Update from MNHQ addressing the recent images posted on the site

[JustineMumsnet]

Hi all,
There have been a number of threads discussing what happened re the posting of CSA images on site and so I want to be absolutely clear: we would never seek to shut down reasonable criticism and we're taking on board all the feedback and will be carefully considering how we can improve our procedures and moderation to prevent this happening again.

As a temporary measure, we have suspended all image posting and will soon be implementing AI filters to flag illegal/disturbing images before they appear on the site. We’re also liaising with external specialists to see if there are any further tools we can employ to help us prevent this from happening again in the future. We reported it to the police first thing the morning after the attack and we have a follow up meeting with them tomorrow.

It's also pretty clear from what we can see behind the scenes that there is an ongoing, coordinated effort from trolls to further inflame these discussions, and cause as much disruption as possible. We are taking steps to remove bad faith actors, but we know this can be frustrating for those who just want to express your views about what happened. If you come across any posts that seem designed to stir up more conflict rather than contribute constructively, please do report them - your reports really help us to act swiftly. Many thanks for your patience while we work to sort this out.

Thanks for the response.

There’s no attempt to silence anyone. There is an effort to delete and ban trolls who are hopefully just opportunistic and not actually linked to whoever posted those images.

But being insulting achieves nothing. It's totally valid to ask about changes, and criticise what was in place, but personal remarks aren't really in the spirit if improvement. Which is what we want. And are likely to result in fewer updates.

I would prefer a system where photos were oked by a moderator before they went up,it's not like that many photos go up.and someone should be paid for that job.it just sounds too easy for it to happen again and that should never happen.an ai filter doesn't sound enough.i dont really want to leave mumsnet but have stopped using it at night now.most of all I hope they have caught the perpetrator and the 7 hours delay in calling the police didn't prevent this happening.

Yes I think you are right.

@JustineMumsnet is there a way to limit new posters as to what they can post for example only one post a day. Maybe a stupid question - I’m not very technical so don’t know if possible.

There is no support for ad hominem attacks here.

But, this is a hugely important matter, and MN users are entitled to seek answers - hence MNHQ rightly starting this thread.

It's fair enough that people ask questions. Some people are taking the piss out of Justine, mocking photos, calling her Big Jussers. How is that helpful to anyone?

Probably to create shock and revulsion.
Mumsnet is a parenting site, {mainly} and people will naturally be revolted and horrified at illegal images of children being sexually abused.

Conjecture, but there are various groups who dislike Mumsnet but I'm not saying that these are guilty of posting the illegal images.

I'm very grateful I didn't see them that night, but I have seen other inappropriate stuff posted {Probably by men out to ''shock''}

There is now a BBC news story and a PH thread on this.

Fully agree re answers and with no ad hominems, that's what I said....

That’s wholly unacceptable behaviour.

Sorry, I'm not Justine but have something to add. I should think limiting new posters is possible but not sure how much it would help because anyone wanting to post illegal photos would just have to join MN and wait a bit before going ahead.
My feeling is that the urgent thing is getting the AI filter up to isolate any photos or links to photos that look remotely dodgy and immediately prevent the poster posting again until the suspect photo has been visually checked by a human being. The problem with waiting for a certain number of users to report them is that they will have to look at the photos first, then the moderator will need to look too, which is distressing and also risks someone equally dodgy taking a screenshot and sharing it.

I'm grateful not to have seen the images. I'd like to understand what Nightwatch is, as I hadn't come across it before.

The Night Watch is a team of volunteers who take over from the paid moderators at some point during the late evening, whereupon the reports generated by the report button cease to be monitored, until the mods return the next morning. Although, if a post is reported an unspecified number of times, it is apparently automatically hidden, even at night. If people wish to report a poster or thread at night, they are instructed to post on the Night Watch board, linking the relevant thread.

Just to add - because some people are expressing very strong feelings around what is a truly awful event for MN, does not mean that they are ‘bad actors’ wishing the downfall of MN. I think the anger and outrage stems more from the suspicion of many that MN isn’t willing to spend the money (of which there is an abundance) required to make the site the safe space all genuine users want it to be.

I was one who was quite critical yesterday, but it does appear that quite a bit is being done. I really feel for everyone at MN, this can't be a nice situation to deal with

I think the problem has grown, trolls feel emboldened so it snowballs. This changing names is too easy. User 123456 types always make me twitch.

They should use the suspensions faster.

I suspect the culprits know nights and weekends are a free for all, mods should be able to gag them faster and let the day crew sort it out.

What you can do about bored teenagers, disgruntled men and trolls, just keep stamping them out. It's a problem.

One forum I recall digital spy. I think there was a probation period.

I think this is the perfect solution. AI is easily tricked, I think all photos need to be checekd.

@spritsailking that's good in theory but then if (god forbid) something like this happened again, the mods have to see it.

It'll bugger up style and beauty though.

The best outcome is no one at mnhq or here sees or has to report CSA

The site is a chat site mostly so if AI tools etc can't stop them happening then just go to word based

Ok I quite like threads with harmless pics at times so no issue there, but really no one should be exposed to criminal CSA imagery on mn

That would mean a moderator would have to look at all the disturbing and illegal images. Automated filters are not perfect but they minimise the risk of inflicting such images on anyone.

I'm amazed that anyone would volunteer to work nights for free!

Yes it's not good that the mods have to see it, but mods can be trained and receive support. And there seems to be quite a few mners who are still struggling with what they saw. At least mners wouldn't see the child abuse if everything had to be approved.

Of course I can. It should never have happened and I feel very sorry for the NW and all the posters who saw the images. But remarks like

Surprised Big Justine hasn't posted in legal advice, they're always giving great advice on there ;)

and

Istg some people act as if Big Jussers is running it out of the basement of her ran-down house or something...

are not "ask(ing) what safeguards are being implemented so there can never be a repeat." They add absolutely eff all to the discussion and trivialises it. Smacks of someone who wants to be shitty for the sake of it.

Perhaps it would be better to focus on those posters asking legitimate questions in a civil manner, rather than focus on those who might seek to disrupt and/or hijack the thread.

I’m not certain that MNHQ needs anyone to advocate for them.

Just my suggestion, you understand.

I agree. Maybe no need for pics on this forum.