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How heavy was your baby when he/she first slept for 8hours straight?

332 replies

Handsoff7 · 19/07/2014 12:23

My DD is 4.5months old but was 2 months early and small for dates so still only weighs around 10lbs.

She sleeps well but her limit is about 6hours at night. I suspect this is size related. Books and other posts generally talk about ages which is hard to interpret in my case.

How heavy were yours when they could go for a whole night?

Thanks for the help

OP posts:
Are your children’s vaccines up to date?
Handsoff7 · 26/07/2014 03:26

option for me.

Thanks for all the responses (especially to chocolate wombat - I found some really useful targeted advice in your posts).

OP posts:
GreedyBitch · 26/07/2014 07:01

Velvet, I'm not sure why there is a confusion re my comments on cooled boiled water. It is common sense which only you, the mother of you baby, can be sure of utilising. For me, I knew when my FF baby was waking out of habit and I knocked it on the head. The books give a weight of 8lbs so that you are not attempting this method with a baby who couldn't cope with that kind of sleep training. We don't want babies' needs being neglected.

Hands, congratulations on the seven-hour stretch Smile

merrymouse · 26/07/2014 08:03

I read your post perfect and I thought it was quite good.

Sleep training is for parental convenience. If a saner parent results than baby-led sleep, sure that can be really good for the baby.

I particularly agreed with this.

thisvelvetglove · 26/07/2014 09:31

Greedy the weight thing is clearly nonsense from the book, because the weight of babies is so variable. Quoting a weight of any kind makes no sense.

Also because no baby under 6 months should be given water, except if FF in very hot weather. . .

ChocolateWombat · 26/07/2014 10:19

Handsoff, glad to be of help.
I thought from your posts that you were keen to have sleepless nights for as short a time as possible. Sounds like you and your baby are getting on really well if she's managing 7 hours. And I guess that if you keep on with your routine, as she grows heavier, she will make it longer and longer and when she weans fully, she will manage even longer.

To everyone else, as I said earlier, information is key. Handsoff has been told about co sleeping, and other approaches but like other parents, also needed to know about lots of other options including routines and the principles behind what helps a baby sleep through the night...ie self settling, eating enough in daylight hours. This approach isn't for everyone, which is fine. However, for those for whom sleep is a key priority (and it isn't for everyone, which is fine) then knowing about things you can do which might help develop longer stretches,is useful information.

GreedyBitch · 26/07/2014 11:41

Also because no baby under 6 months should be given water, except if FF in very hot weather. . .

How about if the weather is merely 'hot'? Balmy? Raining but sticky. I'm sorry to be facetious but this really does come down to common sense. Do you really believe there are BF-ing mums out there, trawling around town, shopping for the family in horrible heat and whipping the breast out whenever their (not newborn) baby cries? No. Some of them are giving it a little water. Some are even giving their baby cooled boiled water mixed with a little juice Shock

GreedyBitch · 26/07/2014 11:43

Sleep training is for parental convenience.

So is wearing nappies. What's your point?

fledermaus · 26/07/2014 11:43

Of course breastfeeding mums are feeding their hot crying babies in town Confused Why wouldn't you? It wouldn't occur to me to bring water or juice for an unweaned baby, and I have never seen any of my bf-ing friends/family do that either.

GreedyBitch · 26/07/2014 12:18

I've just been to town, then through the park to the train station, on a train journey and then sat in another public park with a friend and her baby and I saw lots and lots of mums offering drinks other than breast milk or formula to their babies - and yes, they were under six months old. I saw one woman breastfeeding.

merrymouse · 26/07/2014 12:23

"Do you really believe there are BF-ing mums out there, trawling around town, shopping for the family in horrible heat and whipping the breast out whenever their (not newborn) baby cries?"

Goodness yes.

Who would carry around sterilised bottles of water if you didn't have to? That is half the point of breastfeeding.

The point is not that it is wrong to do something for parental convenience but that there isn't anything intrinsically good about sleep training a baby apart from parental convenience. A toddler or older child might winge/cry/throw a tantrum because of lack of sleep. A baby will just go to sleep if he/she feels sleepy. That might be only for 20 minutes and that might be really inconvenient, but it isn't doing the baby any harm and it might fit in with your life style.

However, if you can't function because of lack of sleep and that is impeding your parenting and ability to earn a living that is a perfectly valid reason to try to get your baby to sleep in a more convenient manner.

There are also a significant minority of children and adults who, for whatever reason, are not good sleepers.

merrymouse · 26/07/2014 12:31

Given that only about 12% of women in the UK are exclusively breastfeeding at 4 months that isn't surprising.

merrymouse · 26/07/2014 12:31

(that was to Greedy)

fledermaus · 26/07/2014 12:41

I can't even think of the last time I saw someone give anything other than milk to a baby in a bottle.

SleepRefugee · 26/07/2014 13:46

Of course women breastfeed their children in public. And it's not always obvious, you can feed while carrying them in a sling or it may just look like a mother cuddling her baby.

In line with current guidelines, I did not give my EBF baby any water before introducing solids at 6 months and even then she only had a sippy cup of water at mealtimes and continued to be breastfed on demand until the age of 2.

SleepRefugee · 26/07/2014 13:50

water at mealtimes only until the age of around 12 months I meant to say

PenguinsHatchedAnEgg · 26/07/2014 14:08

I am currently breastfeeding my nearly 3 month old. I don't give him water. And going by the number of people who've asked me whether he wants to feed all the time in this hot weather, I think the majority of people assume I am feeding him when he's thirsty.

If you ff you may give water in hot weather, but I don't know of any bfing mums who'd give water to a baby pre-solids.

GreedyBitch · 26/07/2014 15:25

As I stopped breastfeeding my baby after a fortnight - and am quite possibly blind to the amount of women BF-ing around me - I will happily back down on this argument. You know better than me about EBF. I should only speak for myself when I say cooled boiled water, on occasion during the night, is perfectly okay, when genuine hunger has been eliminated as the reason for baby waking Smile

However, if you can't function because of lack of sleep and that is impeding your parenting and ability to earn a living that is a perfectly valid reason to try to get your baby to sleep in a more convenient manner. Why do I have to be in a catatonic state of sleeplessness and misery in order to want to put my baby into a routine? I put my baby into a routine because, after doing my research (again I have to reference Dr. Weissbluth and his genius) I decided that scheduled naps and feeds during the day, coupled with a set bath time, massage, bed time and waking-up time were of great benefit to my baby. This has proved to be the case for me and I wouldn't try to say it was the perfect solution for everyone. Heaps of women breastfeed on demand, have no structure to naps or feeds and let baby stay up with them until 10/11pm. They don't have a set getting-up time in the morning and all of this is perfectly okay
if that is what makes them happy.

Many other women are not so happy being woken multiple times in the night and are despairing by the time baby has reached eight months or whatever and refuses to sleep apart from mum and wakes every couple of hours in the night - especially when his wakings are not out of genuine hunger but simply through habit/needing to comfort-suck to get back to sleep. There are multiple threads awash with women who are on the point of nervous exhaustion from this kind of torture. It really doesn't have to be this way if you want you and your baby to enjoy long stretches of sleep.

merrymouse · 26/07/2014 16:23

You don't have to be in a catatonic state to sleep train your baby. However if you are functioning perfectly well you might decide not to bother or to leave it till your baby is older and that is perfectly fine.

GreedyBitch · 26/07/2014 17:27

Of course, Merrymouse, that is the case with any method of parenting. However, the OP was looking for ways to stretch out her baby's sleep and I came here to give my own experiences and share what I've read. None of this is an exact science.

thisvelvetglove · 26/07/2014 21:47

To stretch out the baby sleep is for the parent's benefit though.

As we have established, normal baby and toddler waking is not detrimental to the child. (Unlike extreme cases of school age children not getting enough rest).

Having read one of Dr Weissbluth's genius articles, I noticed he refers to cry it out and cc as 'extinction methods' to make it sound better. :(

I also didn't give water to my children before weaning at around 6 months. One of the perks of bf is not having to carry cups, bottles etc. :)

ChocolateWombat · 26/07/2014 22:56

It is true that stretching babies sleep is for the benefit of the parent, in the early stages. If this significantly helps the parents function better, the whole family benefits. It is often easier for the baby too, if they get into a sleep pattern early on though, as then methods like controlled crying are never needed to break strongly established poor sleep associations at a later stage.

Beyond a certain point (which very many people seem to go beyond, according to this thread) broken nights, which have gone on for years are clearly detrimental to both adults and children.....typical results are being run down and susceptible to illness and struggling to concentrate at work or school. Longer sleep benefits everyone.

I really don't see using a routine to steer a baby towards longer stretches of sleep as selfish or a failure to consider the needs of the baby or child which one or two people seem to be suggesting. If we think longer sleep, early on will benefit both the baby and rest of the family in both the short, medium and long term,we do something to bring it closer, rather than just hoping it will happen. The thinking is similar to deciding to try to steer a toddler away from hitting other children, towards eating healthily and towards learning to share......these are all things a child will probably learn eventually without adult intervention, but we do intervene rather than let them go their own way, because we think the short, medium and long term benefits for everyone are there and make it worthwhile. Sometimes the children will be resistant to being guided, but we carry on, because as parents we believe that these are things that are important.

Some people will be more lasses-faire than others about these things, which is fine. Others will be more interventionist in their approach,mwhich is fine. However, to suggest that choosing to do something which benefits the whole family (rather than just focusing purely on the patterns of the child) beyond baby being incapable of sleeping through the night, seems wrong. One or two people do seem to think that there is a high value to be placed on being child-led at all times, and on all things. I think we can allow ourselves as parents to think we know better than our children on many things and to help guide them....sleep for older babies and children can be one of those areas. It is not selfish or a failure to consider the child to do so, but taking seriously the responsibility of being a parent.

If of course, you are a parent who isn't bothered by a lack of sleep, then leaving it All to the baby and nature is fine too. Everyone can choose. I don't think parents who don't sleep train are negligent, but just make a different choice to me. I also don't think those who sleep train are selfish, as some posters suggest....we again, just make different choices.

perfectstorm · 27/07/2014 01:18

Genuine question: at what point is allowing a baby to sob, uncomforted, so they eventually fall asleep in the hopeless conviction that nobody will aid or soothe them, acceptable, let alone "in their best interests"? Because coaxing to sleep and seeking to extend sleep periods is what all parents, routinised or not, do. Nobody likes being sleep-deprived! What varies is the point in time at which we start to exert authority on bedtimes in the face of distress. You can gussy it up all you want: that's the reality of the dispute here: when you prioritise your own sleep, even in the face of a crying child.

I have never left a baby of mine to cry until and unless they were old enough to know where I was, why I was doing it, and that they weren't abandoned - just expected to get sufficient rest. And, necessarily, that was a toddler, not a baby, and one old enough to get out of his toddler bed and scuttle through to me to protest/be returned firmly to bed. To compare parents who don't want to leave infants to sob with those who can't be bothered to teach their children about healthy eating, sharing, and not hitting is simply ridiculous. From a logical standpoint, you can't teach those things until a child has the capacity to reason; a failure to teach your children those things once they're old enough is simple bad parenting. But the analogy makes sense to me in this at least: would you try to teach your 3 month old to share? To not hit? To eat healthily? You can't. They lack the developmental readiness. And I personally think expecting a tiny baby to go against its biological programming and then pretending it's for the best interests of that baby... I just don't agree. It's for the benefit of the adults.

Do you seriously imagine I wanted to get up with my son through the night and then when he rose at 5.30 to start his day? Bluntly, there were times I longed to just leave him to cry himself back to sleep so I could get more of my own, but I felt conscience-bound to attend to him in the brief point in his life during which he was unable to understand/feel safe if I didn't. That's the bottom line for me. I didn't think the fear and distress of my child was okay. (I also appreciate that many women who use routines also feel that way and never leave their babies to cry uncomforted, in which case, I think the argument is about semantics - we're parenting the same way under different headings.) I accept that's my own moral code, and I don't expect others to share it, but there is, to me, a comic element in women who choose a parenting pattern on the grounds they get an easier life out of it trying to compare those of us who don't to parents who allow their kids to clobber, eat junk and toy-hoard. Not sleep-training is harder, if your child isn't a natural sleeper (and if they are, then you don't need to sleep-train). That's something all those who sleep-train say for themselves, when advocating it.

And my 5 month old was out in town with me and my son from 10 am till 6 pm today. She remains exclusively breastfed. I just fed her in a quiet corner, when she was thirsty/hungry. Which was on three occasions, as it happens. Can't fathom why that is seen as difficult - was far more of a palaver tending to DS, who needed bottles.

thisvelvetglove · 27/07/2014 05:29

Yes chocolate, you can't really be baby led in not hitting, or let your toddler choose chocolate for breakfast.

I can't see the validity in that comparison.

Learning to sleep longer periods by themselves it's a developmental thing that babies go through at different ages.

The others are types of acceptable behaviour that we must teach children for their own benefit.

Parents who do not sleep train or implement routines to stretch out sleep do not necessarily expect their children to learn how to behave by themselves!

I was fairly bothered by a lack of sleep, especially with my second who woke a lot. I still wouldn't have used any 'extinction methods' our click watched to determine when they were allowed to be feed etc.

thisvelvetglove · 27/07/2014 05:34

Clock watched!

Going by the threads on this sleep board, there is too high an expectation for young babies to sleep through.

Also HCP/grandparents/random strangers/friends telling people to go straight to cc or cio when they hear baby its not sleeping 'enough'. And I don't mean when parents are really suffering with lack of sleep, just normal babies waking for feeds.

StillWishihadabs · 27/07/2014 06:42

But that's the whole point perfect. If one encourages a baby to self settle (or as I call it link their sleep cycles)from very young (less than 4 weeks) then you never need to do controlled crying. Better a 4 week old you know if fed,changed and ready to sleep (having been awake for a couple of hours) has a bit of a grumble before drifting off on a couple of occasions than a 18 month old screaming the place down in the night because the parents have had enough of broken nights, but have never taught the child to sleep a consolidated stretch. IMO.