Moondog training day -14th June. Please post on this thread if...

[lougle]

Could you post if:

A) You have booked and received a confirmation by email.

B) You have sent the form and cheque but have not had confirmation of your booking.

Or

C) Intend to book but have not yet sent the form/cheque.

Moondog has received 12 bookings so far, but I have had 26 forms requested.

If Moondog receives less than 15 bookings the event can't go ahead, so she may have to open it up to people from other places, but ideally we'd like to keep it to MNSN only.

I'm trying to get an idea of who else wants to come

Star, I was thinking more, as Polter asked my another thread about a possible 'MNSN co-op' type setup, but as I said there: I don't think they intend it to be used in that way and to be honest I think the offer is pretty generous. I wouldn't feel comfortable having myself listed as a 'teacher' for other people's children because the site is very clear that each family is counted as one 'class' and I'd be depriving them of up to £2000 revenue.

Yes, don't worry about American accent at all. Some kids, as you say, pick this up and quite funny to have them walking around saying 'vaaaaaan' for a few weeks but never remains an issue.

We discourage headphone use unless adult listening in with a split jack, at least in the early days.
Reason being, we need to ensure the programme has instructional control. In other words, the child needs to do what the programme asks him/her to do, when the programme asks her to do it.

This is a vital additional skill which will generalise to other settings when you get it right under the reinforcing conditions of the interactive programme.

A child (or indeed an adult) CANNOT learn unless they do what it is the instructor/teacher/parent asks them to do when asked to do it.

I know this is an issue for a lot of you, so you need to get it right. Get it right with Headsprout and you are not only working on literacy but on ensuring your child can take and follow instruction.

Again, cannot stress importance of this enough.
So, with regard to headphones, think about not using until you have observed enough sessions to ensure instructional control established. Then, you can hand those headphones back.
Make sense?

Gosh, I wouldn't worry AT ALL about setting up a Mumsnet class.
You really do not need to worry about Headsprout's coffers.
It was sold as a going concern to Mimio who messed it up no end and then sold it on to Learning A-Z, who have no concept or appreciation of what they have, hence the bizarre low price. They also want to mess about with it and introduce stuff that is not based on the watertight behavioural principles the programme is, so get in there fast before they cock it up.

I know all this because I was at a party earlier this month in Chicago with one of Headsprout's designers and she told me the whole sorry tale with great pain in her eyes.

Yes, total sense. We only used them after DD3 complained that she couldn't hear her Headsprout because DD1's Headsprout was on, but we can change that.

I was amazed by DD1 - we did the readiness test and she got the concept of 'click the one that is not the fish' first time! I really thought it would throw her.

Great! Yes, do those readiness exercises. They are essential. Two versions, as a whole and broken down into components (eg 'rapid clicking' 'concept of not'). Note which (if any) cause problems and work on them.
W have had kids working on, for example, the concept of 'not' as a table top activity for weeks before they are ready to start up.
More challenging for a parent as you need a good grasp of behavioural principles to break down what is going wrong and correct. Lovely Colleague and I had a real breakthrough a few years ago using TAG with this 'not' concept. Kid then sailed through whole programme.

The biggest hurdle the girls have had to overcome so far, is that clicking is disabled until the instruction is complete. They grasp the concept, click, then it doesn't work. Then, when the instruction is complete, they don't click because as far as they're concerned, they've already clicked. So I've had to remind them to listen until the instruction ends then do the task, several times.

I have just re-defined dd2's 'attention issues' as 'teaching not fast or intense enough and polluted by too much auditory guff'

haha!!

Lougle, that is also important.
Designed so the kid learns they need to listen until the instruction is given.
So many other computer programmes will respond to a click made before end of instruction.
The kid is only doing what their learning history has told them works but the trouble is, it's not a good strategy for learning.

Waiting until you have heard all you need to and then acting is, on the other hand.

Handy, in my experience, that is the issue with most kids.
I'd probably phrase it like this
-task unclear to child (use model/lead/test)
-duration of task unclear to child (use clock or the same activity format often so start and finish are clear)
-too much adult talk, therefore not enough active responding by the child
-pace too sluggish (time for kid to wriggle, zone out, detract adult with conversation)
-reinforce either not present or inappropriate (define reinforce of value and make explicit to child. Always consider fading reinforce so task itself becomes intrinsically reinforcing but remember that we all need reinforcement. Much of the world jogs by on social reinforcement (praise) but less than you think. For example, much as I enjoyed yesterday, and was pleased by your response and interest, I wouldn't have done it without being paid. The social reinforcement would not have been sufficient alone!

'If the child hasn't learnt, the teacher hasn't taught' (Michael Maloney)

'If the kid isn't learning, it isn't child friendly' (James T. Todd)

Ok, Lougle has now got all of my slides for distribution to anyone who wants them, as she has very kindly offered to do.
I've also sent her cribsheet and data collection form for Language for Thinking, an article I wrote recently on TAGteach and a slide presentation which is an overview of Headsprout.

I'll get those out to all of you later today. Thanks, Moondog.

OK, I've sent everyone who showed interest in booking a link to Dropbox folder with the handouts/presentations. If you haven't received it and you'd like it, PM me and I'll sort you out.

I just wanted to add my thanks to lougle for so effectively organising this fantastic course; signandsing for kindly providing the venue and the food and of course moondog and lovely colleague for your wisdom . My head is still spinning and I think it will take a few days to "feel normal "again!

I absolutely love the data collection part. I work in a scientific environment and data collection is a big part of what I do for a living so I'm very pleased to be able to transfer one of my few skills into helping DS!

It was lovely meeting you all and I hope you have found the course as useful as I've had. Looking forward to the next one!

I hope I never feel normal again!

Hi Lougle - I haven't got an email with the link to the slides, could you send or pm it to me please? I've had a big family party today and haven't had a chance to look at anything yet. Chicken clickers already ordered though!

Thank you so much everyone, it was lovely to see you all, fantastic to get so much information but also bit overwhelming, am looking forward to going over all my notes this week and sorting out where I can go next!

Sorry about that. I've sent a pm with the link.

I know what you mean Lougle about the normal bit. I've got back and although I've not started anything yet,(visit to stationers required and dd is sick) but just the attitude shift from me has meant a lovely relaxed ds. I think just stopping to think about what I'm asking and if I'm demanding too much, giving time indicators - all this stuff I know, but get so caught up in the day-to-day you forget.

Hoping to get some data charts together later thus week, but going to get him to help me manage them, which he'll enjoy. Dd who is NT is getting her own charts too, as I just saw so much that would just help her develop.

So why don't you start a closed facebook with a weekly/monthly data day and links to resources that support that kind of teaching? You can be peer mentors!?

star that went way over my head at "FB closed group"

I'm starting simple with wall charts and traffic light system, once that's established I'll get him helping with the data entry onto excel. This is our first stab at anything formally ABA and by that I mean data tracking and analysis.
I'm keeping my toes safely in the 20th century initially before dragging my lardy arse into the 21st century

I don't mind setting up a closed FB group if people would like to support each other?

I'm happy to get some resources on there, also.

We could share our targets, our successes, our failures.

If anyone is interested in StarlightMcKenzie's awsome idea, tip me the nod

Frizz If Lougle started one you'd be able to figure it out easily. It really is a good way to share links on a topic. Yahoo groups are possible too but I find them a bit more fiddly.

Ok I'll have a look see

Now, into a more important point ...... Who's got the link for the site that sells the chicken clickers?

I can't remember the site I used but there is one here.

www.preciouslittleone.com/product-information/101/31369/plan-toys-chicken-clicker/?gclid=CMjxiOCd_74CFXPKtAodoxgAEg

When I ordered mine from other site I thought price was OTT but ordered anyway to discover they came in boxes of 6 (with no reference to that on the site). No idea if this site do the same.