How can we make Britain more family-friendly?

[Carriemumsnet]

Mumsnet are launching an initiative to try and make Britain the most family-friendly country in Europe (well...the world actually, but we thought we'd start small ) Ambitious plan? Just a bit, but we think long overdue. We want to challenge companies - and we're talking everyone from travel firms to supermarkets, restaurants to mobile phone merchants - to join our programme and find out - from Mumsnetters - how they could make their industry more family-friendly. We're going to look at every aspect of how a company operates from how they market their goods to the welcome and facilities they provide to families. And then we want to encourage them to do business in a way that makes life easier for families not more difficult, and ultimately give Mumsnet Family-friendly awards to the ones that do it well.

Obviously we'll need lots of help and input from the folks who know most about all this - ie you. So before we really get going, we want to know what you think. What does family-friendly mean to you and what criteria should we use to judge whether a company is family-friendly or not? What do you love about what some companies are already doing and - just as important - what do you think they should stop doing? Is it the way companies try to sell products to you or your children that makes you cross or is it the fact that you can never squeeze your buggy down the aisle at your local coffee shop? Or both, or neither? If you could pick three things you'd change about any industry to make it more family friendly - what would they be?

Lots of questions but we'd love to hear your thoughts so please, post 'em here

Thanks

MNHQ

Hmm I'll be honest, I'm really not sure about this campaign.

I think it'll alienate a heck of a lot of people who are either past the children stage and just had to lump it, or those who just didn't do the children thing and are sick of having to accommodate those who do or any number of others, including some parents who maybe don't think the world has to change itself completely to function around their precious little darlings.

How about a Britain that just considers the needs of everyone? Not just families with tinies but everyone.

If you look at the countries which are considered most 'child-friendly' it's actually bugger all to do with that - they're family-friendy so that everyone, granny and grandpa included, has a role, a value.

Grump over!

Enough already of all these holier than thou campaigns.

Britain is plenty family friendly.
Anyone who thinks not needs their heads seeing to and a visit to most of the rest of the world where most kids don't even leave the house for years.

ah well my ideas range from the huge like attenborough to the tiny like plastic cups in cafes, and putting kiddie stuff on ground floors some shops are really bad at this grown men either will or will not shop putting their stuff on the ground floor will I expect make no difference I have walked out of lots of shops when I see the baby stuff is up/down stairs
the childrens food ideas on here are good as are the pricing suggestions, personally paying for anyone older than reception seems like a reasonable suggestion.
I think more needs to be done to help older children find suitable entertainment, we need to stop short changing them when it comes to education and where I am think about swimming facilities for young children/families with more than 2 children. Importantly we need to allow children to be children
the last 2 posters have a point but it doesn't mean that we shouldn't consider our own back yard

i think if you are going to do it - it should perhaps run something like the investors in people award which companies strive for.

i think as well as looking at retail places and the obvious, it would be good if you looked at customer service areas of councils and such. often people go tot he council offices becuase they are in a pickle of some kind, and they are asked to go into an office which isn't v. child friendly, rarely any toys ( incase kid eats them and they get sued) , so thats what i would like to see the direction take.

Have nursery care facilities (at least birth to 3yo) at the workplace.

Why do clothes shops always have the childrens section at the back of the shop or upstairs. Would be better to make it easy for parents to get to. Many times I have just decided not to bother looking if I have to tackle a lift.
Clothes shops always cram in as much as they can forgetting that buggies need to get round the shop and you end up dragging most of the clothes with you.
Supermarkets to design a hand basket that can rest on most buggies. When picking up a few things you can't push a buggy and trolly and carrying a hand basket is very difficult.
Restaurants.....clean your high chairs.

Give kids a real, heard, voice in things that effect them. In my experience young people have fantastic imaginative ideas. I facillitate a youth council for our local parish where ideas can be aired and debated.

Ideas they have come up with are BMX track - they have designed and built it themselves, community bank - ironically used by more adults than the kids themselves, campaign for better transport links, Networking events where they can be matched with parents and other adults working in an area they are interested to get work placementsing to paid work.

Because all of these projects are led by them they respect them and use them. As a direct result we (parish council) are being used as a best practice model for changes in local councils and youth engagement. They are really proud that they have set up and run a system, and are now being asked by the political big hitters how they have achieved it and more importantly how it can be rolled out to other areas successfully.

To make the UK more family friendly everybody has to change their "kids are up to no good" default attitude and respect them for the fantastic people they are. Asking companies to make a marketing coup of "family friendly" status does nothing to change an underlying dislike that many people and society as general have towards people under 20.

We are in the middle of doing a project in our church to review how "family friendly" we are. By far the most interesting thing that has emerged is the way that people of retirement age have started to speak out about their needs. And so have the single people - and those whose children have grown up and left home - and those with disabilities - etc - etc - etc

In fact, the further we get into the exercise, the more we are realising that it is not about pandering to children's needs. There is a much bigger issue about helping people of all generations to get along together and be tolerant of each others' circumstances.

So yes, adults need to be aware of children's needs to eat child-sized meals, run, play and make a noise. But children also need to learn to be gentle around frail elderly ladies who are worried that they will fall. And parents need to realise that they should intervene if their children are interrupting two people having a serious conversation. And everyone needs to realise that the teenager in a wheelchair who makes "funny noises" is perfectly capable of understanding what you say to her, even though she can't talk. And so it goes on ...

If Mumsnet could pull off a campaign that opened people's eyes to other peoples' needs - whether they be babies, toddlers, children, teenagers, adults or OAPs, that would be fantastic.

But please don't reduce it into another great long whinge about parking spaces, loos and baby changing facilities.

And we do all need to get over the fact that holidays will always be more expensive when the schools are off. It's called market economics and it is the way our entire country operates, along with most of the western world. So find some creative ways of holidaying on the cheap while your kids are at school and look forward to the day when they have grown up and you can do what you like!

Great posts, Smithagain and Anifrangapani.

Excellent post Smithagain.

A friend of mine used to work in Gap and told me an interesting thing about how clothes shops (or at least Gap!) were laid out. Men's clothes are usually at the front because men won't walk through the women's or children's section to get to their stuff. Women, however, will walk through men's clothing to get to their section. So, I suppose they put children's clothes upstairs because people will go to the effort of getting up there.

I think Britain is very good for children facilities, but in order to make it really 'child friendly' people's attitudes would need to change.

For example, we took dd to Rome when she was 1 yo. In terms of facilities it was an absolute nightmare, no nappy changing facilities anywhere, no crayons in the restaurants, no children's menus, etc. And yet, it was all so easy and pleasant because people love children there. In one restaurant where we ate a couple of times, a lady that worked there used to come and pick up dd and play with her for 10mins so we could eat. Also her grandson was there and they played together. which make it all so much easier.

It's the same in Portugal or Spain, facilities are rubbish, but there's a relaxed, friendly and most of all flexible attitude that makes it work. The facilities may not be there but people are happy to do their best to accomodate your needs. Whereas here, it's people's inflexibility that drives me insane! If it's not in the menu, if it's not how it's meant to be done or how they were told to do it, then it can't be done. I've asked for bread in restaurants because dd was crying with hunger / boredness and it's taken 15min for it to be processed via waiter / kitchen etc. Why they wouldn't go in the kitchen and get a slice of bread, even though it's not in the 'rules' I struggle to understand....

Agree with affordable childcare, as per countries like Sweden.

But we could also do with a seismic cultural change to bring in shorter working hours; we work some of the longest ours in Europe. This would naturally also benefit people without children.

On a more achievable level, how about more surburban side streets being limited to 20 mph speed limits? 30mph really not necessary, and often dangerous, on many smaller streets.

You know i think many people to today live in mini islands containing just their immediate families a lot of people don't even know their neighbours. I think Britain would benefit a lot more especially in regards in the view of children if people were more socialable. I think kids would benefit more if they lived in a society where they had access to many positive role models in their lives after all human's culturally began this way.

As it is society views children as a hindrance/annoyance especially teenagers.

I think this country is family friendly enough.

Imo we don't need any more godforsaken child friendly restaurants with play areas and where children are allowed to run around and let off steam.

How about you just teach your child to sit down and be quiet for the duration of a meal without having to have primary coloured entertainment laid on?

Take down those mosquitos outside shops and not just assume that a bunch of 3 teenage kids walking together with a skatebaord under their arm are about to cause mischief.

UK is plenty tolerant of babies and toddlers, but views kids aged between 13 and 18 as teh antichrist.

GetOrf I agree about not needing loads of places with play areas etc.

One of the problems is that because such places exist, when you try and take your toddler to a 'normal' restaurant you get frowned at for daring to go anywhere other than the Harvester/Brewer's Fare/insert other vile chain with plastic overcooked food here.

Agree about unisex changing facilities. And a child sized loo and basin would be great.

As the mother of 2 tall(ish) boys aged 12 and 10, I find it baffling that we often have to pay adult prices for them, especially in cafes restaurants etc.
Also we often go out to visit places when on UK holidays ( and they have all been UK as can't afford overseas during school hols) and a lot of palces charge for family tickets. On the whole they work out cheaper for us (example Paignton Zoo was £35 for the four of us, we were there for 5 hours and had a fab day) but we are a 2 child family, very few places seem to offer family tickets for 22 adults and 3/4/5 children" or "1 adult and 2/3/4 children". Indeed I saw a place which only offered a family ticket for 1 adult and 2 children, for £20 so "2" adult families then had to pay the £7.95 adult admission cost as well

Parks, there are so few around where I live and where there are, they are aimed at older children, what about toddlers?

Its also nice to be able to sometimes go to the pub for dinner but again, around us, they dont allow anyone under 18 in - arent we all entitled to eat?
Pubs/restaurants definitely need to be more child friendly

Generally I think we are incredibly family friendly as a country.

All I would like is clean toilets big enough to get a pushchair and a toddler in so you don't have to have a wee with the door wide open, so you can see them, or leave them with a random stranger outside before you pee your pants.

That's all.

Another vote for the "family loos" at Bluewater and Ikea. Fed up of peeing with the door open so DS in the pushchair doesn't freak out that he can't see me.

Need more facilities for teenagers, youth clubs and the like. My DC are all under 4, but my SiL is 16 and find it wrong that her social life revolves around the pub already. Teenagers need oppertunities and support to explore things. I spent my teenage years in Germany, where there were fabulous, free, youth centres with coffee shops and hanging out space that offered music classes, drama, sports, had youth workers and weren't attached to schools.

I find Britain quite family friendly already, we do have quite a lot for families and kids in London and generally people's attitudes are okay. Improvements I would like (although these are more difficult things not very easy to solve, improve...) is more accessible tubes in central london, alot of the further out stations are suitable for wheelchair/buggies (step free) but not many central ones. I know you can bump the buggy up steps etc but is so nice when you don't have to. Whenever they are doing improvements to stations could keep this in mind, like how kings cross has introduced some more lifts, but doing the whole lot at once probably way too expensive plus difficult as too many works would be going on. Would be good though, all new stations that are made should have steps free access from now on though imo, whether making new overground or extending underground lines or anything else.

The other thing is there really really is a lack of family sized housing in London, and the prices are crazy. Have seen some projects to make more family sized homes for affordable rent (for eg there is one being done on holloway road) we should have more of this kind of thing

Here's an example of family friendly from Glasgow.

Bang in the middle of the city centre, the Gallery of Modern Art has a children's area (just a little corner but it's great) with games, books & drawing stuff all about art, shapes and colours. And in the basement is a public library with a fab children's reading room.

It's not the facilities - you get them everywhere - it's the fact that it's in the middle of the three busiest shopping streets in the city and so you can take a break if you're out with a fractious 3 year old and (here's the clever bit) not spend any money (unless you go to the cafe).

More places like that. Places where you can take a wee bit of time out - and it's great for everyone, not just children.

GetOrfMoiLand Wed 01-Sep-10 12:47:31
I think this country is family friendly enough.

Imo we don't need any more godforsaken child friendly restaurants with play areas and where children are allowed to run around and let off steam.

How about you just teach your child to sit down and be quiet for the duration of a meal without having to have primary coloured entertainment laid on?

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i think i love you

custardo - think you can tell we are mothers of teens who have left the colouring pencils at a restaurant waaaaaaay behind us (thank god and all his cherubim)