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Smacking 'does no harm if a child feels loved': do you agree?

524 replies

HelenMumsnet · 18/04/2013 21:30

Hello.

We're wondering how you feel about new research that suggests smacking does children no harm as long as they know it is for the right reasons and feel loved.

The publication of this study - which focused on teenagers, it must be said - is causing quite a stir, with, according to the Telegraph, 'parenting groups and charities [reacting] angrily to the findings, [and] maintaining that a child can suffer long term damage from physical discipline'.

In Britain, parents are not banned from smacking their children but it is illegal to inflict injuries causing more than a temporary reddening of the skin.

So, do you agree that smacking is fine, as long as it's tempered with a backdrop of love and affection? Or do you think that smacking is never the answer? Please do tell.

OP posts:
swallowedAfly · 19/04/2013 15:44

willowberry that made a lot of sense to me. all children are different and all situations are different.

bored of the idea that if you smack you don't use any other parenting skills whatsoever and obviously smack all the time. the smack may have been used when all other things failed or when there wasn't time/energy/whatever for the other strategies.

also bored of the talk of 'hurting' a child. i don't think i ever hurt ds. it wasn't about pain. he is a lover of having his bum smacked when playing (please don't slaughter me for that - talking about tickling, swinging, messing around play here not anything dodgy) and his bottom has been smacked harder in play to giggling delight than it was ever smacked as a telling off. for me it was that we both understood because of the extreme rarity of it's use that a smack was the absolute end of the line and proof that he had gone really, way, way too far.

in the same way when i was teaching teenagers i was not a shouter so if ever i was actually forced to raise my voice everyone knew a line had been crossed and was highly responsive.

JugglingFromHereToThere · 19/04/2013 15:45

I think smacking is a bad idea and practice. But I'd keep the law where it is at the moment as many otherwise good parents have smacked a child occasionally.
I think there are lots of better and more effective ways of raising and disciplining your child - mainly talking it through and consequences.

WoTmania · 19/04/2013 15:53

I'm rather bored of the idea that if you don't smack you're some lentilweaver who had 20 minute conversations pleading with your feral children to put their shoes on/stop hitting the cat etc

I'm curious SAF how your DS differentiates between a playing smack and a 'told off' smack? Presumably tone of voice and manner etc in which case why not just use the tone of voice without the hitting smacking

PrivateNightmare · 19/04/2013 15:53

i'm always totally shocked when i hear people admitting to using violence to punish their children. i can't even begin to understand a position like that.
i'd also like to point out to some people on this thread that discipline and punishment are not the same thing at all. my DD is no stranger to discipline but has NEVER been punished.

chocoholic05 · 19/04/2013 15:56

I don't smack my children. I was smacked as a child and so was my dh. My parents now say they regret it. Also my dad said to my dh about four years ago when ds1 was about 3 and dh threatened to smack him if he did somethimg again, "take it from the voice of experience smacking never ever works and is never the answer." Dh didn't smack him by the way. However my fil has smacked ds1 aged 7 in the past totally against our wishesShock he did it at a day out at a farm during February half term. After he'd done it pil commented that he'd been asking for that all morning. Really? I don't recall my ds actually asking to be smacked although he had been playing up something terrible! Angry

Wishiwasanheiress · 19/04/2013 16:00

I will use a smack if I deem it required. It's my choice. I was on occaision smacked and I was/am very loved. I'm confident of that so I agree with the title. It's uber last resort. I feel I use it responsibly as possible because of how I was treated. Maybe I'm lucky that way.

I don't agree with smacking the day lights out of people or bullying. I have never seen any smack that I had as either.

SirBoobAlot · 19/04/2013 16:03

You may be hitting your children because you feel you are helping them.

However, the message you are sending your children is an entirely different one.

Ironic how some people have said they smack because children can't understand danger / something they have done wrong, and yet expect them to understand that they are being hurt with love.

THAT is seriously fucked up.

And as for ''I was smacked, and I am fine'' - well, firstly I don't agree you are. But mainly... You are 'fine'. I have a personality disorder, issues with relationships and boundaries, and a hell of a lot of other issues. Your child may grow up to be like you. Or they may grow up to be like me, and my other friends with PDs who suffered at various levels with their parents, and are struggling with the consequences years on.

TheSmallClanger · 19/04/2013 16:06

My parents smacked me and it was not part of "warm, loving" parenting. My mother especially used witholding of affection from me, with calculated smacking a part of that. She was also strict, which I understand, but inconsistent with boundaries, which I don't.

Recently, we have talked about this as adults, and she has admitted that she was too strict with me about things which did not matter. She is unrepentant about the smacking, and claims she only ever did it two or three times, which I know is not true.

PrivateNightmare · 19/04/2013 16:14

well said, SirBoobAlot. i was smacked as a child and like TheSmallClanger, my mum now says it was only a couple of times but it was regular, unpredictable (for me) and went on repeatedly until i was about 13. i now have serious mental health issues. those of you who beat your children - they may be ok, but they may be damaged in ways you and they will not be aware of for many years.

satyricon · 19/04/2013 16:14

"And as for ''I was smacked, and I am fine'' - well, firstly I don't agree you are."

Hey, no offence, but please don't transfer personal experiences to others. It's a) rude and b) ignorant.

vixsatis · 19/04/2013 16:17

The arbitrary yelling and the threat of being hit with the big white stick kept behind the wardrobe did at least as much harm as the actual smacking.

I have a pretty distant relationship with my mother, funnily enough.

Smacking is never right. I know this in part from the one occasion when I nearly did it: I had lost control of the situation and my temper. It solves nothing; it teaches nothing good; it's abuse of a pretty unpleasant kind.

AnnieLobeseder · 19/04/2013 16:18

How lovely the view must be from your high horse, PrivateNightmare. Hmm

Everyone who has admitted to smacking has also admitted that aren't proud and that it's a last resort/loss of control. But judge away, please.

PiratePanda · 19/04/2013 16:18

I was smacked by my parents and I knew they loved me. I have always and still have a great relationship with them. That being said, I still don't think it's right to smack children and I wouldn't smack my own, except in the direst of life-threatening circumstances (deliberately running out into the road for example).

sassy34264 · 19/04/2013 16:25

Can I just ask a question, to those who have said they have had a bad experience from being smacked as a child?

If smacking was illegal, do you think your parents would have done it anyway? Or do you think you would have been verbally and emotionally abused instead? Or do you think, they would have just looked for alternative reasonable ways of discipline?

Genuine question, that i am interested in knowing the answer to. Feel free to ignore.

PrivateNightmare · 19/04/2013 16:26

no high horse, AnnieLobeseder. what did i post that made you feel judged?

sassy34264 · 19/04/2013 16:28

I was smacked as a child. Not very often and only once by my dad.

I don't feel like it affected me. In the sense that i am not deeply hurt, nor do i have a distant relationship with my parents, and i didn't feel unloved etc

NorthernLurker · 19/04/2013 16:33

'For everyone out there who has never smacked and their children are polite and well behaved-fantastic good for you. But not all children are so receptive to the same forms of discipline'

This is a very sensible comment. I have one child I honestly can't remember ever smacking. Generally it was possible to discipline her without a smack. I have two who I know I have smacked. Very different children, very different dynamics.

If we're being honest those who would describe themselves as 'non-smackers' should add a qualifying 'yet' and those who have smacked should add 'so far'.

Whilst I'm addressing the sanctimonious brigade may I add that I haven't hit my children. I haven't slapped their heads or faces or indeed any body part except for a flat palmed smack on the bottom. When people get all humphy about 'hitting' children you're just confusing the issue.

Piemother · 19/04/2013 16:38

my eldest is 3.6. my youngest is 5 month so its not like i haven't had my moments with them lately. dd1 has really pushed my buttons in the last few months and i've really yelled at her but i've never smacked her.
i want my daughter's memeories of childhood to be that the worst things that ever happened were that mummy shouted now and then and that very occasionally they were put to bed early for being a pain.

exh used to say he was open minded about smacking then he saw (long story) what frequent smacking really looked like in terms of parenting and general family dynamics, was duly horrified and is now resolute this wont be happening with our dds. To his credit.

tak1ngchances · 19/04/2013 16:43

This is always going to be an emotive topic.

I was smacked, and I remember very clearly the times when it was done in a rage. I will never, ever forgive my father for those times. It irrevocably damaged our relationship. He doesn't know that. I bet if I told him now he would deny all knowledge and try and pass things off.

There is no excuse for violence. Raising your hand to another person is violent. Raising your hand to a child is appalling violence because a) they trust you, you are their whole world and b) they cannot fight back.

PrivateNightmare · 19/04/2013 16:47

those of you who smack your children - how do you feel about other people smacking your children? teachers for instance?

working9while5 · 19/04/2013 16:49

I think this discussion is really about the way we view strong human emotions, and the idea of "destructive normality" e.g. that the "normal" human experience is free of suffering, people are in control and act reasonably at all times, their actions are commensurate with their beliefs etc.

It saddens me when you read people who describe their mothers/fathers/carers as "generally awesome" and then say that the few times they lost control were unacceptable. So, you got hit by someone who had lost control for a second. Someone who hugged you every time you cried, who made sure you ate and slept regularly, who lay at night awake worrying about you, who shared their thoughts, interests and experiences with you, who read to you, who told you they loved you, who took an interest in your friends and schooling, who considered your education and spiritual welfare as serious matters, who taught you how to wash and dress yourself and tidy up your environment, who laughed with you and worried when you were sad, who generally gave you a childhood of routine and predictability... but...had very rare moments in which they behaved in ways they were not proud of?

So you hated them at that moment. So you can remember these moments with bitterness.

My question here is... so what? Really, so what? If the experience of being smacked taught you that an adult who was generally loving, predictable and kind could lose control on occasion and experience fear/anger/rage etc, what's the issue? Do people really believe that any parent can raise a healthy child without sometimes losing control? Perhaps they won't hit, but who will parent without saying something or acting in a way that is not in line with their values at some point? Or alternatively, who believes you can parent the way you believe is best and not have that style inadvertently impact upon your children in negative ways?

It's called humanity, people. I think in reality very, very few people in this culture at this point in time either want to smack or believe it is okay. Some of them may sometimes lose control. I did once. My son (3) randomly turned around and pushed his baby brother's highchair over with force, hitting his brother (9 months) with force in the head. I reacted before I even realised. I was literally going to pick up the baby with one hand and I slapped him on the bum with the other hand. I didn't wallop him, but was it a considered decision that I can defend? Erm, no. Did I believe it would be teaching him a lesson... or that it was a good idea? No, again. I got a tremendous fright and I also felt angry. It's not supportable but it was human. I apologised and we cried together for a few minutes, all of us, and then we got on with the day.

The important thing is that you return to your values, time and time again, not that occasionally you may find yourself deviating from them.

Flibbertyjibbet · 19/04/2013 16:50

'If we're being honest those who would describe themselves as 'non-smackers' should add a qualifying 'yet' '

I will add no such word. I have never hit, smacked, slapped or given any other kind of physical punishment to my children and I never will.

I don't spend hours negotiating with them, we have and always have had firm boundaries and other forms of punishment and they work.

And to the person who asked if our parents would still have done it had it been illegal? I don't think my parents would have. But when I was small, it was perfectly acceptable and so much so, that you would see children having their legs slapped etc in the street if they were misbehaving when with their parents. It was just the norm. Some people were affected by it later in life (me), some people aren't. Why take the risk that your child is one of the ones who will be affected.

garlicyoni · 19/04/2013 16:50

Leaving my personal experience out of it, I simply can't understand how it's okay to do to a child, what would be assault if you did it to an adult.

Saying it's only OK if you do it to your children is the same as saying it's all right to beat your wife.

I agree with posters who've said it's unhelpful to conduct the study on teenagers. Teenagers are still children, with limited capacity to dispute their parents' authority (hence why they keep trying to!)

Flibbertyjibbet · 19/04/2013 16:51

Oh and my children are 7 and 8 so if I was going to smack them, going off what other people say here as it being a last resort or a parent losing it etc etc, I am sure I'd have done it by now.

garlicyoni · 19/04/2013 16:52

'If we're being honest those who would describe themselves as 'non-smackers' should add a qualifying 'yet' '

What a disgusting assumption. By contrast, I can add a qualifying "now" - and am prouder of my choice not to emulate my parents than anyone could be of choosing to excuse violence against children.