AIBU to be angry at school so early in...

[misskellyb]

My son is being assessed for autism and a strong possibility of ADHD (can't assess yet as he's too young).

He has a lot of sensory processing difficulties. One of these being toileting. He has just started reception at a small, one form school and is still in nappies. He is on daily laxatives and regularly soils. Therefore he is still in nappies. He will not toilet train. If he wears pants (and sometimes even when wearing nappies - if he's in uncomfortable environments) he will withhold his wee and poo up until the point of getting so unwell he requires enemas at hospital or ends up with severe stomach pains from not weeing. When he has pants on he has a tendency to poo his pants with the overflow of poo and requires changing of his clothes and pants regularly.

He had his first day in reception yesterday. He had his nappy changed once and was introduced to the toilet but showed no interest in following his peers and using it. I'm hoping in time he will be comfortable enough to start using a toilet at school. However today, when we got home I noticed his nappy was still in his bag and his nappy hadn't been changed and was full of wee and poo. I will be raising this with the school tomorrow.

He also struggles with transitions, one of these being transitions with clothing. For example on a morning he for some reason refuses to change out of his pyjamas and will meltdown to the point that some days he has to stay in pyjamas. He struggles going from season to season changing from summer clothing (shorts and short sleeved t shirts to jumpers and trousers and vice versa). As you know it's extremely hot and he was left in his school jumper all day at school today. I confronted the school when he walked out in a jumper and The school said they asked him to change out of his jumper but he said no, so he was left to play all day in a wooly jumper with a soiled, wet nappy( I was unaware of the nappy being unchanged at this time).

As he does have additional needs I've asked the teacher if they will feed back to me regularly how he is getting on as his speech is somewhat delayed. The teacher said that they have 30 other children so this isn't possible. AIBU to be abit annoyed about this? I acknowledge their high numbers of children however surely for SEN children they can find a way to prioritise feeding back to parents, weekly, fortnightly, monthly? She said no news is good news so if I hear nothing all is fine. But the news that my sons nappy wasn't changed today and the news that he wouldn't change out of his school jumper is surely news I should be made aware of and not having to find out for myself?

AIBU to be annoyed they left him in a dirty nappy all day? Especially in this heat! They have a duty of care and this is just neglect. He will be prone to infections if this carries on and possibly bullying if other children smell or notice the nappy. The school have had multiple meetings with me regarding his needs and his continence issues. I spoke the school on his first day yesterday to make sure the reception teachers were aware he needs his nappy changed and support around toileting and they assured me this is fine. They also have clinic letters from paediatricians and the continence team outlining that my son will need regular toilet breaks and support around toileting and changing.

I try everything at home to encourage toileting. But toileting issues have been his whole life. We've tried everything and I mean, everything. To the point where no more reward charts, sensory toys, or bribery will encourage him and it's just a waiting game for it to be on his terms but in the process I don't want him facing difficulties at school for this and personal hygiene issues.

You'd think second day in they'd be on the ball as well and I'm just worried this is the start of problems to come.

No that's not true. Legally it does not need to be two - no different to nursery. I looked into this when my son started school. It says in all the legislation school have to change, they can not refuse a child in nappies and only one member of staff is needed to change the nappy. Many schools prefer two for the reasons you have said, but legally it does not need to be two people.

OP this isn't right. Uts not fair on your son, not fair on that teacher who has 30 kids to look after and not fair on those 30 other kids if your son needs 121 and they don't get their teaching time properly. All around this just doesn't work, set upma meeting with school as his needs seem quite high and you need to fight to get an echp earlier,maybe the school could provide evidence earlier than the 2 terms they've said, otherwise they need to address this as its just going to get worse and at worse your son embarrassed if he stays soiled and leaks etc, kids can be cruel and it will have such a detrimental effect on him staying like this.

Some schools and settings have a two person policy, many don't as they don't have staffing for that. I've worked in several schools and none have had a 2 person policy. No one has got in trouble.

I've read more and if you can afford it, I would withdraw him, place him back in nursery and gather evidence for a EHCP for a place next year.

Op start keeping a diary of things now to collect evidence. Apply for an EHC needs assessment again and if the council say no appeal. They say no in the hope you will just go away.

OP apply for an EHCP now. You can do a parental request. You have been fobbed off continually. You don't need to have had two terms in school - my son has one and he doesn't start school for another year. We are currently appealing for a special needs place because we are sure our son won't manage in mainstream. The default response to any ehcp application is "no" - expect it and then move forward, appealing and fighting and complaining. Your poor son - this country is a fucking disgrace. I'm not blaming the teachers or you - it's the system that's broken - but you are right to be upset and right to expect more. The posters on this thread blaming you are ignorant and I can only envy them for it. Life is a constant, constant battle with a child with additional needs and there is zero support or help.

There's no 'let you send him'.
Mainstream school is where children go.
Mainstream schools are certainly expected to support this (relatively low) level of need.

"Don't think it's a teacher's job..."?! In Early Years, especially, it is good practice for the teacher to be doing the "dirty" jobs as well as TAs. I would have never dreamed of asking my TAs to do jobs I wouldn't have done myself, should the need arrive. This obviously isn't always plausible as the teacher will be prioritising teaching, but to say it "isn't a teacher's job" is ridiculous!

Hi @misskellyb , former Reception teacher (of 15 years) here. The nappy and jumper situation are both huge no-nos, and despite it being early days I would most certainly raise your concerns. Firstly with the class teacher, and if things don't improve then I would go to the ALENCo, then the deputy or head.

Reception is a HUGE deal for all children, never mind with SENeeds thrown in to the mix. Anything that can be done to make the transition as smooth as possible should be done. That will absolutely mean that some children need more 1-1 care than others - that's just the way life works.

Best of luck moving forward, and I hope your child has managed to enjoy some of their first week. X

With love, they’re not going to be able to meet his needs. Teachers are stretched enough, who is looking after the 29 other children when the teacher and TA are changing his nappy? It’s not in their remit. I’m sorry but he needs to be in a different setting.

Yes YABU to be angry at school. Schools can’t fund 1:1 out of their standard budget. Your child sounds like they need high levels of support at school and ultimately there are 30 children with 1 teacher and TA.

Your situation is not uncommon though. Lots of children start reception and it’s quickly realised a child needs support above the standard sen budget and the school can’t magic that up.

You are aware that your child has additional needs, but in that class there will probably be some children whose parents are not aware, some with English as a second language, some who just have not been taught basic skills, and 1 teacher and TA.

It is ok to be angry that your child is in this situation.

As others have said urgent meeting with SENCo. I would hope they would help you put another ehcp in. In the interim you need to know what plan they can put in place and then you need to decide if you are ok with that or you want to seek other alternatives (for example going to a reduced timetable).

Which setting?

This is so heartbreaking but I would not got in all guns blazing tomorrow at the same time. You need to advocate for your child to the best of your ability or find a professional to help you. Since you son is under 5 please speak to your health visitor as they can help you.

Also please watch Mummyoffour on YouTube on how the health visitor helped her apply for her kids Ehcp's. https://mummyoffour.com/autism/our-autism-story-asd-diagnosis-journey-uk-autism-early-signs-and-symptoms-mummy-of-four/

I don't think I've ever been on a residential where I've not had to give out movicol or laculose at bedtime to at least one child (and there are usually a handful in each class) but I've never taught a child who was on a high dose whilst they 'cleared out'. They've always stayed off school. If you are soiling half hourly, your learning is going to be incredibly disjointed if nothing else, I'd have thought.

It sounds like a specialist setting would be better for him going forward.

Don't listen to the bullshit about two terms of gathering evidence!

Contact IPSEA or SOS:SEN! for help with applying for and appealing the EHCP.

SOS: SEN! booklets on EHCPs and appeals are great and only £5 each.

I wouldn't bother with SENDIASS as they often tow the party line. They say they're independent but often they back the LA bullshit.

From a Mum with 5 tribunals and two EHCPs under my hat and two kids at specialist settings.

Some of the comments in this thread are incredibly ableist.

All the comments about specialist school are wild. My son didn't need to go to a specialist school because he had no learning disability or any other additional needs except he had a damaged bowl from a misdiagnosis and was toileting delayed. He needed extra support and cleaning in reception, and by year 1 he was in pants and mostly using the toilet.

School provided for his needs. All these "school can't possibly do this" comments are ridiculous because it is not true. Many primary schools do do this.

Disabled children have a right to education.

This is sound advice OP from someone who clearly knows how it all works!

We have had this in our school. Compounded by parents who don't feel their children belong in a special needs school.

TAs keep quitting; it's just not worth it for them, frankly: shit pay, little to no support, and being assaulted day in and day out and blamed if the child runs/gets hurt/etc. Can't blame them. It's not the right setting for them but there are no places in special schools and/or parents aren't open to it.

No, there doesn’t.

Show me the legislation that says there does…

I would say he's in the wrong setting. Do an EHCP- you apply yourself but get school involved and either get a 1:1 or even better mire to SEND school. Not teachers fault at all. Dont send him in with a jumper on.

It’s really not sound advice. SENDIASS are not helpful in many LAs because they repeat the LA’s unlawful policies, they may want 2 members of staff but it isn’t legally required and it is neglectful to leave a child soiled because 2 aren’t available, and there’s no reason a parental EHCNA request can’t be successfully made rather than a request from SENCO at some point in the future.

The school may have thought they had the staff when they told the op they could accommodate his needs.
Support staff can hand their notice in during the summer holidays leaving the school short for September.
121s and new starters sometimes leave within a week because the job they are being asked to do wasn't what they were led to believe.
Every day the HT is juggling staff.
With an EHCP a 121 should be employed but even then they aren't all sitting in a room waiting to be called to a job, at £10 per hour many potential support staff realise it's more lucrative to work in supermarkets. Good luck op maybe today was just a blip.

Seriously seriously pull him out of school delay his entry by a year and get an ehcp in place so he has the proper support and the school is funded to support him.

misery every day for you ,him and the school.

But is IS in this setting, and this setting should be doing everything in their power to ensure that his needs are met.

Leaving him in a soiled nappy, wearing a jumper in almost 30° heat is actually a safeguarding concern!

Ultimately - regardless of what needs to be taught - all children's basic needs should be met. If that meant the rest of the class sitting quietly whilst a TA changes a child's nappy, and the teacher stands at the back of the room observing both the class and the child being changed, then that is what should be happening.

There isn't a single parent who would be okay with their child sitting in their own excrement. Why should this child's parents be okay with it just because he is older and in mainstream education??!!

@2reefsin30knots i am so sorry OP but I think your expectations are very unrealistic.

I hope your son is ok.

My only suggestion is to try to communicate with the school without all this emotion you have (understandably) displayed in your opening post.

@ihadamarveloustime

No, it’s really not worth it. Also, even with the magic EHCP a 1-1 is not a guarantee. It’s a tough, hard, demanding job for very, very little pay. An EHCP which states a 1-1 is one thing, finding a 1-1 is another. It can be quite an isolating role too.