the no-cry sleep solution

[iris66]

has anyone tried it? (book by Elizabeth Pantley) I'm on day 2 & looking for a bit of support as I know it's going to take time. I'm dying through sleep depravation with 8mth DS who bfs to sleep but is very very tricky to move so have been cosleeping whilst he fidgets & kicks all night(and power naps during the day)
Think this is the last chance saloon before ear plugs & leaving him to get hysterical (even though I know that won't happen - i just couldn't, he really does do the whole temper, then sad then hysteria/shaking/terror/I've been abandoned thing - even if DH goes to him - such a mummy's boy)
Anyway, please post if you've been successful with this [hopeful emoticon]

I didn't try the 'solution' itself but I used the general advice in the book and it helped sooo much. Not just in terms of helping DS sleep, but just the kind, sympathetic loving approach to babycare. By far the best baby care book I have ever read.

Seriously SUTBID? Small world! He left for there almost a week ago but due to a plane fault got stuck in the US til yesterday. I'm guessing it's pretty hot there at the moment coz every time he texts me he's just been swimming!
Why the sigh hon? Homesick?

P.S. Every night since I received my book (can't remember which day it was now) DD has gone down like a dream and stayed down. Was stunned that the advice worked first go. Tonight she fell asleep halfway thru her bedtime bottle tho, so woke around 11pm and took another 4oz but happily went back down without a fuss. Hoping that's her for the night now. SO glad I bought that book, I'd never have known about it if you hadn't mentioned it in our January thread Iris , thank you and big hugs.
It was really only the one piece of advice in it that I used, it just gave me the confidence to try it when all my instincts before had been that putting her down so much earlier than she'd got used to would just lead to more problems. It didn't. She went from going to sleep at 11pm to going down at 8.30 (now 7.30 with DST) like a dream. Really hope I'm not tempting fate with that remark, but just hoping it gives others some light at the end of the tunnel. I know DD wasn't nearly as wakeful as most, but I'm sure given a wee bit of time it works for most. It certainly makes more sense to me than many other theories I've read about.
Keep you chin up Iris, and take DH up on as many nights off as you can. You need to look after yourself before you can look after anyone else. Ya know where we are if you wanna chat. Lis x

Iris, so that your dh can do some night shift. Just wish fluffybaby would settle with anyone but me. Also, my dh is always on cat duty at night (we have a neurotic cat) so we are both always up at least once a night! Fluffybaby has cold at the mo, woke just as we were coning to bed and screamed for an hour inconsolable. But then later in the night he deceided he didn;t need to suck my finger to settle him thank you very much and would suck his own thumb like a big boy. Is this a breakthrough?

hello all, just signing back in as my BT connection went kaput last week. No phone, no internet until the bloke from BT (the most miserable man in the world) turned up and fixed the problem in less than 2 minutes. Days and days of MN deprivation, shudder.

We've had a few nights of 2 hour sleep blocks so last night I moved ds out of our bed to his cot, as none of us were getting any sleep . I felt really mean and selfish putting him down to sleep alone, and I missed having his little warm self next to me, but his sleep was actually a bit better - awake at 12.10, 2.30 and 6 am. Which would have been fine, but at 2.30 he was not going back into that cot by himself! It took me until 3.15 cuddling, feeding, lying on the spare bed saying 'relax, sleepy-tired' to him while he thrashed about, crossly, until he was tired enough to go back to sleep.

Does anyone else feel like they are doing pretty much everything in the book already? I keep looking through it thinking that ds doesn't feed to sleep, has lots of different sleep associations, lots of the advice isn't relevant, he just won't stay asleep. I've been trying waking him up just before his usual waking time in the evenings, but it has only worked once out of 3 goes. Anyway, rambling now, sorry for mammoth essay! Hi to everyone I haven't spoken to before, welcome to the sleepless zone!

Lisa - so pleased DD is sleeping better for you now.

Fluffyanimal - don't be too DS was in with me again last night so DH got his full 8 hours grrrr. DS didn't have an afternoon nap yesterday or a bf (we were at a halloween kids party & there was too much going on for him to be interested)or much for his tea. I felt so bad at potentially leaving him hungry I bf 6-7.30 then bf when he woke at 10 so DH said "he just as well stay with you tonight yes?" my knackered mumble didn't cut much so we were back to a fidgety night & awake from 3.

Hi all,
I feel like my eyes are burning holes in my head this morning. DD's naps went out of the window because I had to work all day Saturday then with the clock shift I had no hope yesterday. Poor babe is all over the place at the moment. As are my sleep logs.

Iris, please don't think of leaving your thread!

Momomama, thank you for your kind comments. After seeing my close friend loose her two year old and then my own horribly nasty miscarriage, I still tend to get upset when I see how some people treat their babies. But there's no excuse for intolerance. You are right, comparison is unhelpful and if I can't control my feelings I should at least keep them to myself - sorry everyone

tigertum - thanks for your positive input - gives hope to us all I agree it really is a beautiful parenting book.

danceswithbaby - you have nothing to apologise for !!! But do sound like you could use a hug

Bloody hell if we can't vent here where can we? I'm always moaning on here (it's my therapy ), I'd explode (more )in RL otherwise

moljam - thanks for the dancing tip - made me (and may try later)

bottomlessburp - (like the new name btw ) - changes in light levels seem to affect DS too.

bikebug - I'm focussing on believing that I need to help DS learn to resettling himself rather than thinking about how many times he wakes up.

PS - thanks for your encouraging words everyone.

i just wrote long reply and lost it!how do you get your lo's to go for nap?im having trouble getting ds to nap!glad to hear tigertum that the book worked so well for you,which bits did you find most helpful.ive only just started,we logged usual sleep pattern yesterday but i keep thinking of giving up already!im desperate,as i know we all are!keep thinking surely baby whisperers not that bad but then wed have to give up cosleeping

Iris & Difers please keep posting! I agree with moljam - it's talking to like minded people whether or not you're following the plan properly. Lisa - wow, I'm really glad the books suggestions worked for you, send some positive vibes this way .

On a different note, has anyone tried cranial osteopathy with their lo? I should go and start a separate thread really, but just wondered if anyone here had tried it and whether it was any good??

my cousins dd had it done as baby!worked brilliantly apparently!

My copy of NCSS just arrived. I've only read the first few pages but already feel much more confident about dealing with family and friends who tell me just to let him cry. I feel better in myself that I'm not being soft (cos I'm a real disciplinarian me ), but also hopeful that there are better ways to get fluffybaby to sleep.

when she describes in book for crib baby,(which we arent but are considering!)sounds alot like pu/pd anyone else think so?have i misunderstood?weve started day one of sleep log!well naps anyway!for those of you who have been keeping logs,how long have you been doing it and how long did it take to see difference?i just can see how its going to work and i know i shouldnt be saying that i should have lots of faith in it so it works!but....aaarrrggghhh!

Hi am new to this thread!
CAn anyone tell me what the No cry sleep solution is? And how much success are you having?
DS now 24 weeks and nights broken (goes down ok if v relaxed and sleepy) and day naps difficult and short (is this affecting his night time sleep?)
So many people say leave them to cry. Have struggled with that concept from the off but feeling stressed/anxious about his sleep and not enjoying him as much as I should be (cos he is very cute and funny) so wondering if I should go down that route?!?

thanks

fluffyanimal - you're not soft, just caring and in tune with your baby

moljam - I think the crib/family bed thing are options to get your LO use to sleeping on their own a bit more (and therefore self settle) rather than PUPD - though I may have misread it myself! I tried a varation on the theme by letting DS have the top half of the bed whilst I lay across the bottom keeping contact to a minimum between bf (obviously wont work so well if you want to continue co-sleeping) DS certainly woke more last night when he was back in with me.

san2 - welcome The No Cry Sleep Solution is a book by Elizabeth Pantley and describes a gentle way of encouraging your baby to go to sleep by themselves (and sleep for longer because they can resettle themselves when they wake)using sleep cues such as a wind down routine, music, cuddly toy etc.

It's by no means a quick fix - I've been at it (albeit not rigidly) for 6 weeks now and although DS doesn't sleep through yet his daytime naps are much longer & more consistent. He's getting there slowly at night as a result. Others on the thread have had varying degrees of success too.

Each baby is different, and only you can tell if it's the right way for you, but if the thought of CC leaves you as anxious as your current lack of sleep I'd say this thread is for you - the support here is amazing

Hello everyone,

Moljam, I found that the sleep logs are useful in analysing what is actually going on in order to focus on the solutions that are best going to help but in some ways I found them very useful to do as I realised that DS wasn't hungry and needing food, then it became very clear that he was teething as his sleep pattern changed alot so I feel a bit more of a capable mum as a result.

eg// My case - DS's suck to sleep association, hence trying the removal technique and secondly the lack of decent naps during the day leading to overtiredness and difficulty settling at nights. The naps are going well but I like bf him to sleep, also he's just getting used to his new teeth and biting a bit - Iris - I think you had this problem!!!

I'm having a break as I'm moving house next week so I will be back on the plan when I get settled. The HV suggested not even bothering to tackle a sleep issue whilst living at my mums house while we buy our new home. (She has met my mum though)

San1 - Welcome, I think the success depends on what the issue is and what needs to change to remedy it and whether you want that change just yet! (I thinking about me and how I quite like to feed him to sleep if i'm really honest) It's a very nourishing book and really worth the read as it doesn't make you feel bad for doing things like feeding baby to sleep as some books do.

hello - am new to mumsnet and have just read thread after seeking out advice and help with getting baby down to sleep - i dont know all the abbreviations yet (DD DS or DC mean nothing to me although think they refer to our babies??). My lovely baby girl is 5 weeks old now and has always fell asleep breastfeeding or on me but now shes getting bigger and things have settled since the first newborn weeks i feel i should try and get her to sleep properly ie in her moses basket. Currently i have managed by a mix of putting her down after b/f, cuddling or sometimes co-sleeping however if trying to put her down in moses basket she always wakes up and the whole feed and sleep process can start again. very rarely i can get her down without her waking up or by putting her down while happily awake. i have to admit to having her sleep on me while i lay on the sofa when ive been too tired to try the moses b. I have just ordered the ncss bok that everybody is talking about and feel quite comforted by the amount of people that do the same as me - i too could never even contemplate the CC approach. Its quite funny how a few comments from the health visitor can make me feel so guilty that im not getting her to sleep 'properly' and that im doing it all wrong and to be honest despite this being my second (first is 8 now) i havent a clue as to where to begin (well i kinda do but confidence in myself is pretty poor which tends to make me ignore my instincts and focus more on what everyone else says).

Hiya everyone,
well the formula 'dream feed' has became a nightmare, DD has cottoned on and is totally refusing a bottle when mummy has breasts! if I wasn't so demented I'd be impressed by her supreme intelligence.
Can i just reinforce NO ONE IS LEAVING THIS THREAD! Its so lovely to hear how you're all doing on and off the programme (personally I'm more off than on, please don't expel me).
Iris so sorry you're feeling a bit frazzled, your DH's offer of 4 nights off has been mentioned to my DP 1000000 times, so he's going to give it a go! I know what you mean about pnd being in the back of your mind too. I'm sooo terrified of sliding into even more of a mess through sheer exhaustion. I've looked up loads of sleep deprivation websites and its not good reading for those of us who have had months of disrupted sleep, so take care folks! I've been doing the dancing singing to combat feelings of yukkiness - ta moljam

I looked in the mirror this morning and realised it is Haloween. I haven't dared check out any sleep deprivation websites Momomama.

DD napped really well yesterday but last night was slightly worse even than usual. Why isn't it working??!

Bikebug, we seem to be doing everything the book suggests too, but she just won't STAY asleep. I think you were one who mentioned a 'high need' baby. Do you think that's got anything to do with it? Hightened sensitivity/survival instinct or something? DD always startles easily and doesn't seem to really deep sleep much.

Hi Hayles, we told our HV to sling her hook after she spent two hours on our soafa drinking tea and eating biscuits saying "you really should get some rest". You don't HAVE to see her if you don't want to. Trusting your instincts is absolutely the best thing you can do. Hard though, isn't it?

hayles personnaly i think at 5 weeks,youre still in first few weeks,do what feels right for the 2 of you,worry about how and where later.by the way,dh-husband-ds-dear son-dd dear daughter etc.it is confusing!
momomamma,glad the dancing is working,just make sure the neighbours dont catch you!ds seems to love music as a result of our daily dance sessions!today and yesterday was cat stevens.we were having chilled day!
yesterday s naps went well once i eventually got him to go to sleep,last night he went to bed fine and only woke twice!and todays morning nap was great too!after what happened last time he slept well maybe i shouldnt tell anyone!how do you wait 10 days before recording log?i need to find new chill music,my cd is doing my head in,its beginning to sound like supermarket jingles!

cooo aren't we getting busy!!

hayles78 - hi there - I am inclined to agree with moljam. At 5 weeks your LO is still getting used to being outside & I know my DS just wanted to still hear a heartbeat (mine or DH's) & be cuddled all the while. Have you tried a sling? or swaddling her & having a muslin that smells of you in with her (sorry if I'm teaching you to suck eggs). Your instinct is the best guide though and will be right for you and your LO.

momomama - I am definately NOT looking into sleep depravation then

Bad luck with the formula. DS will only have about 2 ounces max during the day and never at night. He only does that because DH introduced it when he was really hungry).I heard somewhere that it takes two weeks to form a habit. Could your DP do the formula dreamfeed for a couple of weeks? (I'm assuming it was working before)

difers - I'm still bf to sleep at night but trying to change the day bf so naps are 1/2 hour later than bf. Today I bf at 10.30 went for a walk to the shop, wide awake, & he was asleep by 11.15 - and still is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! hope it doesn't stop him from sleeping later though.

danceswithbaby - I've found that it took couple of weeks to "set" the naps enough for them to have an effect on the nights. I keep forgetting thata I'll never have a set routine anyway - their needs always change just as you think you've got it sussed oh the joys of motherhood

ps - on the subject of feeling crappy. I have discovered that, on the days when i feel particularly miserable, if I pile on the slap & get dressed up as if I'm going somewhere I actually feel better! The tip was passed on to me by a very good friend - works for me so thought I'd share

'lo again all. I've just made an appointment for cranial osteopathy for my little sleepless lad, I'm a bit worried - I hope it is OK. I'm not very 'alternative therapy' really (a very teenage reaction to my lovely mum who believes in everything except physics. Naturally I became the family scientist and sceptic). Anyway, I hope it does some good - it really is distressing how he wakes crying so often, I don't think waking up with a shriek and crying before eyes are even open is the kind of waking that creating nice sleep associations is going to help with.

DWB, yes it probably was me that said 'high needs' - it's a lovely phrase from Sears Baby Book, so much better than calling babies 'difficult' or 'problem', which gets done so very often . I often use it to describe ds who is into everything, can't wind down, and needs a lot of stimulation, attention and touch and who absolutely does not play nicely by himself. At all. Ever. I think that kind of hypersensitivity does extend into nighttime and makes it far harder to sleep soundly than a more placid settled personality might manage. I also explain a lot of this to myself in terms of survival instincts and evolution. It honestly makes sense to me that ds doesn't sleep through, I can see that he is thinking the lions and tigers and bears are coming to get him, and it's a sensible reaction for cave-baby. But suburban-semi-baby needs a bit of help here!

Iris, just thought I'd add - slapping on the slap, doing hair and wearing proper shoes, I do it too! Thought I'd organise my life a while back and started the FlyLady thing. It was far too much like hard work, but I did keep the getting dressed properly thing going, and it works for me (and the shiny sink thing, but thats another story ). Moljam, you've made me think I must try dancing too. If having ds can get me singing, dancing must be within my motherly powers