" upfield are actually supposed to be passes to Russo or one of the other forwards - certainly Leah Williamson's long distribution is a vital part of England's (and Arsenal's) attack.

It is an interesting discussion.

On one hand we want the game to develop, play in bigger stadiums, mirror the men's game.

On the other hand we don't want to lose that safe space, identity, connection with the fans.

It's like carving out a place where it belongs. Where womens football can stand on it's own without the comparison with mens football.

I don't know if that makes sense, I am not very good in explaining it.

It does make sense. Women's football doesn't have to be the same as men's football, essentially. It has different roots.

Iirc that was what Doucet was getting at when she said women's football should be like Glastonbury - passionate fans who are there for a good time. Everyone safe, everyone welcome. Alcohol permitted because fans are trusted.
On the other hand, we don't want to market it as a kids' playtime event, infantilise the players, or be prissy about the right or wrong sort of fan. Arsenal Women fanbase is a bit like this - a significant cohort are social media obsessed and a bit political and intolerant. Too much para-sociality (hope that's a word!).

I probably had echoes of Nikki Doucet in my head, I had forgotten about the Glastonbury comment.

I know what you mean. I like watch women's football because I like watching women playing sport. They aren't as fast and strong as men and for me that doesn't matter that's not what interests me. I rather think because it's relatable.

I'm delighted that goalkeepers are now saving shots that ten years they weren't getting anywhere near and in the next five years I hope to see more penalty kicks like those of Chloe Kelly and Lucy Bronze...

Meanwhile Everton are making so many signings, I am struggling to keep up. And there are more to come.

Fingers crossed they will quickly settle as team.

Ah Ok thanks! Can confirm I’m not Nobby (bit Gobby sometimes perhaps tho 😆).

Switzerland are stopping Spain so far, Caldentey decided to join the bad penalty brigade

How did Spain contrive not to score in that goalmouth scramble? And then a scorching effort by the Swiss at the other end. Entertaining stuff!

Spain 1-0 up now

eta make that 2-0

Yet another penalty saved! Spain are still 2-0 up though, so I doubt it will matter.

What is going on with the penalties

I enjoyed that.

France vs Spain could be interesting. I think France will beat Germany. Not much movement in terms of quality emerging from elsewhere. Very little improvement from countries like Croatia, Portugal and Belgium. There’s still not enough strength in depth in this competition. Too many one sided games for my liking.

@Snowypeaks Yes. I do think you are correct about the history of women’s football, but lack of punditry that is sensible and truthful is getting beyond a joke. We would just laugh if men did that!

I don’t agree about skill of the backs though. It was relentless hoof it up against Sweden and they kept losing the ball when trying anything else. I also think they can play more creatively attacking from the back against lesser teams but ability disappears when the opposing team has more skilful players - and Sweden did. In the Premier League a solid defender like Jess Carter is long gone at most clubs The men are way more athletic and creative. Just look at the top teams. I don’t want to be rude about her but not impressive in my book.

Chelsea 1 Barcelona 4. Bright, Walsh and Bronze all played. They just aren’t the best. Sorry.

I agree.

Reporting women's football in its own right instead of alongside men's football I think would help.

@TizerorFizz
JC is not at all impressive in my book either.
She has been regularly selected despite the changing needs of defenders facing fast and skilful attackers. A solid tackle is really not good enough without the ability to track back.