Co-sleeping support thread

[BertieBotts]

I thought I would start this thread - for all co-sleeping parents, by choice or necessity, a safe space to vent about things which annoy you about co-sleeping without being told "Put her in a cot/her own bed then!" - or to share nice things you like about co-sleeping like middle of the night cuddles. Or to come and vent about annoying comments people make. Or anything really

Safe co-sleeping guidelines

Anyway, off to cuddle up with DS now...

Hi nellyjane and other fellow co-sleepers

Ermm, actually haven't got round to reading the NCSS yet as have been a bit engrossed in the politics of breastfeeding and blw books! (and I keep falling asleep reading those in bed!).

I did read some pretty interesting articles on the kellymom website though. One of them talked about 'sleeping through' being a developmental issue...something all babies will do at some point ( just like all babies walk and talk eventually).

Have just borrowed a bed rail too as I kept having horrible visions of DS rolling out of bed in the night.

Oh and I don't wear a bra, but then I've never really been very leaky. DS does seem to be at the stage now where if I unlatch him because I think he's dozed off, he kind of bobs back on by himself.

Otherwise all things are good, apart from a rather sore back and shoulders (must book that massage!)

Just wanted to say, as I lie here in bed with DS (17mo) lying next to me fast asleep how much I love co-sleeping.

It makes me so sad listening to mum friends who clearly love their babies but feel that having them in bed is spoiling them/making a rod for their own back etc so feel obliged to do the whole, put them in their cot and leave the room thing. I know all parents have the right to make decisions for their children but so often mums seem to be doing this stuff against their own instincts because of what they have read or been told by relatives.

Random comment, I know, but I'm just feeling really happy listening to my DS snuffle in his sleep and sad for those babies/mums who don't experience this pleasure.

DS is 18 months. If I am feeling particularly patient then I just keep lying him down again and again and again - I let him feed or cuddle as much as he wants, but I don't let him stand up or crawl off the bed. This has taken up to 2 hours in the past If I'm not feeling patient and I can feel myself getting cross with him then I just bring him back downstairs and usually he's happy to potter around and I can just go on my laptop or watch something on telly. This is fine for the most part as I don't tend to do anything more exciting in the evenings anyway, but it means when he is in this phase I can't really have anyone round in the evenings (am a single parent). It also means that he makes a mess everywhere because I just leave him to it, which is not great

Then after a while either he gets whingey and I take this as a cue to try bedtime again, or he will climb into his pushchair (snuggly with cosytoes) and go to sleep by himself. Sometimes I'll put a DVD on for him to watch in the buggy as it seems to send him to sleep, bizarrely.

It just seems to go in cycles - his sleep is terrible for a few weeks, then it gets better, it's great for a few weeks, then goes terrible again. I am thinking of trying to note down when it is good and when it is bad, because I can't see a pattern to it at all at the moment other than that it is good for a while, then bad - it has been like this since he was born. He slept through (in with me) at 7 weeks!!

Chicadee I agree - it is sad that people feel they can't or shouldn't have their children in bed, it is so lovely (sleep problems aside!) I am thinking about moving DS into his own room soon but thinking about putting him straight into a full size single bed so I can go and snuggle up with him if I feel like it

Hi, I am new to co-sleeping - it is something we are considering for DS2, who is now 4 weeks old.

At the moment, he's in a hammock next to me, but I'm finding he will fall asleep on me, but then wake when put in hammock. Usually, he falls asleep on top of me and we both fall asleep. However, last night, DH woke up to find ds asleep behind him on the mattress and me sat upright, with my boob hanging out, fast asleep. I feel so guilty that I obviously 'dropped' ds onto mattress and its given me the wake up call to do this properly.

Can I ask some advice from hardened co-sleepers?

Given I didn't wake when ds rolled out of my arms last night, am I nuts to even consider this (am I too deep a sleeper?)

When I've tried feeding ds lying down, the milk runs out of his nose (like a steady stream, but more as and when he swallows). Anyone else had this?

How do you judge if your babies are too warm or cold?

I hope we can make co-sleeping work. Ds loves sleeping on me and I love the idea of the closeness.

any other hints / tips for a novice appreciated!!

Thanks

Chiccadee, that's a really interesting article about cc. I have seen it before and obviously took it into consideration before doing any sort of sleep training with my twins. But for me, cos it was twins, it was a toss-up between meeting their needs in the night and getting enough sleep to look after them properly in the day. Obviously this is not the place for a cc debate but just wanted to make it clear I don't advocate cc with young babies (which is why I am going to co-sleep!).

I agree that parents should be given all the necessary info on that tv programme before they start (which they probably won't ). Wouldn't it be great if they had elizabeth pantley on as one of their experts so parents could choose which system to use. And also of course, if they were encouraged to give co-sleeping a try!

Hi sheep, I have only limited experience of co-sleeping but I think it is more safe for you to lie down with the baby. Can you prop your bed up at the pillow end (a couple of books under the legs) so you are lying at an angle, so the milk doesn't come out of his nose? Just a suggestion, not sure if it will work!

No I don't think you are crazy for trying this - your baby is 4wo and you are probably exhausted. It is probably more dangerous to try to carry on feeding him while sitting up and running the risk of falling asleep during the feed. You might find after a few nights of feeding him lying down you are not so tired so don't sleep so soundly.

My DS used to feed then fall asleep on my chest, and if I tried to put him back in his cot anything less than 30 mins later, he would wake up. So perhaps if you do want to put him back in the hammock, just wait till he is in a deeper sleep. You could feed him sitting up, then lie down with him next to you in the bed for a while before putting him back in the hammock.

Please remember I am not an expert - I just did what I could to get through the first few months of BFing my twins. They survived ok but maybe more due to luck than good judgement

Hello you lot!

Yesterday my dd decided she wanted to sleepover at a friends place. As we were getting the children ready for bed I said that her friend could sleepover at our place anytime he wanted to too. His Mum (my friend) sturnly blurted out "No no! - I don't want him to because I think all this sleeping together thing you do is a bit weird! Don't you? I mean there is an intimacy about sleeping next to someone. It really isn't right with a child!"

• To be fair I think she had an image of us forcing her son to sleep in our bed which is completely alien to him while I was thinking of him and dd sleeping in the same room like they were doing at her house...

... BUT... WOW... SERIOUSLY!!!! - You really should have heard the panic in her voice!!! !!!

'tis the fear of the cult of co-sleeping waaaa haaaa haaa haaaa!!!! (evil laugh)!!!

P.S - sheep - When my dd was a baby we put her above the covers in her sleep bag to get her temperature right. Although I don't remember any milk through the nose action I do remember that we did used to sleep on a big towel because breastfeeding laying down is generally a lot a bit messier than sitting up!

Well, LeninGregg - my dd decided she no longer wanted to sleep at her friend's place on account of the spiderman duvet so the conversation quickly changed to us making our excuses and quickly slipping away!

I do live in Paris where people are relatively 1950s about child rearing and take great pleasure in making mountains out of molehills.

TBH - I think co-sleeping is probably as common here as anywhere else but admitting to it is another thing. I once told another friend who is pretty hippyish that we co-sleep he said "Wow!" Then gleefully giggled "...but I wouldn't tell anyone-else that...it really is rather a taboo here!"

ds1 whos 6 loves to jump into bed with us but ds2 whos 4 hates it and loves his own bed. both treated the same at bedtime and during the day. i love cuddles of ds1 during the night as it reminds me of when we spent so much time together

Wow, tea, how very rude of your friend! I'd be very insulted to be spoken to like that.

I'm gradually getting a bit mean and starting to restrict the amount dd2 feeds during the night. I have decided she isn't allowed to feed before 1am, as then I definitely get a clear evening. I think my next step will be pushing that forwards to 2 or maybe 3am, and so on. I'll have to summon up some reserves of energy and determination first though, as our first night of no feeding before 1am resulted in the most spectacular epic screaming. I think she's ok with it now though. It's hard, isn't it, when you know that actually it isn't necessary for them to feed but they have a different opinion? (She is 17mo btw, so I really don't think I'm being too harsh here)

thanks neenz, lenin and tea. the idea of being less tired is certainly an appealing one!

i'll try the towel trick. i'll keep trying, maybe as my supply establishes, he won't be getting milk flowing out of his nose!

one thing - if you're layering up more yourselves, do you then have to dress / undress for each feed? surely you have to sleep in buff? sorry if a stupid question

Neenz, really hope you don't think I was judging. Like you, I would like partcipants to have all the information first. Your idea of getting Elizabeth Pantley in as an expert is great but I'm not sure the slow persistent method would make for good TV ratings!

Hi Sheep, we didn't plan to co-sleep either, it just happened as the easiest way to get a decent night's sleep all round, while BFing. I didn 't know much about it initially and was surrounded by disapproving relatives but thankfully made contact with a LLL contact who directed me to their website for some positive reading and guidelines (which, I think, are pretty much the same as the ones posted by BB at the start of this thread) - www.llli.org/FAQ/cosleep.html

A few thoughts -

• if you intend to co-sleep for a while, you will need to think about making the bed safe once DS2 starts rolling etc. We moved to a mattress on the floor for a while although DS is now so agile and aware at 17mo that he is OK on a bed - others might need to be older though.

• personally, I did wear a nursing bra in bed for the first year, until DS began to drop most of his night feeds. Now he only has feeds before bed, at about 4 and then first thing so I don't bother any more.

• in the first months a towel under or over the sheet will save your mattress.

• although we co-sleep, we didn't actually share duvets/blankets much of the time when DS was little as he slept in a star formation. But, we have a super king size bed so it was possible for him to be in a gro-bag, next to me and DH under a duvet. When we did snuggle, I swapped the duvet for a blanket which DS and I shared while DH had the duvet on the other side. DS is older now and sometimes shares a duvet with me, sometimes uses his own - and occasionally choses to climb into his own bed!

• re falling asleep and 'dropping' your son - don't feel guilty! I did this too until - as other posters have suggested - we learnt to feed lying down. But, the main thing is that sleeping together in a bed is way, way safer than falling asleep together on a sofa or chair which can sometimes happen when mums BF but don't co-sleep (not out to criticise non co-sleepers btw).

Thanks Chiccadee - that's really helpful. We did our first night last night, and I feel like the night was less 'stressed' i.e. ds2 didn't cry very much at all. I felt also that he resettled so much quicker after each feed, he just fed himself to sleep (rather than me pacing the floors, rocking him).

He is a very windy baby, but I didn't wind him through the night - he was a bit 'grunty' for a while after each feed, but not distressed in any way (i.e. like the crying when I feed him sat up and then attempt to lie him down).

He also still poos a lot - pretty much with every feed, but hopefully that will become less frequent, so I don't need to wake him up too much.

Feeding lying down wasn't the easiest, it hurt a bit at times, so I will need to watch the latch to prevent soreness for me.

I did find however, that he woke up more - between about 3 and 7 this morning, he was waking up every hour - is it normal to wake more? I wonder if it is because I didn't properly wind him (I was trying my luck leaving that, as he was so sleepy after a feed).

Thanks for all of the advice and web links.

Am pretty much of the same mindset as Chiccadee here; co-sleeping wasn't a militant - or even conscious - thought. It was just so obvious that the children were happier in our bed and at 3am, when faced with the choice of a crying child or a sleeping child ... well, we just budged up a bit and made room for the little person!

I will say ... the relationship between DH and I has suffered a bit for it. There is definitely less sexual intimacy between us as a result. However, we're both getting a decent night's sleep as the children are happy (there's usually one in each bed) and I'm not constantly kicking him for snoring.

My other - very simplistic - pov is that we were mammals before we were Victorians . Mammals don't pop their young under a neighbouring tree to get a better night's sleep; they keep them close.

Re what to wear: I have found the H&M nursing vests to be invaluable for night feeding.

MEant conscious choice, not thought

We've been co sleeping with DD since she was born 11 weeks ago. In the hospital she yelled when they put her in the plastic tub/cot and she has slept by me ever since - it feels so natural and right! Saying that, I would like her in her own cot at some point!

I can't understand the reactions from some, especially mother in law!!! Why do some folk think it is so weird, or so wrong? If I was more sensitive, I could have found it quite upsetting! My baby seems happy, and that's what counts to me.

I LOVE this thread. I've been feeling so down about co-sleeping with DD, wondering if there's something 'wrong' with me, or her, because she wakes so often and stoicly refuses to sleep in the cot. It maks me feel so much better to know that this is the way some babies are, and that i shouldn't feel guilty for enjoying it, either.

I love waking up next to her, smelling her lovely little head and seeing her gummy grin as she wakes up too. It's almost worth the trade off with our sex life!

My only problem is, do you think babies wake up more when co-sleeping? I wonder if she would sleep better if we could get her into her own bed.

Willoughby - yes, that was how I felt when I was doing it the first time around, with DS. The people that knew seemed to ask for a weekly update: "Is he in his own cot yet, then?". Re the waking frequency: mmm. DS (who was in his cot from 5-11months - otherwise, we co-slept) didn't wake more, but DD definitely does. I lose count (as am asleep again within 30 seconds of making sure she's latched on), but I think she had about 10 mini feeds last night.

I suspect that feeding is the differentiating factor. DS stopped feeding at 9 months, so just needed a cuddle. DD wants a mini-snack as well. But lots of babies are still having dummies at her age, so I don't think it's that unusual. It's just that I'm the dummy (ain't that the truth).

AdiVic - it's all about parenting from the 50s! My mother claims to have been a very soft and responsive mother, but will happily chunter on about 'letting them cry it out' etc. She thinks I am both mad and a martyr .

I admit I only like co-sleeping in the early months because I love my sleep and when they are able to sleep through the night I like them in their own cot so they don't disturb me . But I don't think people who co-sleep with older babies are mad - I think the people who spend hours out of bed trying to feed/rock their babies to sleep in the middle of the night are the mad ones!