Support thread for those who were under the misguided illusion that their DC would sleep through by six mo - come and join!

[arthymum]

Did you assume that your DC would be sleeping through by the time they were 6 mo - and now you've hit the milestone you realise you were wrong, wrong, wrong as you stagger out of bed 1, 2, 3 times a night?

Do you sometimes can't help but wonder if you'd done things differently (BF/FF/stuck with the dreamfeed/co-slept/put them in their own cot/followed a GF routine/listened to your MIL ) you'd be getting more sleep?

Do you sometimes dread meeting up with other mums with perfect sleepers (especially when said babies are way younger and tinier than yours)?

Are you in a permanent state of confusion and doubt about whether to 'try' something or not (CC, ssh-patt, PUPD, NCSS etc.) but feel it's never the right time (teething, cold, too young) and not sure anyway whether you have the bottle/energy to see it through?

Do you hold out faint hopes that they'll sleep better when they're on solids/when the teeth come through/when they're another pound heavier/when they're in the new gro-bag/when they're on more solids - and each time - wrong again?

Do you mostly cope okay but every now and then feel tired and miserable and sorry for yourself and burst into tears at the postman or get into a petulant fight in Sainsbury's?

Do you secretly fear that you'll be on here in 3 years time, posting about the fact that you haven't slept for nearly 4 years?

Then come and join me! I've seen you lurking on other threads but feel that we need a place to congregate. Share your tears, tantrums, triumphs and tips - and hopefully one by one, we can all eventually disappear off the thread and into the land of nod....

Feral, sadly, I think MCs are quite common. Seems to be one of those things that happen to many, many women at some stage but are rarely talked about? Some stat I read said that 10-25% of all recognised pregnancies end in miscarriage. Very scary, especially as we're thinking of TTC in the new year.

Poor feralchild! I think rashes are quite a common byproduct of a virus, but good to take him to the doc.

I have tried a few of those 4 am feed strategies and it has never worked, so I guess no fear that my DS will go back to feeding at night! Good and bad points about that I guess....

Wow, that is a scary stat. We really are lucky aren't we? I suppose my mum had two kids + a MC, as did both my MiL and my SiL.

I reeeally want to start trying for DC2 soon but I am determined to have a year off with the next one and, being the main wage earner, I need to have worked for a while and saved some £££s before we start ttc. I'm in catch 22; I need a bigger wage - and therefore a promotion - but I don't want to have to work harder this year because I want to spend as much time as poss with DS!

BTW, you're right MoM, DS's rash is either because of a virus or as a reaction to the penicillin he was taking for his ear infection. He's bloody miserable and hasn't eaten all day, just wants to BF constantly. Methinks we might be in for a long night.

A couple of weeks ago my DS went back to having fully BF baby poop, like before he had started weaning at all. He just went totally off solids for ages (nearly a full week) - it was so sad because he is like the BLW poster boy! Eventually I knew he was feeling better because he stole some of my pizza and chocolate cupcake!

If your DS follows the same illness trajectory as mine, he was really grim for over a week after starting antibiotics (kept thinking he should have been better), then he got better for a couple of days, then he got another tooth .

FG oh poor you, how sad. I still miss my lovely family cat who died god, nearly 10 years ago now. Cats rock

Mom DD had something similar with the poo when she was ill and hardly eating anything! Bloody teeth eh? Also, I've found that antibiotics really upset DD's tummy - almost worse than the tonsilitis she had it for...

Hope Baby FG is better today. Sorry to hear about your friend and your cat too.

Update on the 'dad settling' experiment over at Sospan mansions... DS seemed to sleep less and cry more each night. After 3 nights DH was a broken man and DS was refusing to sleep at all in his cot . Last night we tried a slight change in tactics: I would dreamfeed at about 10.30 if DS hadn't woken, if he woke before 2.30 DH would settle him, if after I would feed him. I would then only feed him after 6.30, with DH doing any settling before then.

So I did a DF, he was awake (but not yowling) between about 1+2, didn't wake until 4, but I couldn't settle him so fed him at 4.30 then didn't wake until 7.

I'm sure we're doing it all wrong but it did seem like a more manageable night to me. Am knackered today though! Think we will try the same again tonight.

sospan, there is no wrong way to do it imho. If it works for you then it's all good.

For example, DS hasn't fed during the night since the beginning of September and we haven't co-slept for months but he'd eaten sweet FA all day yesterday and was feeling rotten so I fed him when he woke at 11pm. He woke again at 1.30 but wasn't really hungry - but still grizzled for an hour - and again at 4.00 when he was and refused to settle so I kicked DH out and DS came in with me and suckled himself to sleep.

He's eaten bugger all again today and I co-slept his 3 hour nap with him this morning and fed him to sleep this afternoon. He screams if I put him down or leave the room and, like MoM said, it's like having a newborn again.

I'm doing what is absolutely necessary to get by tbh and it is an absolute bloody nightmare. Tonight I'm going to do the same and I'll just have to go through the hell of re-training him out of night feeding when he's feeling better I suppose.

Ah, the greyness of exhaustion; it's all coming back to me. At least I feel like I definitely belong on this thread again

May I join? Been eyeing up this thread since DS was 3 months (now 8 months). He was a brilliant sleeper til 10 weeks when he had injections, a cold and I introduced a dummy - nightmare. He had been going 8/9 hours but suddenly started waking absolutely all the time.

At the moment still night feeding 4 hours apart and extra wakings but things have improved since I stopped picking him up at the extra wakes and started getting him to self settle.

Still - all wisdom and experience from others would be wonderful.

Oh Feral, my sleep deprived friend. Thursday night up for 1.5 hours at 2 am - not ideal, but figured it was teeth as he eventually settled with Calpol. Friday night virtually did not sleep between 12 and 5 am (he slept fitfully for 20 mins here and there, I did not sleep at all). Calpol and Calprofen no difference. Saturday night again the no sleep between 12 and 5. Sweet jesus I am losing my mind! He is clearly in some kind of discomfort, but worrying when even the pain meds don't help.

Like you, I went back to trying nursing to soothe him, but it didn't really work.

I am very much a card carrying member of this thread again!

Hi Dycey and other newbies. Sorry you have to join us!

Hello all,
Sorry if this has already been addressed earlier, but just have a few minutes while DH has taken DS out to shop.
7mo DS has never been a great sleeper, although we did have a couple of months from about 3-5mo when he only woke up twice in the night for feeds once he'd settled (which took about 45mins iirc). For the past couple of months, his sleeping has seemed to get gradually worse, and currently he seems to need 3 night feeds. He also wakes up 2 plus extra times when DH is able to rock him to sleep without me feeding him.
We are getting very tired. DS is teething at the mo, and our usually sunny baby has become very whingey particularly at the end of last week. I find that harder to cope with than the night-waking tbh. But DH and I are SO tired, and just keep disagreeing about what to do about it.
DH is now suggesting that we try controlled crying. I really, really don't feel like doing this, so have put in an order for the No-Cry Sleep Solution and the Sears Baby Sleep Book. I've also offered to try doing all the night wakings on nights when DH is going to be at home the next day. My position is that I think this is probably a phase that we just need to survive as best we can.
Anyways, my question is whether anybody knows whether controlled crying is even an option when the baby is still feeding at night (I'd estimate that DS might be getting as much as half of his 24hr intake of milk at night at the mo, as he is so distractable during the day)? My limited understanding of the technique suggests that this would not be compatible with 3 proper night feeds (20-25mins of proper sucking). Does anybody know?
TIA.

May I join as well?
DD is 21 weeks, and has never gone more than 4 hours at night. Normally she wakes every 2-3 hours; Not for anything in particular - no rooting for boobage, not too hot or cold,calpol of no use,just wakes up, has to get out of her cot for a look around and a cuddle. She is then awake at 6 am bright as a button and barely sleeps through the day (2x20 minute naps) I finally flipped last night and put her in the travel cot in the spare room, as she had woken every hour from 9-4am.
JUst feeling dazed and confused by it all - DS slept through from 12weeks, so this is a bit of a shocker

Isitmeor, hi and sorry you're having it so hard. FWIW, I did a wee bit of CC when my DS was about the same age as yours because I decided that feeding every 3 hours was not on so I cut him down to a dreamfeed and then another at 3.30ish. The feralbaby is very amenable to CC though, he's not the type to cry for longer than 20 mins unless he really means it and if he was proper crying then I'd go to him, so it was more a case of controlled grizzling iyswim.

Thing is, it just won't work if they're teething though and could your DS be doing a bit of separation anxiety as well do you think?

TBH, feralbaby was still pretty rubbish right up until he was 9mo and the dr told me to stop feeding him at night, so I did. By then I knew he was eating enough solids during the day (we're BLWing) and he was more confused by the lack of nocturnal boob than upset by it. It only took about four nights I think and, barring recent illness, he's slept through pretty reliably since.

You could maybe try giving your DS some big carby meals in the evening; does he like pasta? It makes a difference to feralbaby's sleep if he's full of starch and full fat dairy!

And CC certainly isn't the only way. Can you co-sleep? Stainesmassive has had great success sharing with her DS and I would still be co-sleeping too if DS didn't think that my bed was the ultimate playground!

You're right though, it's just a phase. These things shall pass, these things shall pass, these things shall pass. Repeat to fade...

PS, hi all other newbies. No wisdom really though Dycey, just 9 months' experience of broken sleep (and a glorious month of mostly sleeping through up until a fortnight ago!)

Hello all, may I join you? Have peeped before at this thread but have never really needed reassuring as I do now.....
Babe is 6 1/2 months and we've just returned from a wonderful holiday in Ibiza where for the last week she slept thru... Hooray for us all, it must have been due to us all being completely chilled.
She hasn't since we returned and I think there are three things going on. Firstly she is back in her own room so I have been sleeping in on the sofa bed, tho last night I took her into there with me. Second think top front teeth are coming, calpol soothed her for a time, topped up with a bit of gel and some powders. Thirdly very bad wind which wakes her up, I think due to all the new foods she's trying.
She hasn't really cried like she did last night since she was weeks old, so I feel very lucky after looking at some of the troubles some of you have, but she moans which is still very upsetting. Last night she woke at 10pm so I fed her, she slept for about 40mins so I went into her room and after a dose of calpol and a cuddle decided that sleeping with her was the nest option. I don't want to get into habits I can't get out of tho so how should I play it tonite, I naturally feel I will probably do the same but I hear nagging from some of peers that I should let her get on with it....

Hello all
Like many others, I've looked at this thread on and off since DD was 3 months, but hoped, hoped, hoped that I would not become a fully paid up member. But here we are, DD is nearly 7 months and it only seems to be getting worse! DH and I have not spent a full night together in months, he retires to the sofa on the first waking. DD was waking several times a night, but at least spending the night in her cot, but now shes in with me all night, waking 5-6 times, wants feeding every 2/2.5 hours and regularly just awake between 2-3/4. I'm shattered and beginning to lose my sense of humour. She has never slept through, I've not had a full night's sleep in 7 months. No more than 3 solid hours. of DH who is not in his own bed, but is at least asleep. I'm going back to work after Xmas, can't possibly use my brain if it goes on like this...
She's still in with us at the mo. I'm thinking it might be time to move her into her own room. And to try some kind of sleep training, although CC is definately out. But I just need some more sleep!!!
So good to know that there are others out there. All the mums round here seem to have babies who slept through the night from 4 weeks.

jollygreenmama - my sister's DS found co-sleeping very reassuring (my DS isn't bothered) and she has found it possible to co-sleep when he is ill / away from home / unsettled and then put him back in his cot and sleep next to him as the transition to putting him in his cot in his own room without much trouble. So I don't think co-sleeping for a while means you can't get back to separate sleeping.

Feralgirl - that's interesting that you stopped night feeds at nine months. I think I am planning to do the same (8 months now). Did your baby cry for a long time when you didn't feed? I am feeding him at 11 ish and 4 ish and otherwise he will wake and cry for a few minutes before going back to sleep.... I used to pick up and rock but after 2 weeks with DH away was so knackered I couldn't get out of bed to rock. In a much better place now I don't have to pick up. How did you drop the feeds? Was it cold turkey?

Thanks Feralgirl, and to see that others are in a similar boat. Last night was 7 wakes, (3 for me to feed, 4 for DH to rock to sleep), and as we seemed to guess correctly which was required each time, DS went back to sleep after each of the interventions. So DH and I have agreed this is what currently constitutes a "good" night.

DS still in his own cot - it was such a major achievement for DH and I to get back to sleeping together in our own bed at 3 months, I am really loathe to try co-sleeping, as DH will almost certainly decamp to the spare room. I also don't sleep too well with DS in the bed - I'm not sure why - and not entirely convinced he does either.

Sleep deprivation is just the worst, isn't it.

We have now got 3 new sleep books on their way to us - NCSS and the Sears Baby Sleep Book ordered by me, and the Ferber book ordered by DH. Is it any surprise that DH and I are disagreeing about what to try next .

Does anybody else feel as if they aren't on the same wavelength with their dc when going through this? By which I mean, I feel I just don't understand what he needs me to do? That probably makes me saddest of all . My rational brain suspects that this is a symptom of sleep-deprivation caused depression. Any thoughts?

Hey all. [rubs bleary eyes]. Have had three horrendous nights, with DD waking virtually every hour through the night. Have no idea what's going on - no obvious signs of illness, so perhaps teething but wouldn't daytime be affected to? Though having said that naps have turned into a total nightmare too. She just HOWLS at the top of her lungs, stands up in cot and won't lie down. Have no idea if I'm timing it all wrong but she's howlign now and she was clearly knackered - rubbing eyes, grizzling...

Kiwi - Very quickly...we had the exact same over the weekend. Beyond a joke. For two nights in a row literally did not sleep between 12 and 5. Would fall asleep and wake up 10 minutes later crying. Three nights was all it lasted so maybe you're through it?? The only thing I wondered was teeth (but had tried calpol and didn't help), cold (i.e. temperature because the nights are getting chilly and the heating goes off at 11), and/or overtired because he was pulling the same nap shenanigans as babyPanda.

Have been dressing him in a vest, sleepsuit and grobag now and also putting a blanket on when we go to bed. And he had a major nap catch up day on Sunday. He has slept through the last two nights again, fingers crossed.

Re: naps, she could either be overtired (maybe needs to go down a bit earlier due to dodgy nights and teeth?) or undertired and therefore fighting sleep? Or it could just be the way the wind is blowing this week!!!

at KiwiPanda. You could be describing my DS for naps. Only managed to have one today, although that was a surprisingly long hour and a quarter. Other than that, much howling, followed by failed attempts to feed to sleep. Fed to sleep okay, but woke up as soon as I tried to put him down. Then for next nap tried feeding lying down when he wouldn't settle, but that wasn't working (he just gazed around bedroom), so then back to normal feeding, at which point he dozed while sucking.

Have now resorted to CBeebies. I'm sure The Large Family isn't intended for 7mo, but he's watching it quietly while I mn and have a cup of tea and chocolate, so don't really care...

oh dear, loads of new recruits....welcome everyone, hope you don't have to stick around for long!

i have come up with a new coping strategy - it is acceptance. i refuse to worry that i am storing up trouble for the future, because i am coping ok right now (i have undoubtedly made this assertion several times on this thread) and i am just not paying attention to mil's face when i mention that ds has been in with me or woken in the night with teeth. we are okay. so ner.

having said that, i have switched off the baby monitor in my room, so if he stirs in the night it's got to get pretty loud for me to pick up on it. consequently i slept through from 11 to 7 on Sunday night and 11 to 5 last night (ds having gone right through from 7 to 5 - big cheers all round for stainesminor, hip hip, hooray!)

i am sure to regret posting this tomorrow when i report that he's woken four times tonight.

one final point for me to crow about today, when i picked him up from the childminder we were saying 'oh here's your mum, did you miss your mum' etc, and he said it! mum! with witnesses. i screamed and nearly cried.

i am such a gaylord.

Dysey, thanks for info on your Sis, I will carry on co-sleeping for the mo as at least we all get more sleep!

Stainesmassif, I hoe you do get another success tonight. I think the monitor idea is a great one for the future, i end up responding to little noises for hubby's sake so if we didn't hear them babe might go back to sleep by herself. Congrats on your first mum too!

Isitmeor, I think when you're that tired you worry even more about your 'performance' and get very defensive when asked what's happening by your partner. I have to remind myself that he cares about the situation just as much as I do hence the questions, it isn't a test!

Oh Staines that's lovely! I would have screamed / cried too - and no doubt will should DD ever say Mum..! I was reading a story to DD tonight and everytime I said "where's the panda DD?" she seemed to point/ whack the picture of the panda in the book. Could be coincidence but I'm chosing to think that she actually UNDERSTOOD me

Mom Must be separated at birth.. hope DD follows the pattern and sleeps ok tonight! I put her to bed a bit early cos I think you might be right about overtiredness, and she barely napped today

IsItMeOr I would TOTALLY resort to TV if DD would sit still.

She won't sit. Literally, will not do it. I know she CAN because she'll do it if she has to (i.e. balancing on something) but she never ever does it of her own accord. Do you think that's normal????

Bah - still knackered here too... Had 2 acceptable nights and then back to random wakings throughout the night. Am only doing dream feed + 1 other though, I don't care how much he cries (well, actually I do or I'd just leave him ). He went to sleep at 7.15 and has woken 3 times already, brilliant.

Anyway, Staines - hurrah for DS saying mum! How old is he? He sounds very clever. In fact, I am convinced that ALL the babies on here are very clever and that's why they don't sleep very well .

I have tried to force DS to watch tv on more than one occasion but he just won't have it. Kiwi - he's not much of a sitter either. He's just never still, you'd think it'd wear him out wouldn't you?? No chance.

Sigh, dreading tonight.

Sospan - on your theory - MIL had exactly the same theory when she was round yesterday .

DS threw up spectacularly all over me when I was giving him his bedtime feed - he was straining to produce a grape-sized poo at the time. Was a bit worried this would mean he wouldn't settle, but the little lamb conked out when I thought he was looking about. Our latest pet theory is that he can only settle on his left hand side if he has found his thumb, and on his right if he hasn't. I had got into the habit of always putting him down on his left side, so I tried putting him on his right tonight, and so far he is still asleep (he'd normally wake after about 10mins for DH to settle him).

Better go and get ready for bed as likely to be needed for first night feed any minute and somehow it feels better if I'm in my pjs so can crawl straight into bed afterwards.

Good luck everybody!