Tinsley House Support Thread

[IndigoBell]

An awful lot of us are now doing Tinsley House, either by going there, or by following the recommendations in The Brain Food Plan

So this is just a general support (and hopefully good news) thread.

Stage 1 of the TH therapy consists of:

1. Multivitamins

• Omega
• Zinc & Magnesium
• Multivitamin

1. Healthy eating diet

• High protein, low sugar, no artificial sweeteners, additives etc.

1. Specific exercises done 3 times a day

Hello everyone, apologies for the long absence but it's nice to have caught up on all your good news about your dc
Indigo, seems you've been having a bit of a rough time on here lately. I for one, have always valued your 'cut the crap' attitude and your excellent advice but I guess not everyone can take it. On the positive side seems like your ds1 is more than ready for secondary school
Things chez pop have been a bit up and down (actually just down) with ds. Since starting vision therapy he had been very much more volatile and it became increasingly hard to get him to do his vt at all. No matter what the encouragement, bribes or threats, he was finding it impossible to comply.
Away from home over the easter hols we had no internet access, then my laptop which we run the vt on conked out so we had an enforced break from it while that was sorted.
We have kept up with the stair exercises, supplements and diet but ds' behaviour has deteriorated even further, probably due to his impending birthday (fortunately out of the way now), going back to school and getting used to a new teacher. However, we are now ready to have another try at vt (once we have another technical issue ironed out by HTS) but if anyone can give me some ideas of how to induce ds to do it properly I'd be very grateful!

Hi pop Sorry things have been so up and down...evidence your ds's right brain is starting to fire up maybe?

Ds1 knows that in the morning its no TV/dvds/playing til his VT is done. I am lucky in that he only has to do 6 mins per day now...but he still moans!!!

Is there something your ds would really like? I mean like a visit to a castle/museum/trip away/camping/whatever....I am a great believer in treats as bribery encouragement and praise

Ds1 blew me away last night...he was reading a book about WW1 (he is very into that subject atm) and he read it so well! It was Usbourne intro to WW1 and I was very impressed by his reading

I have had many appts over the past week...hospital, church AGM, PTA etc and he has been fine...bit clingy when I am leaving but fine.

I may be having a major op in the summer so am glad he is finally more independent/less anxious. One less thing to worry about!

Hi Pop

Nice to hear from you again. Sorry to hear your DS is not doing too well.

If the VT program is too long, maybe you could get Robin to put it on manual instead of auto, and instead of 20 mins he could give you just 5 mins?

Or you could the 20 mins in two lots of 10 mins instead?

You can't really force him to do it, can you. I mean you can force him o sit in front of the computer for X minutes. But you can't force him to put enough effort into it for it to be effective.

I very, very rarely bribe my kids. I don't like the concept. But I'm afraid I did have to bribe them to get them to do their VT. (they got a pound a week :) )

I guess you've tried all the normal stuff, no tv, no anything till you've done it.

Actually, with him being volatile, I think you should ring Robin and discuss it. Because I know for one MNer he replaced the stairs exercise with the chairs exercise because the child seemed to be getting worse not better.

Indigo, that is exactly what has been happening, we can make him sit in front of it but we can't make him put in enough effort for it to be effective. He only managed two stars in all the time we were doing it previously.
We've tried shortening the sequence and breaking it up into several even shorter sessions. We have tried treats and bribery but, as always, it's ineffective and just induces a meltdown because he can't have the reward, he doesn't give in.
I wonder if something more immediate like chocolate would work, it undermines the whole ethos of the diet but maybe might be worth it...?
I might try a choc button for each minute he concentrates properly and puts in proper effort, it might work [fingers crossed]
Becaroo, my ds loves the world wars as well!

I think a chocolate button for each exercise done with effort sounds sensible.

That means 3 mins of concentrating for one button. Surely that would motivate him enough :)

But yes, the button can't be dependent on him getting a star. It might take a while for his eyes to improve enough for him to be able to earn a star.

When are you going back to Robin? Must be soon.

I will have a go with choc buttons- I hope it works, I'm always reluctant to try these things cos often they backfire and make compliance even less likely, but he's not complying now so can't get much worse can it?
We were due to go back for our third appt but I delayed it to give us more time to work on the VT. Our appt now is 9th June.

I agree about being reluctant to bribe. I'd be very reluctant to give choc buttons for compliance :) And have never ever done so.

But - you've run out of other ideas. You've tried everything else. You have to do something.......

I'll tell you what I did at the beginning when it was hard and they were unhappy - I did the arrow key presses for them, and all they had to do was say or point 'left' and I would type. This made the task easier for them, and so helped to stop them feeling so overwhelmed.

Hi all
Just had to post to say about the difference in dd2.7 since I have started giving her zinc+mag again.
We are doing most of the diet part of TH but not started exercises yet as dd young+cant do the ones in book (will have to email TH but just happy with improvements so far)
I have been giving her omega since jan. I started giving her behaviour balance aswell for z+m but after hearing mixed reviews I stopped in mid march. However there was a big difference in her behaviour as she no longer sat to colour or do jigsaw and has spent most of the last month running, climbing or bouncing!
I started on floradix salundium last week and the diff in just a week is amazing. She is playing with toys again, and last night we played a game for ages it was lovely and this morn she brought the toy to me again to play. Also her eye contact has noticeably improved :))))

That sounds brilliant osospecial.

We are only 5 days into the vt but so far we have done a combination of bribing/treating/withholding screen time to get the sessions done.

Ds has tried to negotiate a £5 per week incentive to do the daily sessions , needless to say, I declined that suggestion

We discussed that it woud be a good idea to do the vt before he has time on his ps3/iPod which he thought was a good idea ... until the following day when he conveniently forgot!

Best incentives for ds are- promise of arranging tea dates, money, snacks (not necessarily bad ones but they are preferred by him!), extra reading time at bedtime and just telling him he has to do it with loads of hugs and cheering praise when he finishes!

I can see that we will have to add to and alter these as time goes on though.

Yesterday, he was mollified by me making dd do her reading homework whilst he did the vt!

Pop how long would your ds sit in front of the computer for without starting? i.e. is he more stubborn than you?

Thanks for all the great ideas folks, unfortunately I've got to shoot them down. We cannot really use any non immediate incentives as they generally induce a complete meltdown because we are controlling him. He will not give in, no matter what, although we always hold our ground 100%. Many times we have set up a a carrot and stick scenario- if you do this task you will get this treat, but if you don't there will be this negative consequence, we always see it through but still it doesn't work.

We haven't let him have a ds/wii/playstation because his behaviour is always terrible after he has played any at a friends house) and the TV doesn't motivate enough. Stuff like arranging play dates would not be immediate enough. That's why I thought of the choc buttons as they can be administered as he does the VT, but if it's got to be done every day it's a bit too much isn't it?

We are already doing the arrow key presses for him and have been since the start. He usually has to sit on our knees anyway cos can't keep still enough without close supervision.

He usually starts off OK but after just a few minutes his attention will fade and he'll start to squirm and groan and then he just stops paying attention while the program runs on, so he ends up with rubbish scores.

Have you got a trusted mum friend who you could get on board?

Arrange for a tea date but the friend only comes after ds has done the vt. If your ds does not do the session then his friend will not come for tea straight afterwards.

I guess you won't be able to do this everyday but could perhaps, as an alternative, also do a visit to the park to meet friends once the session has been completed.

I think your best option is choc button after each game, and with a short break between each game.

That way he only has to maintain attention for 3 - 7 minutes at once.....

A pack (or less) of choc buttons every day for 3 - 4 weeks won't hurt him...... I don't think it's too much.

I think a small immediate reward will work better than a bigger one which isn't immediate.

I think I'll get some fun size choc buttons and have a go with them. I can start off giving him plenty to get him into the habit and then reduce it down as he gets better at it. He doesn't normally have any sweets or choc so you're right it's not that bad.
If that doesn't work I will try the tea date arrangement, I have a mum friend who I'm sure would be able to help me (ds' best friend, he also has lots of spectrum type issues).
We still haven't got the technical issue ironed out (bit awkward to communicate with the time difference between HTS and us) but hopefully will be by mon/tues.

Ds has broken his vt glasses! Grr!

Anyone know whether we can use standard 3d ones with coloured lenses? Amazon have them for 39p, Robin wants £5 + p&p to send a new pair!

Bad evening last night but we still managed to ge the vt done and he as got 5 stars so far and seems pleased with that.

Fingers crossed Pop that your new strategies work.

hmm..I would get the ones Robin has tbh daft but it is annoying that the originals broke.

Ds1 saw Robin yesterday (I couldnt go as I am ill) and he was really pleased with his progress.

Ds1 now has 5 mins of "Where's Stig?" (instead of "Where's Wally?") and to keep on with the VT and the exercises.

Will be very interested to get Ds1's end of term report in 7 weeks time!

Did anyone else experience a deterioration in behaviour after starting vt?

Depends what you mean deterioration...ds1 is certainly more erm...obnoxious now...he often answers back now and walks off chuntering under his breath

Oh yes, I'd forgot.

Sometime after starting vision therapy was when their emotions started to change. DD started to feel (for the first time) anger and frustration. For the first time ever she got upset in class that she couldn't read.

Whereas DS started to feel the positive emotions.

DDs gradually learnt to control her new emotions and is no longer upset every day. In fact by now she is almost back to her old self.

And DS had facial tics for a fortnight.

So yes, I think you can expect different bits of their brain to be turned in which might initially cause deterioration.

Ds1 had brought home a higher reading level book again

His swimming teacher has also text me to say he is making such good progress that he is being moved into the next group/big pool

He also had...duh duh duh!!!!...hot dinners today at school! He said it was nice and is having it again on weds.

We are so delighted with ds1's progress since beginning TH.

That is so wonderful Becarooo. How exciting! I keep quoting all these changes to ds as he struggles with his BO on the vt (it seems to really make his eyes hurt!)

He has now broken the other arm off his glasses so the whole vt session is becoming a bit of a farce, with me holding the specs on him and counting down the minutes for him and screeching telling him not to do it randomly!!

Luckily he can see the improvement in his scores and the stars increasing. Roll on the time reducing though!!

The VT does hurt their eyes. It's making them uses muscles they've not used before.

But it only hurts their eyes while they're doing it. I think a couple of minutes afterwards they're fine.

It really is a muscle problem (not a vision problem), which is why exercising those muscles every day makes such a huge improvement.

My DS is still doing really well.

DD a bit less so. Her end of year test results have been lower then I was expecting / hoping.

We go back in 2 weeks. Really hope Robin knows what to do for DD.

Don't get me wrong. She's improved vastly, and is vastly better than at the beginning of the year. And is certainly progressing. But just not quite good enough for me to relax yet.

Whereas DS has made so much progress that I'm relaxed and happy about him, and not at all worried about him going up to secondary school next year.

daft Ds1 complained of his eyes "hurting" the first few times too...I think its like any muscle you are not used to exercising...when you start it aches for a time.

All I can say daft is that I wish I had done this with ds1 when he was the same age as your ds

Maybe my ds1 and your ds can have a competition??? Ds1 completed his stars in 32 days...can your ds better that?? As if so what treat will he get??

I am not "relaxed and happy" about ds1 yet but think I will be

Bec, I think your ds is younger than mine. My ds is 10.

We have managed to negotiate a weekly payment of £2 for doing his vt. This is to be paid after each round of 7 sessions. He originally wanted £1/day!! Money will also be reduced for not doing a session or for 'not trying'! I will see how he responds to your challenge .

Does the time for different tasks reduce once all the stars have been obtained?

Once you've completed the stars for a task, it get's removed from your daily session.

So that's how the time goes down.

But there are 2 new games which aren't in the original session list, which get added when you complete a different game.

When you've got all your stars, then you ring / email Robin, and he tells you what to do next. It seems to be normally one game for approx 5 minutes.

Ah, yes it's all coming back what Robin said. I knew I should have written it down! Thanks Indigo.