Stuck in a never ending sleep regression

[PDog]

I am beyond exhausted. DD is coming up to 8.5mo and this has been going on for 2 months.

It seems to alternate between horrendous nights or horrendous days with horrendous bedtimes. She just can't switch off - I can't take my eyes off her for a second because she is not happy unless she rolling/grabbing something/putting something in her mouth.

When she does sleep, I have to feed her to sleep but as soon as I try to get her in her cot she wakes up and starts rolling.

She has only had 30 mins sleep all day today and gets more and more hyper. It then takes between 1-3 hours to get her to bed and she will be up to 2-3 times and ready to go by 6am (despite still been shattered).

Anyone offer any advice?

Or anyone in the same boat who wants to moan share experiences.

Hear hear to the ADog book!!

Hope your LO is feeling better now, SAA - that is scary.

My DD's just started doing that as well, PDog - although her sleeping bag impedes her from doing it in her cot at the moment (it's a hands-in one). She got cross this morning trying though - managed to get her foot through her sleepy suit so ended up with her leg all bent up, which was kind of funny. Until I took off her sleeping bag I couldn't work out why she wouldn't straighten her leg out...

Good idea, Kaymer..! We had a snuggly lap-nap on the bed yesterday afternoon (I knew we'd only fit in a 20-min recharge between the end of Nap 1 and bedtime, so went for the on-the-boob slam-dunk sleep method). I was thinking then I could maybe try lying down and feeding on the bed....she almost always wakes up when she drops off me, though - and it's a bit painful now she's got teeth. Anyway, I'll give it a go, especially when the weather's being vile.

02.30 and 06.00 were the wake-ups for the night. She didn't really resettle after the second, so in a cheat's world I could say it was only one, but I prefer at 07.00 up-for-the-day and DD could really do with another 1.5 hours of sleep ideally. Still, not really complaining!

How's everyone else?

DS only just stirring. Unheard of for him to sleep this late- we are so used to him waking us that my DH is going to be late for work. We had a night very like yours 2 nights ago, IC. He woke at 10.30 and I spent an hour trying to resettle him without a feed and then gave up and fed him. Then he woke at 5 for a quick feed and now almost awake. So not bad but don't get his recent 10.30 waking. He was doing it when he was ill but now he's pretty much better, have no idea why.

So sweet the idea of PDog and IC's babies sitting up in their sleep although rather less amusing for their mummies. No doubt the sweetness will wear off when it happens to me...

Kaymer it's good to hear that your DD stopped doing the long wake-ups - hopefully my DD will follow suit shortly...

SAA that sounds scary with your DS's cough - hope he's OK now. Sorry to hear you are getting the long wake-ups too. Glad he had a good night last night tho.

SOunds like you are having some sucess IC - it's good to hear sucess stories as much as the moaning not so good ones, as it gives us all hope!

Pdog I don't think it is related to teeth, as she doesn't have any of the symptoms. I think it is developmental tbh. The sitting up you report sounds like it could be a nightmare...can't wait for DD to start doing that - NOT!

Well, last night was probably the worst ever since DD was a tiny baby! Saying that, she slept fairly soundly from 8pm until 2.30am, but it was there it went to pot really...she didn't really re-settle at all (apart from a couple of times for about 15 mins) and I was still awake with her at 6.45 SHe eventually dropped off on the bed next to me about 7.15 (she won't usually do that) until 8.45. DH is away and it was just awful - I tried everything and ended up really shouting at her at one point although I know in my heart she isn't doing it intentionally, so that made me feel even worse and we were both in tears!
Please let this end soon!

I suppose on a good note, I could say that we only had one waking - twas just a very long one!

Just read back the post I did yesterday and realise I didn't thanks anyone for the hugs when I was feeling rubbish, so thanks.

Sending you a hug Curly - an unmumsnet one of course . I know how you feel; I have lost my temper with DD before now when we were having horrendous bedtimes . Makes you feel crap doesn't it? You just have to pick yourself up and move on though. My DH is away too, which I always find harder to deal with. Hope you have a better night tonight.

Not too bad last night - only 2 awakenings. The first time I tried to just shush her through the monitor (it has a 2-way button) but she ended up screaming. When I went in she was sitting up, trapped in the corner and had banged her head on the cot . Felt very crap for not going in straight away .

Thanks, everyone. I doubt anyone IRL would buy a book of mine ? who?d take the advice of someone whose baby wakes 5 times a night?

Speaking of which, DS is currently standing in his cot complaining at me. I went out for the evening & when I came back he?d been awake just over 1.5 hours. So now he?s on the second 1.5 hour cycle, oh joy.

Getting mobile is irritating, isn?t it, but it?s nice to be in company.

In the last 4 days, DS has learnt to wave, pull up to standing, climb two stairs, shuffle along the floor pushing the washing basket, and is trying hard to start cruising along furniture and climbing over things. I?m not surprised that things are haywire sleepwise. We?re back on short naps too.

We never had problems with sitting up in the cot though, so take heart. :)

IC, the more stories of progress the better ? gives us all hope and strategies to try.

SAA, glad your DS is getting better. We had the same thing ? long naps at points without resettling (on Sunday I woke him after 2.5 hours at lunchtime!). There were some long sleeps at night towards the end of his cold and I hoped it might help him develop better habits. Sadly not.

Curly, sending more unmumsnetty hugs (thanks for the explanation, IC) It?s horrible when you get mad with them, isn?t it ? I was like that with DS tonight when he wouldn?t stay still for me to get him dressed at bedtime.

I know Moxie says that it?s often when you think you really simply cannot carry on that things suddenly seem to turn a corner. I hope that?s the case for you.

In the meantime, remind yourself that it will improve - if only because she's exhausted. It's extra horrible when you're on your own, isn't it?

Kaymer, I lost all my baby weight when DS would only sleep in the sling ? but put half of it back once he started taking naps at home!

Well, we did have a 3 hour stand-a-thon in the end, but when I woke this morning I was amazed to find DS still in his cot - he had stayed asleep (with exhaustion, I guess). So it was technically 'through the night' with 6.5 hours straight sleep.

It was nice for me to be able to sleep for 5.5 hours without being woken, but I wish I'd got to bed sooner as I could have had even more!

I wish they had a little light or signal that they could use to alert you to when they are going to do long sleeps at night or in the day. That way you could get things done or maximise your own sleep. But then I wish they had little signal lights for lots of things. Evolution hasnt caught up yet! Angeldog it's precisely because you have a waking baby that people would buy it- you wouldn't be selling some unattainable theory that babies should sleep through from 8 weeks... And if you wrote it under your MN nickname, then noone IRL would know it was you!

PDog good news on a decentish night. I frequently feel guilty that I didn't go in sooner, or kick myself for going in too soon. You can't win.

Curly so sorry you re having such a rubbish time. Your night sounds awful awful. Must be developmental. Can she crawl yet? Everytime I go into DS I find him rocking on all fours desperately trying to propel himself forward. I saw your other thread too and mug sympathy on it causing problems with your DH. I've lost count on the number of times we've argued over DS' sleep, and we don't usually argue. It's horrible when you feel so tired on top of that, all you want is support.

Our night was pretty ropey. The 10 o'clock difficult wake is becoming something of a habit. I don't really understand it. He never woke at that time before he was ill. Hope others had better nights, especially Curly.

Much love to all, sounds like everyone's LO's are being - um - trying - at the moment.

Two awakenings again here, but one was an hour and three attempts resettle, so we're far from being out of the woods when it comes to better sleep.... But not too bad, I'm not complaining.

ADog, it's not the good players who make the best coaches, you know!! Distilling all your sleep and nap knowledge would be greatly welcomed by the sleep deprivation community of mums, I reckon!

Thanks for all your support ladies it makes me feel better to be able to come on here and not only moan, but to get tips on how I might just be able to get through it, or reasons for it!

I agree that you really should write that book AD your info has been second-to-none and much more helpful than any book I've read yet!
Sorry you had a 3hr stand-off - I can honestly say I know how you feel. At least you got a good stretch afterwards though eh?

IC it sounds like your DD is probably the most settled at the moment. Sorry, hope I don't jinx that for you...

SAA sorry to hear you are now having an additional wake-up. Illness is always the culprit isn't it, for mucking things up. Hopefully it will settle soon.

PDog my DD manages to bang her head on the cot bars quite a lot. Don't feel too bad, it's impossible to know when to go in and when not to!

Well our night wasn't great, but I handled it a bit better I think . Trouble is, I took myself to bed at 9pm thinking I could get a decent few hours in before the 3hr+ stand-off, but Missy had other ideas and woke at 9.40! Took ages to get her settled, even at that hour so brought her in bed with me at 11pm (after several attempts at settling) where she slept until 3am. Fed her in my bed (haven't done that in ages) as I figured it might help her get back to sleep easier...wrong! She spent the next hour or so poking, prodding, squirming, kicking until I thought that I may as well take her back to her room as it clearly wasn't helping having her in with me.

Managed to settle her about 5am and she slept until 8am. All in all not so bad as I felt more relaxed about it and I guess she didn't pick up on my tension. I didn't leave her to cry at any point either as it clearly doesn't work while she is having this developmental spurt (it has worked before) which made it seem less stressy.
TTSP, TTSP, TTSP!!!!!

Oh, that's annoying when they do that, isn't it curly?

I've posted an idea on your thread, btw...

Here's hoping for a good night for all of us...

Thanks IC I have replied on there! It's a nice idea but wouldn't work as there's no room!

Let's hope we all have a good night tonight

OH wow, poor you Curly. Sounds hard hard hard. Well I'm not having trouble with dd staying awake most nights - just keeping her asleep! Last night I went off for an early one too, but she woke at 10, 11, 12 and then 2, 4, 6 and up for the day at 7.15 (that bit wasn't too bad). So by going to bed early I got woken up 6 times! gah!
Better to stay awake until midnight...?
On the plus side she's now going to sleep off the boob with very little fuss (at nap time and when I put her down the first time at night). She makes dives for it in her half-sleep but seems to accept that it's been put away.
DH has been rocking her back to sleep when she wakes before our bedtime too, which she's agreeable to. Bliss!! get to eat dinner, drink a cup of tea and watch some crap telly, all without interruption.
Once we're settled with that routine he's going to pick up one or two of the night-time wakes and see whether he can get her to sleep without milk. He's had success with that before but we never do it consistently because it takes longer for her to get to sleep so I end up getting annoyed and wide awake. Silly me.

Yes please, Angeldog. Write that book! I will buy it, definitely.

Curly, glad you've seen some improvement. I think you're right on being relaxed - which is not easy at 4am when you've been up for ages. I read one study that concluded that one of the most significant factors for how a baby slept was the mother's 'emotional availability' at bedtime, ie how stressed (or not) she was. My DS gets more sensitive to my moods the older he gets.

Kaymer, sounds like you're having some progress. :)

I'm reading the book Three in a Bed by Deborah Jackson, about co-sleeping and it makes me feel so warm and sentimental that I forgive DS all his wakings. I bet I'll change my mind at 3am though!

We had a good night last night - he only woke me once (although it was a 5.30am start).

Ugh, curly, sorry you're having such a rotten time of it sleepwise.... ah well, I guess it was worth suggesting, although I imagine you would have already done something similar if you had the available logistics...

You win some, you lose some, kaymer...! It's always worth extracting some positives from what was otherwise a tricky night...

I know what you mean about the co-sleeping, ADog...I love the idea of it, but I'm a rubbish co-sleeper and so, generally, is DD so it's never been much of a solution for us.

Yesterday DD fell asleep on my lap during a feed - twice. I didn't have the heart to wake her, so left her there. Consequently she ended up having three short naps rather than two longer ones (or one long and one short). Although the total amount of sleep wasn't much less, she was definitely overtired at bedtime and woke half an hour after she first went down (luckily, only needed a short cuddle to resettle her). In the end, she only woke me once for a feed before 06.00, which is good going. She woke at one other point, but had resettled herself before I even got to our bedroom door.

Mind you, my insomnia's back at the moment. REALLY annoying as DD's sleep is pretty good. I think part of the problem is her waking pattern is slightly predictable and slightly random, so my own waking pattern is out of step and I end up lying awake waiting for DD to call out (even though I'm trying to relax enough to go back to sleep), sometimes for an hour or more. Which means after her feed I'm often so awake it takes ages to get back to sleep again...and then DD wakes up for the second time...

I think to myself, curly and co would give their right arm for a night like this and here I am bliddy well awake... grrrr....!

Have a good weekend, everyone!!

Sorry to hear about your insomnia, IC. It's miserable being up unnecessarily in the night. I used to get up and do the ironing as I found it relaxing.

On the co-sleeping thing, I do think it suits some babies better - I suspect it works best for tension increasers.

Curly, can't remember whether I've suggested this before, but do you massage your DD? I doubt very much it's a magic solution (!) but I wondered whether it might help her relax as much as she's able to.

DS had an odd hour and a half yesterday evening when he wouldn't settle for more than 5-10 mins, but wasn't awake & wanting to play either. I wonder whether it was the peppers he ate at dinner - my mum is intolerant to them.

Hello. I love this thread. I have a 4 month old who is driving me mad with his sleep habtis!

Used to sleep with only 2 wakenings to BF each night and right back to sleep. Now.......every 2 hours or so and really difficult to settle back down. I put him back in cot and think he's gone off and then bang - crying again. Last night I had this from 1.30 to 4.30 am. I kept feeding him to get him off to sleep but am sure he couldn't be hungry.

Nighttimes are really hell tbh but reading this thread makes me feel a little bit better.

Yes, the 4 month regression is hideous, fifitot. We started co-sleeping around that age - I couldn't put DS down without waking him up. Hope things improve for you.

IC I feel your insomnia pain! Last night dd had the best night in a month - only two wake ups. So I woke up at 4.30am expecting to feed her - and didn't get back to sleep for the rest of the night.
Shattered now! oh dear.

At least she is very charming during the day .

PS hi fifitot. My baby started doing the same a bit later, at 5.5. months. I fell into the habit of feeding her all the time to get her to sleep. I'm not sure it was the best thing to do - though given the time again I may do the same thing anyway as in the middle of the night it all becomes about doing ANYTHING to get the little blighter to sleep.

Still, if you can manage to follow some of Angeldog's advice and practice pulling off the nipple before your lo is asleep sometimes, you may save yourself some trouble later....(or not - who really knows )

Thanks Kaymer.

I am so knackered today. He woke for a feed at 10.30, 1.30 and 4.30 which on paper not so bad but for the 4.30 feed I couldn't settle him in his cot until 5.50! Then DD got up at 6! Luckily DH took her downstairs to give her breakfast so I got another 2 hours sleep.

I am averaging just about 4 hours sleep a night I have worked out and even then it's broken.

The 3 hourly gaps he had last night might be manageable if he would go down easily afterwards. If I could push them forward to 2.30 and 5.30......

ZZZZZZZZZZzzz

Hi fifitot! Seem to remember that was the age when the sleep got really crappy with DD. Feed to sleep is the quickest way to get them back, no doubt, but it's a mixed blessing if they can't get themselves to sleep without a feed.... Good luck!

Hey, kaymer - thanks for the solidarity, poor you!

Last night was a definite step backwards. Four wakings, 23.15, 01.15, 02.15, 03.15 and the last took more than an hour and a few attempts to get DD resettled. At least she then slept in until 08.00. Wish I had! I was awake an hour earlier than that.
The teenager next door decided to put his telly on a bit too loudly at 03.30 too, which didn't help matters.
Pah.
Hopefully it's just a blip. Not sure what it was caused by. DD's naps were okay, she doesn't appear to be sickening for anything, I don't think she had indigestion. Could be teeth, I s'pose, but she didn't appear to be in discomfort, just restless.

As always with these set-backs, I hope we're not sliding back down the slippery slope again....

Here's to a restful night for all...

Hello all. Sorry to hear about some rough nights. IC, yours sounded particularly horrible.

I'm feeling grumpy this morning so forgive me for a little whinge.

For the last 3 evenings DS has had a period for about 1-1.5 hours where he'd wake 5 mins after being put down, over and over again. Lying down with him helped but I don't like leaving him on his own in bed as the room isn't properly babyproofed, and I was never ready for bed myself. We've had several 5 / 5.30am starts too - ugh.

After this he was shattered and slept for 2.5 hours at lunchtime yesterday. But last night he was up for at least 1.5 hours, maybe 2, and then up again a second time for I don't know how long. We woke an hour and a half late this morning, which is always for me as it messes up the day's naps which can get in the way of a sensible bedtime.

I've decided to try 'proper' co-sleeping ie him cuddled up to me rather than on a mattress next to me, to see if it helps. On the plus side, he cries less in the night, I can often get him off again quickly by patting and I don't wake up so much. On the downside it's a bit of a squash (single mattress!), I get backache and he's more disturbed by me coughing etc.

He's 46 weeks now so in theory it could be the 46 week spurt (he was 2 weeks early so would probably hit the spurt around 48 weeks). He's getting another cold though, and his teeth still haven't come through but are definitely moving in that direction.

I'm fed up too with constantly expressing - I'm back to work next week (only 1 day a week for a couple of months, though) so I'm trying to build up a freezer stash of milk, but I hate doing it.

Oh, ADog, it's not like you to be so down - but I'm not surprised given the crappiness of your nights lately.
Yes, I find co-sleeping tough for the same reasons you do - plus I often need to get up to pee and it can be tricky (although possible) to do that without waking up DD...
Teething, cold, developmental leap - your poor DS has got it all going on at the moment, hasn't he?
And yes, expressing is a total drear, isn't it? I remember doing that when trying to get DD into breastfeeding in the weeks after she was born (she wouldn't latch or suckle to start with). It was definitely worth the effort, but yes, all the pumping was a PITA.
Sending you loads of - of the unmumsnetty variety, of course.

Things were back on track for us last night. DD went down straight away at bedtime and only woke twice, going back into her cot without a fuss after a feed in both cases. It took her a while to get back to sleep after the second judging by how much she was fidgeting, but she got there in the end - and didn't need me to help, which was good. So, yes, Casa IC was more slumberous last night. My sleep still isn't brilliant, but it was enough.

Here's hoping everyone else is having a better time of it...

Oh dear! Things aren't looking great are they?

AD sorry to hear you are fed up - I can certainly sympathise with you there. When you have a run of bad nights, it really does start to get to you in the end...

IC sounds like you had a good night last night - long may it continue!!

Awww, Fifitot your nights sounds very broken indeed. I remember when my DD was that age and it was really tough.

Well, no improvement for us yet I am sorry to say... DD is still having very unsettled nights, and is now disturbing at least twice between her bedtime and ours. The long re-settles have been driving me and DH to distraction, so now I have taken to brining her into our bed if she wont settle (DH stays too if it's the w/e, but if he needs to get up at 5am for work, he decamps to the spare room - which I don't like, but understand all the same). SHe is often just as fidgetty when she is in our bed, but at least I am warm and relatively comfy and don't have to keep getting in and out of bed. It feels like I get more sleep, even tho I am not sure that I actually do!

Last night she was awake and poking and , prodding me, pulling my hair, flapping her arms about etc between 4 and 5am (luckily DH was in the spare room) and she eventually then slept until 7.15, when I managed to feed her and get her back off for another hour (a bit more blissful snoozing for me!). It's kinda working, but I really would prefer her to be sleeping in her cot.

DH is now worried that when this 'phase' passes, she will be too used to coming into our bed - ladies, what do you think? Are we going to make it harder for ourselves in the long run?