Misery loves company: riding the mo fo out into Part II

[ElphabaTheGreen]

In our last exciting instalments:

Needles was at breaking point with a screaming 10 mo DD

Hear had experienced the magic of ONE unbroken night!

Dreaming was continuing to confound all with her ability to manage three children on four or five minutes a night, thanks to DT the Terrible.

Stitch was still having her sleep eaten by...erm...Stitch.

Poppy was pondering how the actual fark she was going to manage a newborn on top of BabyAmex's night time shenanigans.

And the desperate Elphaba had turned night duties entirely over to DH with mastitic results.

Join us with your stories of misery and woe in this, the most sleep-deprived corner of MN!

I think I had the 'no naps past or after 3pm' rule in place from the time DS was about 9 or 10 months old to ensure that he was tired enough to go to sleep at around 7 every night and I bet I've bloody jinxed it now actual bedtimes are the only thing about his sleep that have never been a real problem. Even after I got rid of the feeding to sleep he'd be asleep by 7:30pm at the latest, even when he was raging at me for boob. Now he goes in his cot, pops up and down to look at me a few times and is out like a light for a good, ooooh, three or even four hours sometimes but it's usually more like two. Could it be that her last nap is too late, too long and/or lasting until too close to bedtime, Jacques?

Of course, I know enough about the vagaries of infant sleep now to be aware that that particular phenomenon of falling asleep reliably by a set time each night probably has absolutely nothing to do with my good management and everything to do with luck, but I just thought I'd throw in my two cents worth in case it does affect anything.

Oh bum, why did nobody tell me about the 3pm rule? It would make sense, she used to have the second nap around 2pm but it's got progressively later and so has bedtime. Obvious really. We'll have a go at an early nap tomorrow and see what happens. Cheers. You lot are lovely.

Sorry, really quick one from me.

Crappy nights here. Dt the Terrible has puked into our bed at 5:20- 5:30am like clockwork last three nights (after his idiot mother gave him a bottle of almond milk in bed in the vain hope he'd doze off again). Last night Dt2 refused to go to sleep til 9:35. Dt1 woke up at 9:55. I nearly went postal.

Anyway. Naps. Dd went down to one nap at 11 months, Dt2 at 12-13 months,Dt 1 at 15 and a bit months, as he sleeps so badly and gets up so ridiculously early. Sleep is BANNED here after 1pm. Naps are 11-12 ish for Dt2- any more and he won't go to bed, and same time but unlimited, usually similar thoughr for Dt1. I fear Dt2 will be like dd and quit naps before age 2. Gah.

Oh, and with bedtime routines, the twins have always always been treated exactly the same, yet Dt2 self settles mostly and often sleeps through, whereas Dt1 is hellish at bedtime , doesn't self settle and wouldn't dream of sleeping past 11pm let alone all night, certainly not in his cot. This has shattered my illusions of my marvellous bedtime routine helping my two good sleepers sleep :)

It's interesting that your twins are so different. Just goes to prove that you're not to blame. I also didn't realised that they can drop a nap so soon. I thought you had to wait until 2 or something. Babies.... So much to learn.
It's a shame that we'll probably stop at one DC as I won't have the chance to be all chilled out and 'been there done that' with a second one. Every stage is a steep learning curve for me.

DS went down to one nap at 9 months and I reckon he's on course to be napless before 2. He's had a couple of days without naps now and been none the worse for it.

I think of Dreaming's twins every time some dick tries to suggest DS's awful sleep has anything to do with me.

Hello all,
Sorry to hear of difficult bedtimes jacques and elph, it is tough when you don't get any evening down time.

dreaming you trooper, is he reacting to the almond milk too now then? Being a mummy pillow makes it very difficult for you to sleep, my sympathies.

Stitch is 21 months today. She has gone back to sleeping better after her recent bout of teething/illness. DH has discovered if he changes her nappy between midnight and 1am she is less likely to wake.

She is however a complete minx. Last Sunday she blocked the toilet with a plastic dolphin. We had to call a plumber to take the toilet off to get it out. She has also discovered that if she hides the nursery unit of the baby monitor that she can get out of bed at bedtime and play without us hearing her!

Maybe mini-stitch was attempting to release the dolphin back into the wild? She could be a budding ecowarrior! I'm glad the little minx is at least sleeping better.
We've had some improvement at bedtime the past couple of days since moving DD naps forward. We still had multiple wake ups in the night but I think that was more to do with her being a bit poorly.
So far operation 'no boobs in the day' is going well too.

Glad things are going better Jacques :)

Cor stitch I don't think I would mind if dd woke up and just played in her room without us knowing. She just gets out of bed and then comes and climbs on us. Humph...

We are pretty variable here at the moment. Had a couple of really good nights followed by a couple of really bad nights. Same old stuff really.

Tired. Grumpy. Same old same old. I fricking hate 5:20am. Got last one in bed for a hopeless 8:30, so having spent 5:30am- 8:30 pm parenting I am now worse thaan uselss. Plus, I managed to be a complete prat and fall over and hurt my back into the bargain. Great.Though going to bed now is kind of pointless seeing as DT the Terrible always wakes up by 11. I never get round to going to bed befoer he wakes, thinking whats the point... but I guess if I don't try it I'll never know.

In fact I'm so grumpy I'm off to have a shower and risk an early night. I bet that'll learn me.

Glad your lo is showing signs of improvement jacques.

Yeah, stick with us hear, we'll let you off a few good nights .

oh, and stitch, he's jkust generally coughing and snotty which makes him puke. I actually think he is really showing great signs of reflux improving and getting a bit better with dairy. He's dire with soya, which may be the issue. DH thinks he's soya intolerant, as he reacts hugely with diarrhoea if he eats Quorn, which contains soya I think. Maybe, as I've been eating soya yoghurts etc, he's been always reacting to that more than dairy?! (very optimistic, probably unrealistically so!). Anyway, as soon as he's well, we'll rechallenge him with dairy. I'll be over the moon if he can have it!!!!

Quorn doesn't contain any soya - it's mycoprotein which is made from mushrooms. It does have a little bit of egg in it, but definitely no soya.

DS decided to get fidgety and hair-pulley for about an hour from 4am this morning, then fell asleep like a log until past 6:30am, i.e. long after I had to be awake and getting ready for work.

elph, I was vegetarian for 15 years and ate loads of quorn, I always thought it was.mushroom and egg. Dh announced this week it had soya in, so I thought he must have checked a packet! There goes that theory. A bit of dairy too according to my vegan friend.

Anyway, regardless of why Dh reacts to quorn, I'm decreasing Dt1's meds, ok so far. Eeek, the excitement of slight increase in his dairy tolerance would be bliss, a lot less vile nappies for me

He was up and arching and very unsettled last night. I'm putting it down as a fluke, but will wait and see...

Lie in here this morning. 6:30. 6:30!!!!!! Don't know why I feel so knackered...

It's funny you should say that dreaming I find that I'm sometimes more tired when I've had a bit more sleep. It's like your body remembers what it's missing. The rest of the time I seem to get by on some kind of adrenaline/anxiety.
I've just ordered 'the no cry sleep solution' after reading about it on a couple of threads. Anyone tried it?

Oh did I just totally miss the point again. (Despairing at self)

I tried NCSS. The mistake I made was not letting DS read it first so he could see what he was supposed to do.

Suffice it to say it didn't work. Tiny, tiny changes achieved maybe, moreso than any of the other sleep training books (yep, tried pretty much every one of them) but in hindsight I suspect that was him reaching certain developmental stages of sleep himself in very, very delayed fashion rather than what I was doing.

I think I've come to the conclusion that sleep training methods 'work' by keeping the parents occupied, making them think they're doing something useful, while the kid reaches his or her own stages of sleep development in their own time. If the methods themselves were actually effective 1) There wouldn't be such a huge market in sleep training books suggesting ten million different and contradictory things (and this message board wouldn't exist) and 2) DS would have been sleeping 12 uninterrupted hours from the day he came home from the hospital, because I have literally done everything to encourage 'good sleep habits' from day one. Posters on MN have had the raw edge of my keypad if they suggest their exemplary parenting has anything to do with their blissfully sleeping little darling. I've learned to steer clear now of any sleep threads (apart from this lovely one) because they shit me too much and I start ranting like the village soothsayer. Sometimes I even find myself just thinking about the early waking threads ('darling little DS sleeps eleven hours straight but is always up for the day at 5:45. I'm exHAUSted! Please help!') and I can feel my blood pressure rising

Hello folks.

Lurking but not writing.Feeling crap,hope it's only pregnancy related.Surgery called to repeat urine sample as the 1st one had protein in it(don't have a clue what it means and don't want to google just in case it's another terminal illness).Fucking decorating not finished yet,another guy let us down.Mess everywhere.DS being a nightmare,clingy like hell and screaming like a banshee.Sometimes I just feel like putting him on the doorstep with "free to good home" board.Just want to curl up under the duvet and asking myself why the fuck I got pregnant again…

Sorry for the rant,wishing you all the best

Oh dear bald ! Sounds grim. Not sure if I should tell you what the protein means as you have resisted the Google. I am sure they will get you in sharpish if they think it is serious. How is your blood pressure? If you are getting dizzy and see spots when you stand up or you have a headache call the hospital straight away and tell them about the possible protein. I will say no more.

Have I just made things worse?

Thanks Hear :)

Sorry for whinge but felt so down yesterday.Not seeing spots or anything and my BP always was on the low side(even last week on mw appointment) so might not be preeclampsia.Who knows.Gave them another sample today so will wait and see.

I'm fed up with all this decorating stuff where the guys keep cancelling or not coming at all,then going no contact to appear out of nowhere saying "I'm coming on…".Not a bit of consideration whether we're working or not.I'm sick of all the mess-sideboard from the dining room keeps travelling from the sitting room back and for,had to empty all the contents so for the last few weeks they were (and still are) sitting on my worktop in the kitchen.

I keep juggling the stuff everyday,currently the bit of the worktop available is able to accomodate small cutting board that overhangs the worktop if I need to use slow cooker/grill.DS of course tries to pull everything that he can see,I don't want the wooden board to whack him on the head.And all the mess is still here because bastard workmen keep cancelling or not coming.

How long do you think it should take to plaster the ceiling,paint,wallpaper and put the laminate flooring in one room?We started 2 months ago,painting is still not finished and joiner cancelled flooring this week.After I stayed behind everybody at night to varnish fucking skirting boards.

Off to empty dishwasher,make a salad and unload the shopping.

Sorry about me,me,me post,I'm just fed up with everybody trying to tell me to be more patient!

2 months! That just ridiculous. I certainly wouldn't tell you to be patient. I would have stopped being patient about a month ago and told them that if they didn't get their act together they could sod off and I would find someone else to do the job.

Mind you that is easy to say when I don't own a house so have never actually had to deal with that sort of thing. :o

Two months sounds about right for when I used to live in the Styx. The tradespeople were a law unto themselves, probably because there weren't that many others you could take your business to. We're living in civilisation now and it has been much smoother getting this house sorted, but then I was on mat leave while it was being done, so if someone turned up randomly perhaps it wasn't quite as noticeable.

Hello everyone.

Bitter sweet to see all the familiar names present - Elph, Stitch, Dreaming, Hear I'm catching up with the thread later but please tell me there has been some respite for you since I last checked in?

Bald did i read you are pregnant? Congratulations my darling. How are you feeling?

I had DS two weeks ago, hurried csection 3 weeks before EDD and he was still 10lbs 3oz. The good news is he's lovely, healthy and has slept well cause that will last the bad news is I'm still in the throws of baby blues and wondering why we did this again.

No doubt ill be back as a fully fledged member in no time at all. Already thinking of te first sleep regression.

Congratulations Poppy on your whopping son!

Sorry to hear things are tough for you though. Have you got good support? Don't be afraid of antidepressants if it carries on for too long, even if you're BFing. There's plenty of safe options available. More for you and an un-Mumsnetty hug.

Congratulations poppy!!! I cried a lot when I had the boys. For about 3 months and the rest I swung between feeling incredibly happy and blessed with my two babies to love, and how wonderful they were,and that there were TWO, to feeling utterly overwhelmed and miserable and unable to cope by myself with all three dc. And god I missed dd. Really, really missed her. we'd been a little team til the boys arrived when she was 18 months- well, nearly 19 months. I hope its similar for you, but if its more, I second what elph says. And I have to ask, photo by any chance? And please, define 'sleeping well'?! can't ever accuse the boys of that!

Some respite for me. Still not getting a full uninterrupted evening, he's in bed with me by midnight latest every night, but we have gone from the two hour maximum sleeps to some 5-6 hour ones and regular 3-4 hour ones. Dunno why I still moan so much and hang out here (great company, clearly!) . Still tired. Very tired.

Thanks, Elph - not too bad today, I think it's just the baby blues rather than full blown PND, thankfully. But definitely keeping a close eye on it (along with a very vigilant DH) and will no hesitate to resort to medication if I don't improve.

Dreaming you just described exactly the way I feel when it comes to DD (she's 19 months now and we were such a tight little unit).
I keep telling DH I miss her and he just looks confused and says "but she's right here"!

Mind you, I don't think I would've been able to cope with twins - is it still the same DS keeping you awake? Goes to show, people assume it's the parents' fault we have "bad sleepers", but you have two brothers raised the same way with such disparate results.