The For Sale/ Wanted boards - update from M Towers and post your ideas/thoughts here

[JustineMumsnet]

As you may know we have in mind a complete overhaul of the For sale/ wanted boards as they seem to be making many folks' lives (ours especially) a misery.

Clearly it makes sense for us to have classified ads - why not re-cycled used stuff? That should in theory be good for buyers and sellers alike (and it's very green too). But equally clearly, at the risk of understatement, it is not functioning well at the moment.

However, complete overhaul is going to have to wait a wee while as Tech's got quite a lot on... (We are hopefully bringing you improved local listings, blogs and more in the next few weeks and months).

In the meantime do give us your ideas for how you'd ultimately like to see For sale/ wanted working. (I know some of you have already posted some sensible (and not so sensible thoughts around and abou but we'd be super grateful if you'd re-post the best of them here so everyone can see, discuss and refine.)

So... what rules would be fair/enforcable and assist in the smooth working of the thing? (nb we are never going to enforce a no huns policy I'm afraid, so do be realistic - MN is for all parents even those with poor grammar and spelling.)

Should we re-house somewhere off Talk? And will it be used/useful if we do? Can we make it work on Talk if not? What would make it easier to use/ more functional?

Should we charge and if so how. What would you pay to use and how would you like to pay it?

Which other boards do this successfully and what are the best ideas/functionality should we pinch?

To ease the pain of waiting for overhaul, next week we will introduce a couple of quick fixes that might hopefully smooth the operation a little, namely we're going to insist that everyone who posts a for sale notice pays a CAT and we'll break down the boards into categories so things are more easily searchable.

In the meantime, please hang on in there and if it all gets too much there's always the hide thread/topic option .

Thanks for your input and your patience.

Peace and love,

Mumsnet Towers

'I think it's a bit silly to focus on who is selling tbh'

Don't agree

If, say, I was selling- lots of people on ehre know me, many have my addy, and know so much about my history and the unlikelihood of my disappearance that I hope at elast tehy'd feel safe (me used only as an example as dont really sell: seemed better than choosing random MN name tis all). Whereas someone with no traceable history or likelihood of return HAS to be far more of a risk, surely?

fosussing on who is selling is surely what you do every time you go shopping

that is whta brand recognition and reputation is all about

I echo Zippi.

Equally. When we come to mumsnet, rather than hunniboard.com or NetBums, it is because of the BRAND we know and love.

and this VS.

I know LIZS, It's bloody awful.
Thre has been a few disputes I've seen on the for sale boards which puts me off buying anything for more than a few quid.

Have just skim read your link, LIZS - blimey.

This is why I stick to old fashioned cheques etc.

This thread has made fascinating reading, my, how opinions differ!

Alot of the regulars (as they have been called) on for sale / wanted are basically way too intimdated to respond here (I believe) as they have been ridiculed constantly almost daily for weeks now on many threads (you know the main points - use of the word hun, pathetic spelling and grammar etc).

They would need to be very very thick skinned to post up on here and poss face great back lash.

This is a shame as MNHQ will get a biased view as for many mumsnetters the for sale boards / wanted boards are a place they like to post on alot and in which they have made alot of friends.

I found rosylillys comment really refreshing and rather an accurate take on the situ............................

I think alot of the buyers and sellers are doing it as a hobby and a way to interact which is just as valuable as the other sections.

I enjoy the diversity of mumsnet and would be disgusted if the buyers and sellers were excluded.

I enjoys glancing at the for sale titles on my way past, it feels like walking through a lively market place and I have bought a couple of things..........

However in light of all the scamming etc the classifieds clearly do need majorly overhauled and guidelines/possible fees set. I dont think there is one person that is debating this thankfully.

I really hope this thread is helpful in assisting MNHQ to change the classifieds for the collective benefit of mumsnet.

'a lot'.

TWO words. Not one.

Greeny if I see your name at the top of the boards and click, I expect to see something a little more edifying than that nitpickery

Unfortunately mumofdjandp, when sellers have made a point on here it's all too often been 'if you don't like it hide it' which isn't getting to the crux of the issue, most of the people posting suggestions are doing so to make the For Sale boards a place we can all use and benefit from.

If the sellers came along and suggested ways to improve rather than try to stake their claim on the boards and tell everyone they don't have to read them as if that were the answer then I very much doubt they would get a bad response, in fact I think the sellers that have posted with reasonable suggestions have been met with respect.

I use most boards on MN, including the wanted and sometimes the for sale boards.

I think all sellers should pay a one off or annual fee, dont agree with a high monthly fee or percentage, this is penalising sellers and would be hard to administer.

I also think that there should be selling rules, along the lines of other suggestions, eg using a clear title of the goods on offer, max of say 2/3 bumps in total, limit to number of items offered per seller, say max 2 ads per week.
Also agree with others about dividing up the for sale board into categories.

I think if there were stricter limits then the traders who are benefiting from MN would find it harder to sell, which ought to make for a nicer atmosphere on the f/s board, as well as making it easier to use for those it was designed for, eg mothers trying to sell/pass on used/unwanted things.

Hi. I don't really post very often but did try and sell a pram few days ago and to be honest got really fed up. I spent the time to email people with pictures and some people are so rude they don't even let you know they are not interested and people keep knocking the price down.. So I gave up and sold it on ebay today! Much easier and less hassle and you know exactly where you stand.

I think if you do introduce a new board then it should be a board where you post a message with item for sale and have to give an email address to reply. I don't initially think you should charge but if you do then I don't think it's a bad thing but a charge of around £3 is reasonable, not sure how you would pay as I don't have paypal, maybe debit card?

These are just my opinions.

Nikki

and just to add I don't think I would buy off this site but another site that I go on where you read the message and reply by email I probably would be more inclined to buy off of.

I haven't read all the posts on here but FGS are we not mean't to be adults? ( A lot) I sometimes wonder if people don't have anything better to do with their day.

oh and I think that the picturetrail things should be banned, they smack of traders to me.

How about for sale ads with a short "shelf-life" which applies to all of the adverts posted - ok it occurs to me that we are possibly talking along the lines of ebay (I have bought a couple of things on there but I wouldn't claim to know it well) but the gist is that there should be a 'countdown timer' on each advert, through 48 hours or so, and whilst I know we are not doing 'auction' style selling, there is the buy-it-now idea and after the set time the ad is taken off whether the item sold or not. Obviously if the item is sold then the advert is removed as soon as the seller accepts the buyer's offer. And yes, put them on a dedicated board with a heading in the list below "talk", rather than on the active convos.
As far as 'wanted' boards go, I am not saying that I'm going to launch a campaign to keep them - as I've only ever responded to one or two; only saying that I'm of the opinion that they should be 'visible', down to the fact that I think very few of us would go hunting for them on a regular basis. Perhaps place them in a separate column with the existing 'hide' facility for those who don't want to see them. I just think that to keep the "spirit of mumsnet" that we all value so much, it should remain, on the grounds that I mentioned in my post yesterday.

Hmm, when I go into a shop I buy something more because I like it and it meets my needs, not principally because of its brand. Call it strange but there you go.

As for asking sellers to post on other threads for six months before they are allowed to sell, well, a good point was made further down by someone else: if you force sellers to contribute to discussions there's the possibilty someone will sulk and write utter nonsense or worse. Will that do mumsnet any good? And are you proposing they use the same name to post on discussions and for sale threads? If so, I see a possible flaw.

I were ever to sell on the for sale board, I'd change my name in my guise as seller, and revert to tigermoth when I was discussing anything elsewhere. Why? Let's say over the course of a year I sell 30 small bits and pieces on the for sale boards to 30 different mumsnetters. As a responsible seller I put my RL postal address on each parcel (possibly I'd need to tell the buyer my RL name and email address as well). So, that means 30 mumsnetters will know my real life details. I'd find that quite off-putting if I wanted to bear my soul on a discussion thread tbh. For me, one of mumsnet's strengths is the fact you can be anonymous.

So, I change my name to 'hardtrader' but no buyer can trace me via mumsnet discussions. So it appears buyers will will naturally mistrust me as a newbie.

However as a suggestion, it would help if I had a seller profile and if MN could confirm that 'hardtrader' has in fact posted 'x' number of times and been a member for 'x' years while keeping my 'tigermoth' identity secret.

I think some sort of seller profile is a good idea, but not the same as a normal mumsnet profile. It would also help in cases where mumsnetters who both discuss and sell change names frequently.

I am not sure why concentrating on the integrity of what is being sold is more difficult for MN to administer than concentrating on the integrity of the seller. MN already state they are not liable for goods sold.

How about if sellers fill in a short item description form with obligatory form fields? If they leave the form fields blank they cannot sell their item.

Buyers then give feedback by looking at the form, rating how accurate the description is as well as any other comments they have.

Nothing complicated on the form - just if item is new/nearly new/used/needs some repair, for instance.

If a seller consistently picks up bad buyer feedback for wrongly stating the condition of items, then MNHQ at their discretion could ban that person from selling.

Anyway that's my 2ps worth. I'm not totally anti the idea of mumsnet considering asking sellers to contribute to other threads, but think sellers right to change names when they sell should be respected.

tigermoth for 2p that is a huge amount of common sense You should put your rates up!

I like to look at the picture trails - I like to see what I'm buying ... and I use it myself when I'm selling my stuff - I think it's a useful selling tool.

I also like tigermoths's idea of having a seller profile which is in some way separated from my regular MN profile ... however, I also take the view that by posting on here you are never totally anonymous - which it pays to remember when posting, whether it's on the for sale boards or elsewhere.

At the end of the day we're all Mumsnetters and i think thats all that should matter

I post all over (inc classifieds) and i'm sure most of you have no idea who i am, but that doesn't make me a non regularor a hun

tigermoth, great idea about the seller profile, so buyers know they have been around even if using another name.

I post on various threads including for sale and wanted, have sold things and therefore some mners are aware of my email and where I live.....it doesn't bother me. the things I sell or have sold have been good condition, no scaming and my views have all been those that I would say to a friend or someone down the street if I had to, i don't really take this annonymous thing .

I hope mumsnet is also going to address the problem of people behaving like this:

By Greensleeves on Fri 25-Jan-08 18:07:09
'a lot'.

TWO words. Not one.

Who do these people think they are, very rude IMO.

I think someone should also start a thread on this topic.

Also have the people that complain about picture trails ever sold anything on mumsnet?

If you try to sell anything without one you get 50 people asking you to send photos to them, which in turn bumps the thread 50 times, another of the things people are complaining about.
Can I ask who would buy something without a photo? If you buy from the internet you look at a photo before you buy, in a shop you look at the item before you buy, people do not have time to send 50 individual emails to people, when it can be done so easily with a picture trail.

I also think this is a valid point, if you do not know how for sale works, how can you possibly comment.

lol at alot

i guess if you post on the other mn boards u get to know when people are having a tic rise

agree about the photos tho

I do post on the other boards, but thankfully I have not come across someone behaving in this manner.