AIBU to be angry at school so early in...

[misskellyb]

My son is being assessed for autism and a strong possibility of ADHD (can't assess yet as he's too young).

He has a lot of sensory processing difficulties. One of these being toileting. He has just started reception at a small, one form school and is still in nappies. He is on daily laxatives and regularly soils. Therefore he is still in nappies. He will not toilet train. If he wears pants (and sometimes even when wearing nappies - if he's in uncomfortable environments) he will withhold his wee and poo up until the point of getting so unwell he requires enemas at hospital or ends up with severe stomach pains from not weeing. When he has pants on he has a tendency to poo his pants with the overflow of poo and requires changing of his clothes and pants regularly.

He had his first day in reception yesterday. He had his nappy changed once and was introduced to the toilet but showed no interest in following his peers and using it. I'm hoping in time he will be comfortable enough to start using a toilet at school. However today, when we got home I noticed his nappy was still in his bag and his nappy hadn't been changed and was full of wee and poo. I will be raising this with the school tomorrow.

He also struggles with transitions, one of these being transitions with clothing. For example on a morning he for some reason refuses to change out of his pyjamas and will meltdown to the point that some days he has to stay in pyjamas. He struggles going from season to season changing from summer clothing (shorts and short sleeved t shirts to jumpers and trousers and vice versa). As you know it's extremely hot and he was left in his school jumper all day at school today. I confronted the school when he walked out in a jumper and The school said they asked him to change out of his jumper but he said no, so he was left to play all day in a wooly jumper with a soiled, wet nappy( I was unaware of the nappy being unchanged at this time).

As he does have additional needs I've asked the teacher if they will feed back to me regularly how he is getting on as his speech is somewhat delayed. The teacher said that they have 30 other children so this isn't possible. AIBU to be abit annoyed about this? I acknowledge their high numbers of children however surely for SEN children they can find a way to prioritise feeding back to parents, weekly, fortnightly, monthly? She said no news is good news so if I hear nothing all is fine. But the news that my sons nappy wasn't changed today and the news that he wouldn't change out of his school jumper is surely news I should be made aware of and not having to find out for myself?

AIBU to be annoyed they left him in a dirty nappy all day? Especially in this heat! They have a duty of care and this is just neglect. He will be prone to infections if this carries on and possibly bullying if other children smell or notice the nappy. The school have had multiple meetings with me regarding his needs and his continence issues. I spoke the school on his first day yesterday to make sure the reception teachers were aware he needs his nappy changed and support around toileting and they assured me this is fine. They also have clinic letters from paediatricians and the continence team outlining that my son will need regular toilet breaks and support around toileting and changing.

I try everything at home to encourage toileting. But toileting issues have been his whole life. We've tried everything and I mean, everything. To the point where no more reward charts, sensory toys, or bribery will encourage him and it's just a waiting game for it to be on his terms but in the process I don't want him facing difficulties at school for this and personal hygiene issues.

You'd think second day in they'd be on the ball as well and I'm just worried this is the start of problems to come.

What if the staff just refuse? I'd point blank refuse to change nappies if I was them, it's disgusting.

Fair enough if they can employ someone who takes the job on knowingly but it's not part of a teacher's role and if it's going to be from now on then I would expect the recruitment for teachers to fall off a cliff even more than it has recently which will not help anyone.

Would you just do anything your employer asked of you? However disgusting and outside of your normal job role? Most wouldn't and it shouldn't be encouraged, it would only erode employee rights further.

I note that I have had some comments regarding sending him to school in his jumper knowing the weather forecast and his clothing difficulties. ALL children at the school gate were in their jumper, hence my sending him in, in a jumper. He's my first child and I'm new to the school set up, and assumed it is policy given he would have been the only child without his jumper. In the car he didn't have his jumper on because I know the difficulties of transitioning his clothing but I put him in it at the school gate which he followed after observing everyone else was in one. I've already decided tomorrow he's not wearing one at all, and I won't be packing one in his school bag to ensure he's not got a jumper on all day to eliminate this problem tomorrow.

I'm pleased to hear that. I thought one had to prove that one had done at least two rounds of the ADPR cycle before one could apply for an EHCP.

I agree with pp’s who suggest he really needs a 1:1 and actual support. There’s no way his needs can be absorbed by the normal teacher. Good luck I hope things improve xxx

That is incorrect as well, but many LAs would still say it’s necessary!

Way to make the OP, and anyone else with continence issues, feel great. No one thinks changing a soiled nappy is exactly enjoyable, but you don’t have to be rude and derogatory about it.

It was the LA who said these needs would be met in mainstream without an EHCP.

The school were aware of his needs before he started.

No, that is a myth often perpetuated by LAs and some schools. The threshold for an EHCNA is relatively low - a) has or may have SEN, and b) may need SEN provision to be made via an EHCP. Anything else e.g. 2+ cycles of APDR, 2+ years behind, spent £6k… is unlawful.

My friend has just advised you to join movicol mumies on fb apparently good support group, just passing it on

@hamsterchump

Also these are not toddlers, it must be awful when there are no proper facilities and it is in a classroom It's bad enough changing your own child

I would refuse

@misskellyb I made a comment about checking the weather on the day, because I know my DS could have an extreme meltdown if a staff member asked him to change. It’s not a criticism of you, I’m just passing on my experience that whatever the school, they are not going to adequately care for your son without you going in and having conversations beforehand, and a plan with them about how best to meet his needs.

Easier said than done I know, but the difference this proactive attitude makes is your son being OK in school or not. And the school won’t take the lead, you will have to. It’s so worth it though as a few really good, as others said ‘very assertive, calm insistent’ conversations with the Head, or Deputy Head with specialist needs support if they have one in the school is the first step. Insist on meeting them asap, bring in written down your sons needs, discuss how it is to be met and in my experience this has been really beneficial.

Thank you for this.

I appreciate the large numbers in schools and by no means underestimate the role of a teacher and the number of pupils. However, I feel like you say more can be done or at least inform me at the end of the day the difficulties during the day instead of telling me there is nothing to report.

Right, but you know him and KNOW he spends whole days in his pyjamas, so knew that the school would almost certainly be unable to get him out of his jumper, which would mean he had to spend all day in it. You’re then mad that’s what happened! It feels you were setting the school up to fail there.

Good that you won’t be doing it tomorrow though.

Thank you. A few have mentioned intimate care plan. This is helpful.

Just so you’re aware the OP is not asking you personally asking you to change her child’s nappy. She’s just asking that her child has an education like others-if you don’t believe that then there is no hope.

@Rudolphthefrog

But @hamsterchump is right: firstly that it is disgusting. And secondly that people shouldn't do something disgusting just because their employer asks them, if it's not expressly in their job description.

I would have got another member of staff to swiftly remove it from him. It’s not acceptable. My DS would have got quite violent is a member of staff did this. I know that your comment meant well - but for a lot of autistic kids esp any with PDA (avoidance) you really need understanding and a plan in place, and really do dress them appropriately in the morning.

Mainstream in these straitened times will be unable to meet this child's needs.

He needs to be in an alternative provision.

I'm sorry to hear about your plight. It would break my heart.

But realistically, the vast majority of primary schools struggle to provide the basics today, like ceilings that aren't in danger of collapse.

I'd stop trying to find ways to 'force' the school to find ways of accommodating your child's needs. I'd be engaging them in helping you to get a more appropriate provision for your child.

If you're working with children in the early years foundation stage, you can pretty much guarantee you will need to deal with toileting, accidents, and bodily fluids.
If changing nappies is so horrifying then I would suggest early years is not the right environment.

Do you not think that during the weeks/months/years it will take to get a special school placement (if it happens at all) the OP shouldn't expect the school to care for her child's basic needs as they are required to?

This just seems far too much yo expect from a mainstream school...all of it, the nappy changes and the diet thing, just all of it!

OP, start the ball rolling for an ehcp. Apply yourself using the ipsea website. The evidence you already have will be good grounding. Tell the school you are applying, ask the m about their intimate care policy, and discuss support. He should be having much more targeted care. They can also refer to early help which means diagnoses pathways might open up and specialist external teachers can observe in school, all good evidence for saying that mainstream might not be able to meet his needs.
The LA, by the way, are not your friend in this. Their aim is to keep kids in mainstream because it is cheaper. My DS was put through a terrible time in mainstream as they said he could cope. He could not and we won at tribunal to secure him an appropriate placement. You are your son's advocate now.

He can't write his name. Or even say his name. But he can count to ten and recite the alphabet, he can maintain eye contact and socialise, on his terms, in small settings. He doesn't seek out play with others but will play alongside others, if he feels like it. He doesn't imaginary play often but has some minimal abilities to do this for a short amount of time due to a short attention span. He has a lot of echolalia. He lines up toys, balances them and obsesses toys to stand up. Repetitively plays. Tip toe walks, flaps, eye stims and spins. Gets angry if he's not in control. Is possessive over his sisters toys and making sure his sister doesn't play with his toys. Can't follow instruction more than one step. Can ask some questions but doesn't understand the meaning of all he asks, it seems to be more 'learnt' phrases and he can't answer most questions. If I say what is the name of someone in your class he will just ignore me. If you say are you happy he could answer yes or no. So it's basic yes or no questions he can answer with some improvement or attempt to answer more in depth questions but is very behind for his age on being able to answer appropriately. He'll also have a lot of meltdowns after busy days, hence numerous chunks of out the playroom walls and a lot of impulsive behaviours such as throwing things and hitting. His sleep is poor. His impulsive behaviours can lead him to run in to busy roads during a meltdown or fixation, even though other times he's overly anxious or busy roads. There is no in between.

What's the alternative?