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Dummy and four month regression

111 replies

Dillybear · 17/06/2020 09:35

Hello, I’ve posted on here before about my daughter’s sleep and got some useful advice, so I’m back for more!

DD is now 17 weeks old and in the past few days I think we’ve entered the four month sleep regression. She’s started waking more frequently overnight wanting the dummy - I think it was roughly hourly wake ups last night from around midnight onwards.

I’ve worked hard with DD to get her to be able to go to sleep where she’s going to stay asleep. Now, for all sleep I put her down in her crib (a next to me one) and she has her dummy and goes to sleep with me lying next to her holding her hands or stroking her face. This is a huge improvement from being fed/rocked/bounced to sleep before being put down (only for her eyes to ping open again!). Her taking a dummy was a big part of us achieving this.

She is currently having three naps a day: 30-45m, 2.25h, and then 30-45m. I often have to resettle her after 30m of her lunchtime nap by replacing the dummy a couple of times but it’s clear she wants to sleep so it’s not difficult to resettle her. However, sometimes she stirs but doesn’t wake fully so I don’t need to do anything. Even from being two months old she has liked an early bedtime so she goes down somewhere around 7, depending on when her last nap ended/how tired she seems. Her awake time before bed is usually 2-2.5 hours (I aim for 2 to be on the safe side). She goes down to sleep contentedly, just some days she takes longer to actually fall asleep than others. She has a dreamfeed (though is taking half the quantity of what she was taking before) and then wakes once for a feed in the night. Sometimes she wakes around five but will settle back to sleep in my arms. Most days I then wake her up for the day around 7.15.

Although DD taking a dummy has improved her sleep significantly, which is great, my worry with it was always what would happen if she needed it replaced between every sleep cycle come the four month regression. I appreciate that popping the dummy back in her mouth is much less effort than having to get up to feed or rock her to sleep, however, waking up every hour is not ideal whichever way you look at it. I’m not sure if this will just resolve itself in a few weeks or whether the dummy is such a sleep prop that she won’t be able to link sleep cycles without it.

Does anyone know whether the regression can resolve itself? Or do I need to do some more work on sleep with DD - possibly to get rid of the dummy? If so - please tell me how as I genuinely don’t know how she’d sleep without it at this point.

Also, just out of interest, did anyone notice a change in the length of their child’s sleep cycles after or during the regression? Did you see nap lengths change etc? Probably due to the monotony of lockdown, I have been finding baby sleep quite interesting to learn about so I’m curious to know what I might see from DD to indicate that her sleep cycles have matured.

Thanks so much in advance.

OP posts:
Are your children’s vaccines up to date?
Dillybear · 29/06/2020 21:55

She has the dummy - I don’t think she’d know how to go to sleep without it. If it sounds like she needs more help is there anything I could or should be doing for her?

OP posts:
Jellyonaplate20 · 30/06/2020 07:30

I am in utter shock!! My baby slept soundly from 7pm till dream feed at 10, back down no problem at 1030 till 2am where he was a but restless for about 20 mins so I popped his dummy in. He fell back asleep till 4 when i fed then down at 430 till 630. I cant actually believe it. This NEVER happens. I'm convinced it's because I kept on top of his napping yesterday. Hes extra smiley today.

@BabySleepTeacherUK I didnt follow your advice as I only came back on here this morning but everything you are saying is true. Your like a mumsnet miracle. I've been following some other posts your on. Your either a professional baby whisperer or god!

Hope everyone had a restful night (ish) I'm not being smug because no doubt tonight will be a different ball game. X

Complex1950 · 30/06/2020 07:44

That’s really good news hope this is the start of something for you and your LO fingers crossed x

Jellyonaplate20 · 30/06/2020 08:05

How did your LO sleep x

Complex1950 · 30/06/2020 09:36

A little better got 3 hours I think lol x

Jellyonaplate20 · 30/06/2020 09:53

Oh god it's so awful isnt it. X

S082018 · 30/06/2020 14:53

@Jellyonaplate20 sounds like you had a great night. I hope it continues for you!

@Complex1950 about 8 weeks ago I was only ever getting 1.5-2hr stretches at a time. I thought it was never going to end. Things still aren't great but we are definitely getting longer stretches now.

Anyone's LO now rolling? I've noticed a huge difference since my son has learnt how to roll. He begins to get drowsy on his back, will fall onto his side then eventually roll onto his tummy and nod off. It's terrifying and I'm finding myself checking on him so much more now but he seems to be so comfortable finding his own position.

I also think a lot of his restlessness was him trying to learn how to roll and now I'm letting him sleep in the bed he has so much more room than in his next to me crib and since we have ditched the sleepyhead.

I haven't got him a cot yet as we are moving house so I never bothered to make up a nursery for him in this house so he will have to stay with me in bed until we move house and I can get his own nursery and cot sorted! We just haven't got the room for a cot for him in this house which is a shame as I think he would really take to the space well at the moment.

Complex1950 · 30/06/2020 14:57

Hey @S082018 my LO is 5 months old this week and hasn’t shown the slightest interest of rolling over I keep trying to encourage him but he’s just lazy .... and huge!!! He needs to start rolling and exercising soon otherwise he will turn into mr blobby he’s on 7 x 7oz in 24 hours now!! X

S082018 · 30/06/2020 16:57

@Complex1950 it'll happen eventually! One day he'll just master it and won't stop! Now I can't take my eyes off him.
I read lots on sleep disturbances also being linked to babies mastering a new skill... so rolling being one of them, then sitting and then standing and so on. And it just so happens we have had some progress since he's been rolling.

Today we have had a morning nap of 1.5 hours and an afternoon nap of almost 2 hours both in the bed! He did wake after 30 minutes but I really focused on resettling him. Just goes to show he clearly needs more than the 30 minute cat naps.

I wish my son took 7oz bottles! He was on 6-7oz at one point but he's ever so fussy at the moment (since his jabs) and he's back to having just 5oz bottles. So I'm trying to feed him little and often throughout the day to make sure he is getting what he needs.

Complex1950 · 01/07/2020 00:26

Looks like I’m in for another bad night he has woke up every half an hour since going to bed at 7pm he’s just thrashing around and lifting legs high in the air really unsettled. He’s had loads of naps today too so he’s definitely not overtired. Makes no sense.

Grandmi · 01/07/2020 00:37

My daughter just made the brave decision to get rid of the dummy at four months. The dummy was definitely causing so much sleep deprivation..every 40 mins baby was loosing dummy and daughter was up giving it back . Baby is now settling to sleep and sleeping for 5-6hours and less agitated!! She is now out of her sleepyhead and in her own cot in her own room .Happier Mum and happier baby ...it is worth the initial stress !!

Jellyonaplate20 · 01/07/2020 04:24

Well it was a one night only special.

Bed for 7pm, waking every 30 mins thrashing about, legs in air job lot! Finally settled around 9 ish.

Dream fed at 1030 then slept till 2ish solid which is good. Awake every 30 mins or so till 345 when I fed. Now I'm struggling to get him back on bed.

Changed his bum. As soon as nappy came off he weed through his baby gro, sleep bag mittens and through to our mattress. I'm led on a towel cause I cant be arsed to changed the bottom sheet. I dont even care. Judge away Confused

Honestly this is the hardest thing ever - I'm completely exhausted. I cant nap in the day cause he does 30 mins and wakes. I dont know what else to do x

Dillybear · 01/07/2020 09:07

Oh @Jellyonaplate20 I’m so sorry, that sounds horrendous! No judgment from me, having a baby has made me a lot more chilled out about bodily fluids in general! You just do what you need to do to survive.

It’s mad isn’t it how they give you a little bit of hope one night and then the next day it’s all gone to shit again. You know they can do it...

Last night here was a bit better. She’s been really off since having her injections (she had them a bit late because she wasn’t well), so I’ve been a bit worried about her feeding properly, but she seemed much more herself yesterday. She woke at 11 for a feed but her nappy had leaked so it was a full change which didn’t help her get back to sleep, but she was ‘only’ up for an hour. Then 3.30 and was settled pretty quickly after that one and up at 7. Much more what it used to be like - not great but survivable.

I never thought I’d consider it but I’m thinking that if she doesn’t start sleeping a little better by 6/7 months I may try controlled crying?? Don’t know if I’d be able to stick to it though, and I reckon if you can’t see it through it’s definitely not something to try. But some days I’m just so exhausted, it’s hard to see how it’s sustainable. Even if the wake ups didn’t reduce but it helped her settle after feeds more easily it would be a bloody godsend.

Anyone else thought about sleep training if things don’t improve?

OP posts:
Jellyonaplate20 · 01/07/2020 09:15

I would feed 2 or 3 times in the night if it meant he was settled all the other times in between. I'm sure he is teething too so not sure of that isnt helping. Hes been like this for weeks. Rosy cheek, anytime anything goes near his mouth he goes for it like aggressively. Constant chewing anything and drooling..oh the drooling. His gums dont look red though.

Also we used to dream feed when he was about 2 months but stopped because it never worked and hes so hard to wind when asleep so we packed it in.. last week we decided to reintroduce and I'm sure this coincides with extra wind hes been getting over the last few days. He was always windy as a baby but it settled down but now it's back. He strains loads and lifts his legs right up x

Jellyonaplate20 · 01/07/2020 09:16

I'm really not sure about the crying it out. I read somewhere that it tells baby that no matter how much you cry nobody will come and crying is just their way of communicating.

It breaks my heart x

S082018 · 01/07/2020 19:23

@Dillybear @Jellyonaplate20 I was adamant that I would never try any form of controlled crying but the other week I told hubby that if things don't get better by about 5.5ish months then I will give it a go. I really don't want to, but for my own sanity and to make sure that both baby and I are getting adequate rest, I did say I would consider it.

Having said that, I don't think we will need to go down that route any longer. Things are slowly improving and so I would much prefer to let nature take its course and have things improve themselves rather than put us through the pain of sleep training! Just tonight, my LO was falling asleep at his bottle (he has it downstairs). I burped him, took him upstairs in a drowsy state, not completely asleep.
Put him down, gave him a kiss and he rolled onto his side, then his tummy and closed his eyes 😭😭 he's never done this! I'm still laying next to him now just in case he wakes as he sometimes wakes after 30/40 minutes. Let's wait and see!

Jellyonaplate20 · 01/07/2020 19:39

I've had a god awful day today. I've been in years the majority of the day and questioning whether I have postnatal depression but then soon realised it's just lack of sleep. I was so desperate I rang a local sleep consultant for some help and cried to the poor woman on the phone.

I've been thinking - all his symptoms are similar to when he was diagnosed as having a milk allergy. Especially the lack of sleep and congestion etc.. the health visitor told us we need to reintroduce cows milk to see so we did and he was okay. So I'm wondering if it's coming back. I'm waiting for the doctor to call me tomorrow to seeing I can go back on the prescription milk to try. Either that or in just clutching st straws.

He has barely slept today - 3 times it took me to put him in his bed over the course of an hour. He finally went down and woke up exactly 25 mins later wide awake. I sent him to bed at 6pm to try and catch up on some sleep and so far I havent heard a peep so I'm off to bed myself.

Thanks for just being her ladies x

Complex1950 · 01/07/2020 19:57

Hope you have a better nights sleep tonight. I had the worst night yet last night I ended up bringing him into my bed just to sleep for a couple
Of hours which I have never done before and prob won’t do again as I was on edge but i was just so exhausted. I have felt physically sick all day and I know it’s tiredness . I reckon I had 4 hours sleep last night altogether broken into segments and this has been the case for numerous nights now for weeks . My LO has napped today but only for 30 mins each time and has had 3 naps but he’s gone to bed now and settled fine but I know come 10pm ish the waking will start. He just pops his dummy out and then starts whining and raises his legs right in the air then thuds them down and then raises again and then squirms tries to break out of his swaddle thrashes his head from sides to side then I pop his dummy and put my hand on his tummy and he goes to sleep for another 30 minutes then he wakes again and the cycle starts again. This I think is the 6th week of it and there has been no improvement to it and all that has happened is that I’ve ended up increasing his night feeds from 1 feed to 2 but it’s made no difference to his waking. I did contemplate putting him in his nursery tonight and letting him cry it out but I don’t think I would settle and I would feel enormous guilt. He’s 5 months old this Friday coming. I just feel I’m heading down a dark slippery slope I can’t see anyway out.

S082018 · 01/07/2020 19:58

@Jellyonaplate20 oh you poor thing. I really hope you get the answers you are looking for from the doctors. That would be something wouldn't it?

My LO woke up after 35 minutes just now screaming! I was here right next to him but just managed to settle him back down to sleep but on my chest. I think he was a bit overtired tonight which is why he fell asleep so quickly and with no fuss. I got my hopes up over nothing! Hopefully this should be him asleep now for a chunk of a few hours.

S082018 · 01/07/2020 20:05

@Complex1950 sleep deprivation really is the hardest thing. I've had some pretty dark days too where I've done nothing but cry. We are on week 8 of this now so it's been quite some time. Nobody ever really warns you about this bit do they? Or at least they never tell you that it can get this bad.

Your LO sounds just like mine did re the thrashing about and slamming the legs and the head from side to side thing. All I can say is that it does pass. I used to watch him and think what on earth are you doing?!?! And I thought it would never end. Then one night it just slowly calmed down and became less. He's still a fidgetbum don't get me wrong, but now it's a matter of him fidgeting to get comfy.

Honestly the only thing that's saved us and enabled us to get a bit more sleep is bed sharing. Something I always said I wouldn't do but it's amazing what you end up doing for sleep. Some sleep in the same bed together is better than no sleep at all. Sure it means that hubby and I sleep separately but it's not the end of the world and won't last forever. If done safely, bed sharing can be the best solution.

S082018 · 03/07/2020 19:57

How are you ladies getting on with your LO's?

BabyLlamaZen · 03/07/2020 20:01

The 4 month regression is horrible. If the dummy works then this is brilliant. Once she's over this one around 6/7 months you can look removing the dummy if you like. Honestly though, it's there for a reason. It's around 1 you need to start getting them off it.

Complex1950 · 03/07/2020 21:21

Crap night again last night was waking every hour from about 9pm tonight’s been no better I’ve been upstairs 3 times already. How about you ?

Dillybear · 04/07/2020 21:30

I didn’t realise there were more messages on this thread. Sorry things aren’t going well @Complex1950. But it’s good to hear that things are improving for you, @S082018.

I’ve been having not the best nights, not the worst. It’s taking ages for her to fall asleep and for all her naps today I’ve had to be right next to her to resettle her over and over. When she stirs in her sleep she doesn’t seem to want to be awake, she gets cross and upset and is thrashing, clearly trying to sleep. When she wants to be awake she cracks a big smile, as if she feels really happy and well-rested. But during the last couple of days, because she’s waking so frequently during her naps, even though they are long, she doesn’t seem to be getting very good quality sleep. She looks tired today, which is really sad.

I’m finding it hard because I just feel like I’ve done nothing in the past few days but try and help DD sleep. I’m losing hope that there’ll ever be an improvement, and all the babies in my NCT group appear to be sleeping so much better, it makes me feel like I’m failing my baby.

OP posts:
Complex1950 · 08/07/2020 06:58

Hi how’s everyone getting on ? I just found out I go back to work next month although only for. 2 days a week and I’m now panicking as we’re still waking every 30/40 minutes through the night. I don’t know how I’m going to get up and put the door for 8 am when I’ve been up every 40 mins through the night. So after lots of reading and note taking and speaking with a sleep training lady I’ve come to the conclusion that this isn’t going to resolve itself until my LO can locate his dummy and put it back in himself during the night as he’s created a sleep association with his dummy. But he’s got no chance of that at the moment as he has. I hand to mouth coordination he can pick things up but then drops them straight away or if he tried to put his dummy in he would hit his eye or something lol I’m exhausted I haven’t slept for more than a couple of hours now in over 2 months. I wish I’d never given him this stupid dummy Confused

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