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Original poster

Misery Loves Company...nope. Still not sleeping.

502 replies

ElphabaTheGreen · 13/02/2015 14:32

Long-term sleep deprivation getting you down?

Join us here for Brew Brew Brew and plenty of sympathy.

Ride the mo-fo out or something must be done - the choice is yours.

And remember the First Rule of Sleep Club - do not mention that things are going well or you will PAY.

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Original poster
ElphabaTheGreen · 21/02/2015 06:28

4:40am start today. This child has a crap sleep bucket list he's trying to tick off before Ann clones him, I'm sure of it Hmm

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AttitudeOfGratitude · 21/02/2015 08:00

4:50 here again too, third time this week. And he was definitely still tired. They are all in cahoots!

Ruralrunner · 21/02/2015 08:19

Bleurgh - lots of wakes and v messy crap-a-geddon nappy change in the middle of the night. Gave up at 0520 and brought him into bed with us! Stupid snuffly cold. Stupid tummy bug. Still, no puke, so that's a bonus.
And also - drooling everywhere, red cheeks, pulling ears but NO FREAKING TEETH. Where are the buggers hiding?!
Hope everyone manages a wee nap today to catch up on some zzzs.

scottygirl5 · 21/02/2015 08:24

rural hi! . Bagpipes?! You're very tolerant, I'd have binned them!!

DD actually made it till 6 this morning, but then she had woken 11 times last night Shock. However it actually wasn't that bad a night as she went back to sleep quickly each time. See, I'm looking for the silver lining

Have a quick weaning question for you ladies, don't want to ask on the weaning board for risk of getting flamed and because it relates to sleep. DD will be 6 months on the 1st of march, so a week tomorrow. I'd wanted to do baby led weaning and was just going to wait till she was 6 months exactly but we're meant to be keeping a sleep diary for Ann the first week of march so don't really want to start the two at exactly the same time in case weaning impacts on sleep and becomes a confounding variable. Do you think I could start today and still do blw? Would I have to sterilise things for a week? Stick to fruit and vegetables? Any advice appreciated!

scottygirl5 · 21/02/2015 08:26

Oh and yay lion/hear/lentils!

AttitudeOfGratitude · 21/02/2015 08:36

scotty I'm no expert but I can't see that a week makes much of a difference, if it was a month it would be different. The one thing that might put me off is if she was born particularly early vs her due date? Having said that I weaned Ds at 6 months and he was about 10 days early (elcs). It took him a couple of weeks before he was particularly keen on it though and didn't eat much to start with. We did purées and I didn't sterilise anything.

timeforsleepnow · 21/02/2015 09:51

Scotty - I also wouldn't start weaning and sleep logging at the same time. DD's sleep got much worse on weaning (sorry!) as it made her windy. I agree that a week makes no difference to weaning. We started at 25weeks as she was definitely ready. I haven't sterilised anything (you can't sterilise the food so there's no point!).
I would do the sleep log now and then start weaning after that, I know that makes you do the sleep log a week early, maybe that isn't allowed! But it took about a month for DD to settle back into her bad sleeping from the atrocious patch we had on starting weaning. Hmm

AttitudeOfGratitude · 21/02/2015 09:56

scotty maybe email Ann and see what she suggests re timing of the diary? She's responded quickly to each email I've sent her.

Original poster
ElphabaTheGreen · 21/02/2015 10:03

scotty Starting BLW the week you start with Ann will make no difference. If it does, I'll eat my hat. Did you do BLW the first time around? I've done it with both of mine (very reluctantly - I hate it, but they were/are spoon refusers). DS1 ingested nothing in any significant quantity until he was 10 or 11 months old and DS2, as in everything, looks like he's headed the same way as his brother. I don't think many babies ingest very much at all for several weeks/months with BLW, hence it's highly, highly unlikely it will make the slightest difference to sleep.

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scottygirl5 · 21/02/2015 10:44

It was Ann who suggested not doing them at the same time. DD was 6 days late so I think I might go for it, can always just let Ann know if/what changes there have been. Find it a bit exciting! Did mixed feeding with DD1 who ate pretty well but will see what DD2 makes of it! Would you reckon I could do dairy and gluten too?

scottygirl5 · 21/02/2015 10:46

Oh, and tap water?

ChocolateIsMySleep · 21/02/2015 14:04

Hear/Lions, that's amazing! Well done your DD!

Rural - bagpipes?! DD1 was a horribly light napper and I've been known to actually snarl at innocent post men for ringing the doorbell (although some of them ring it twice the stupid fuckers so deserve everything they get).

Scotty, both mine were/are BLW. I started when they pretty much grabbed food out of my hand and ate it. Think both of them were around 25 weeks but sitting up in a high chair with good hand/mouth coordination. If you read the book, she says to be guided by your baby and their physical development rather than strictly by age so some will be ready sooner and some later. Both mine were keen on food from the start and DD2 demolished a whole bowlful of cheesy pasta at 6.5 months! Sadly made bugger all difference to sleeping!

Looking forward to some Ann cloning happening soon! Tips gratefully received, I'm a bit lost with DD2 who currently seems to be on an "every other night" plan. So one night she wakes every 1 - 2 hours and insists that I sit by her cot for at least 30 minutes and often an hour or two. The next night she cheerfully sleeps at least 11-4 and sometimes even 8-4.30. Its certainly been a lot worse but its still bloody annoying that she clearly can sleep through so WHY won't she?!!!

scottygirl5 · 21/02/2015 15:01

chocolate I feel your pain, before DD2 became the 'up 11 times a night' sleep thief she used to do between 5-8 hour stretches at a time so I know she can do it, she just won't!

LionsDontWeaveLentils · 21/02/2015 18:58

We did blw with dd and I thought it was ace. It meant I got to actually sit and eat lunch, sometimes with both hands, as dd was distracted by exciting food. My understanding is that if your DC can feed themselves (pick up food, put it in mouth, swallow) then that indicates that they are physically ready to be able to digest it. So if you do blw properly you can't actually start early because if they aren't ready they won't eat. At least that's what the book says, could be complete tosh for all I know. Sounds good though...

Dd's sleep did go even more horrendous when she started eating, but that was because she was directly ingesting the food she was intolerant to rather then just getting it through my milk. It did make it easier to spot what was causing the issue. Once we worked out the culprit things improved quite a bit.

Dd was back to business as usual last night and in our bed by 11pm. Normal service has resumed. As you were, nothing to see here Grin

Original poster
ElphabaTheGreen · 21/02/2015 21:05

Both mine pick up food, put in mouth, gag, often puke, smear, chuck on floor, repeat. Look horrified with mouth hanging open if I sneak a spoon of something in there, spit it out. Return to making an unholy mess. This went on with DS1 for months on end (while getting daily reports from nursery that he was eating everything he gave them Off. A fucking. Spoon Angry) so I fully anticipate exactly the same tedious and messy trajectory with DS2.

Hate it. Hate bloody weaning. Hate it. And DS1 is still a shit eater, despite BLW virtually promising to turn him into a gourmand. Christmas day, he ate a chocolate Santa over the course of three hours, chewed and spat out a roast potato, gnawed on, but did not ingest, a piece of turkey, and said, 'dis-CUS-tin!' to the sprouts. Nothing else. Hmm

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Triffeny · 21/02/2015 22:29

Hello, am new. Have a 15 month old who doesn't sleep, we co-sleep and I bf throughout night - a good one is 3 times, but can easily be up to 10. Worse night I stopped counting after 15.

Just wondering who is Ann? Does she have a magic solution??

LionsDontWeaveLentils · 22/02/2015 07:20

I think eating is like sleeping. You get lucky and get DC who does it easily or you don't. People who think their amazing parenting skills are the reason their DC eat everything are deluded. I'm really lucky with dd, she is a great eater. Self regulates really well, loves fruit and veg. Not my doing or anything to do with blw, just luck IMHO.

Welcome to the club triff. Ann is a sleep consultant some people on here have used and had good/magical results with.

Original poster
ElphabaTheGreen · 22/02/2015 07:20

Hi Triffeny. Ann is a sleep consultant who uses rather different strategies to other consultants. She calls it her emotional wellbeing approach. She doesn't promise no-cry (we certainly had some rage from DS1, but a lot less than I expected) but it's far more holistic and supportive than gradual withdrawal on its own leading to more long-term results. Can't go into any details here about what her magic is, but there's a reason I'm going straight to her again (apart from having another non-sleeping horror, that is...Hmm)

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RaspberryBlonde · 22/02/2015 07:21

I also didn't find that weaning made any difference to sleep. We also BLW here, and like Lions I found the great benefit was actually getting to eat my own meals at roughly the right kind of time. Can't say I found it fun as such though, I felt like I spent all my spare time cleaning the kitchen for months! And having seen how friends' babies are with food I've come to the conclusion that like sleep, good eaters are born not made

One way that weaning did effect sleep was that it totally removed any semblance of a routine we had, especially for naps as i was constantly feeding either milk or solids. Definitely start just offering food just once a day.

Bit concerned we have a vomiting bug here as DD was very sick twice yesterday. Fortunately ok overnight and seems to be keeping milk down but has made a big hole in the sleep debt that I was finally paying down after a few better nights!

Welcome triffeny, your DC is a similar age to mine. Others will tell you more about Ann, but she is a miracle working sleep consultant by all accounts.

scottygirl5 · 22/02/2015 08:13

Hi triff, welcome.

Well we had a, by our standards, great night last night, 5 wake ups, in her own bed till 4 and up for the day at 530, I actually do feel better for it!

Well DD gnawed a bit of banana and two bits of cheesy pasta yesterday, had some strawberry and bread this morning, she's been grabbing for our food for a couple of weeks so it was lovely to let her get hold of it. But man alive I had forgotten how hard banana is to hold for a baby! She found it so frustrating and it just got mashed all over the place!

Agree about eating being random, also DD1 took to it enthusiastically and ate pretty much anything till she was about 18 months but had become progressively more picky since and at 3.5 refuses anything other than pasta for dinner Confused.

raspberry hope the sick was a one off and not a bug.

Original poster
ElphabaTheGreen · 22/02/2015 08:17

Do you know the banana trick, scotty?

Bite/cut off the pointy end. Push your little finger right down the middle - banana will separate into three baby-fist-sized strips which are much easier for them to handle.

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Triffeny · 22/02/2015 08:17

Thanks, I will look into that! Never thought of a sleep consultant although we did a babycalm sleep workshop when she was about 6 months old, which essentially advocated co-sleeping and breastfeeding. Which I still do - and want her in her own cot/room, but the level of exhaustion is so extreme I haven't the energy to start trying, she kicks off when husband has a go at settling her. Often feel it will never end...

ipswichwitch · 22/02/2015 08:34

Hello! Can I join in too? We have had crap sleep for 3 years. DS1 had sleep apnoea and woke many many times every night screaming hysterically when his breathing would stop, so he had his tonsils out which cured the apnoea but he still wakes many many times. Sometimes screaming, sometimes not. He also sleep walks and has night terrors. He's now on melatonin which is frankly doing bugger all really.

Then there's 14mo DS2 who we had hope for until he hit 4mo and it all went to pot. He kept increasing bf through the night, which we've not gone down to just once at bedtime, but now he seems to be teething (for the last 2 months!) and he's up and down from bedtime til 11, then awake and screeching through the night. I give up and bring him to our bed because I'm in serious danger if falling downstairs and breaking my neck.

I need an Anne. Or possibly choloroform. And a sod off to the people on the "my baby sleeps too much" thread. Seriously, they have no idea.

RaspberryBlonde · 22/02/2015 08:43

Definitely some kind of bug scotty Sad, she woke at 7, had a feed and then fell asleep again and is still sleeping, not like her at all. No more throwing up yet, thankfully.

triff, my DD also hated my DH doing bedtime, we found that getting him to do some naps when he was home helped. She still prefers me but will settle for him occasionally.

Lilipot15 · 22/02/2015 10:07

Hello, I'd like to join please, have lurked for a while. From sheer exhaustion of random night wakings I have ended up with a 1 year old who wakes and won't settle until in our bed with a bottle, and can be awake for hours at a time. Terraced house and husband working long hours with long drive.
I'm struggling as I'm pregnant and about to return to work and can't see a way forward....except I wanted to ask about recommendations for Ann. Which package have those of you with success stories used?
Also, we are moving house in the next few months, plus obviously a new baby coming into the picture, so sometimes I think I should carry on taking the path of least resistance as life is going to be topsy-turvy to say the least - is this something Ann would have an email discussion about before starting work, ie. might she recommend deferring? I guess she may have a waiting list anyway.
Haven't tried health visitor yet as any sort of leaving to cry results in a red, sweating, shuddering baby who needs soothing down and I can't come to terms with that being a healthy option....but then a mother who is exhausted to the point of tears and clumsiness isn't great either!