Controlled crying yes or no?

[bigmamama]

Hi , so basically my LO is about to turn 6 months this week and is rapidly outgrowing his snuzpod.
My struggle I'm having right now is that after the bedtime routine and his last bottle he's struggling well I'm struggling to get him completely settled to put him down and leave him as he screams! I'm finding myself rocking him and shushing him until he's asleep in my arms n then laying him down and I really need to get out this routine as I don't want him to rely on it to get him to sleep. I also have 3 year old so it's just not practical every night. So as well as transitioning to the cot which is in his own room, do I start to leave him to attempt to self soothe and cry it out ? Or is that just really mean?! Iv tried to use the Ewan the sheep, white noise, swaddling him, patting him but nothing seems to work other than being rocked ! Please help ?!

We haven't done CC as haven't needed to, but we did do the stay and support method when she was about five months as I wanted to stop feeding to sleep. It took a couple of nights of grumbling and since then she has gone happily to bed for 7pm every single night. Literally, in six months time since 'sleep training' we have never had an evening where she hasn't gone to bed at bedtime and gone to sleep. Instead of the sometimes multiple episodes of whinging and crying when I tried to transfer her to cot when I thought she was asleep, she goes in her cot, babbles for a bit, and falls asleep within about 5-10 mins.

In some ways I'm very much an 'attachment parent' (although I dislike that phrase and some of the philosophy behind it) - she was breastfed, we've done some co-sleeping, I'm a SAHP for all intents and purposes (I do work but only when she's asleep). But sleep is the one thing I'm not willing to go without for months or years at a time.

The thing with CC is that if it's going to work, then it does within a few days, usually three or four at most. You aren't going to damage months of round-the-clock caring and love for your child, and continuing response to their emotional needs all through the day and night for the rest of their lives, by letting them cry for an hour or so for a couple of nights in row. That's just not how it works. Or we'd have a shitload of damaged second-borns who had been left to cry just out of necessity.

I also have massive issues with people who take the moral high ground about sleep-training (which doesn't necessarily mean CC, but people automatically jump to that), but then get in their cars and drive their children around when they're incredibly sleep-deprived and barely able to function.

Boobiliboobiliboo

A theory which is not supported by evidence is a belief. It's fine to parent according to your own beliefs, but it's pretty off IMO to try and use them to influence other people's parenting.

Another one who doesn't agree with cc here, however this article might give you some tips on how to more gently move away from rocking...

sarahockwell-smith.com/2018/03/06/how-to-stop-rocking-your-baby-to-sleep/

@bigmamama you didn't make a rod for your own back. You got a kid who doesn't sleep well and nothing you could have done would have made it better. 3 is still very little and it's quite usual for them to still need mum at that age (although very annoying and tiring for you).

My first needed rocking my second will sleep anywhere at anytime with minimal input.

I'd focus on getting the three year old happy and settled enough to sleep though the night and give the baby what they need which is mummy.

Personally CC isn’t something that I would ever consider (although I do appreciate there is a huge difference between Controlled Crying and ‘crying it out’), but if you are going to sleep train then I would first get him moved into his own room first so he gets used to that being his new place to sleep, then if evenings are still difficult for you then to sleep train once he’s been in his own room for a couple of weeks should you wish to do so.

Hi OP we started sleep training our daughter (6months) just over a week ago. It got to the stage she needed cuddling and rocking to sleep, which resulted in her waking more frequently in the night because she wanted/needed to be rocked back to sleep 😩 sometimes this would happen 5/8 times a night.
So we ditched the dummy, the sleepyhead and went down the controlled crying route. However going in at different intervals made her a lot worse. So I had to leave her..and now she self settled with little or no crying. In the night she coos or babbles herself back to sleep and only cries if she needs something .. like tonight she pooed 🙈 so changed her but gave her a feed as well led her back down thinking she would cry/scream like before and nothing just cood away for 10mins now asleep...hope it lasts tho lol
Do what you need to for your family ... however the crying this first few days/week is brutal but don't cave if your doing it they learn quickly that you'll come back again etc!

A massive no... Unicefs recent findings don't recommend it and even the NHS has been handing out leaflets saying you shouldn't let them cry to sleep. More research is being done and it can be quite harmful as when they are left to cry (even CC) their cortisol levels go up and can affect thier development. They eventually stop crying because they realise no one is going to help them, making them self settle is a ridiculous myth and can actually do damage.

I always think of that NSPCC advert of the child being left to cry in their cot and they stop because they realise there's no point. It's heartbreaking.

I wouldn't let my partner or parents cry themselves to sleep or withhold comfort so I definitely wouldn't do it with my child.

Can you share a link to the unicef findings please @2020vision10?

@2020vision10 I'd also be intrigued to read this please

I will pop this up as it is relatively recent, from the Journal of Paediatrics 2016 :
pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2016/05/21/peds.2015-1486
“CONCLUSIONS: Both graduated extinction and bedtime fading provide significant sleep benefits above control, yet convey no adverse stress responses or long-term effects on parent-child attachment or child emotions and behavior.”

Babies are inconvenient aren't they! But don't leave a 6 month old to cry.

Every baby - and mother - is different. My first would not sleep and controlled crying would not work. My second slept through after a very short and painless bit of controlled crying at the beginning. She loved her bed after that! But other mums I know have had it the other way round with a sleeper then a non-sleeper, which has been a real shock to the system.

Very interesting Geneva, thank you

www.basisonline.org.uk/sleep-training-research/ a review of the research

It's on the safe sleep website from Unicef. It's a pdf of slides, can't post it as link but easily found on Google. It's also mentioned on their advice to health professionals pdf not to recommend letting your baby cry.

BASIS as mentioned above also has some interesting research.

Briefly mentioned on this short document but there's a more in depth one regarding research on their website.

I did CC with my son at around that age to stop the rocking association. I was spending longer and longer each night to get him to sleep and every time he woke we would be back to square one. I was exhausted (and so was he!).

The first three nights he cried and then after that it was more fussing and grumbling which the HV told me was normal. He slept 7.30-7 after that. We could hear him awake in the night as he was in our room but he would settle himself back to sleep, bar the odd time he couldn't find his dummy.

I liked the website Precious Little Sleep for tips and guidance. The main thing is consistency and getting a good wee bedtime routine going. I get that it's not for everyone but I have a family of sleep monsters and we really need our sleep so it was important to me to help my wee one establish good sleep habits. Do whatever works for you and your family xx

2020vision10 a bit disingenuous - this document has controlled crying as a no no for young babies, who are still is Moses baskets. Most people on here who tried controlled crying did so from 6 months upwards.

This is always going to be an emotive topic. We hired a sleep consultant at 12 months and with support and a plan did controlled crying. I couldn't and wouldn't have done it at 6 months but after 4 nights it worked amazingly for us and we went from 3 hours of tears every bedtime to instantly asleep with no tears.

At 6 months I wouldn't have felt comfortable knowing that something wasn't wrong and I would still feed in the night at this age personally.

I also couldn't have done it without support and a very clear understanding of the timings and what to do - it isn't just leaving a baby to cry.

Re studies the one we were directed towards is explained here on NHS website

www.nhs.uk/news/pregnancy-and-child/controlled-crying-safe-for-babies/

As said before... That's just one tiny bit on a document
There's a much larger one with study information etc.

NHS have recently been handing out leaflets and there's information on them saying leaving them to cry is not recommended, this was for babies and toddlers. If I can find a pdf version I'll post it... The link above is old and NHS are notorious for not updating their website.

The OP asked a question, we are all simply answering with our opinions and research we've seen. For and against. Isn't considering all information important?

I'm not trying to shut down what you're saying I'm just going off the advice I was given. It was actually on Trust Me I'm a Doctor last week if anyone saw it? They were in support of the method again i think.

Controlled crying and cry it out are different things

The challenge we had was our baby would cry in the evenings whatever we did because he was frustrated he wasn't asleep. I was breastfeeding for 3 hours as he cried every time I stopped and cried when we picked him up. So doing 4 nights of controlled crying in order to help him get to sleep himself worked for us. I don't know what else I could have done.

Yes I'm aware of that programme and that a lot of health professionals have complained as the Dr gave outdated information not only on that but on bedsharing too. They are yet to hear from the BBC.